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Author Topic: Mathematics Help Thread  (Read 228665 times)

ZetaX

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Re: Mathematics Help Thread
« Reply #1515 on: April 20, 2014, 12:59:07 pm »

You can use Stirling's formula to get a good approximation of x=n! by sqrt(2 pi n) (n/e)^n. Then you need to solve for n. You can do this by Newton's algorithm or any other way to find zeros of analytic functions. Taking the logarithm first and observing that ln(x)=ln(n!) is about n ln(n) - n might simplify it a bit, at the cost of accuracy.
After that, you just need to find the exact n where you get bigger than x by searching around the solution you got.

Generally, if your function is monotonous, then you only need to find integers M,N with M < x < N and then use binary search in [M,N].
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Pnx

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Re: Mathematics Help Thread
« Reply #1516 on: April 20, 2014, 01:28:43 pm »

I see I've managed to ask one of those questions that's much harder to answer than I thought it was.  :P
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Pnx

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Re: Mathematics Help Thread
« Reply #1517 on: April 21, 2014, 12:45:59 am »

Ok, so I've got the sum of (2/3*5) + (2/7*7) + (2/11*9) . . . Which I wrote as 2/(5k+3)(2k+5) for k=0 to infinity.

I'm pretty sure it converges on 1/4 or something like that, but I'm having trouble getting that answer. Can someone help?

EDIT: Oh, and before I got bed I've got the sum of k1/2ln(2k) / (k3-4). Don't need the sum, just need to know convergence/divergence. Pretty sure it converges but I can't find a test that works.
« Last Edit: April 21, 2014, 01:31:27 am by Pnx »
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da_nang

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Re: Mathematics Help Thread
« Reply #1518 on: April 21, 2014, 05:32:23 am »

Ok, so I've got the sum of (2/3*5) + (2/7*7) + (2/11*9) . . . Which I wrote as 2/(5k+3)(2k+5) for k=0 to infinity.

I'm pretty sure it converges on 1/4 or something like that, but I'm having trouble getting that answer. Can someone help?

EDIT: Oh, and before I got bed I've got the sum of k1/2ln(2k) / (k3-4). Don't need the sum, just need to know convergence/divergence. Pretty sure it converges but I can't find a test that works.
Well, for the first one I got (16-3*π)/42 by rewriting the fraction 2/((4k+3)(2k+5)) as partial fractions and then transforming them to integrals of sums of polynomials. However, WolframAlpha claims I'm missing an added ln(64)/42 in there and I can't for the life of me find where I'd missed it.

For the second one, note that k1/2ln(2k) / (k3-4) = k1/2ln(k) / (k3-4) + k1/2ln(2) / (k3-4)

k1/2 / (k3-4) <  k1/2 ln(k) / (k3-4)  < (k - 41/3) / (k3-4) = 1/(k2 + 41/3k + 42/3) which converges by the integral test.

Thus k1/2ln(2k) / (k3-4) converges as well by comparison.
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Pnx

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Re: Mathematics Help Thread
« Reply #1519 on: April 21, 2014, 11:54:59 am »

For the first one I'm not actually sure how you set it up as a sum of polynomials. Which is sort of my problem. I believe I need some method of creating a function for the nth term but I haven't been able to.

For the second... You don't seem to have actually established that (k - 41/3) / (k3-4) > k1/2ln(2k) / (k3-4).
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ZetaX

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Re: Mathematics Help Thread
« Reply #1520 on: April 21, 2014, 03:08:13 pm »

For any fixed eps you have that ln(n) < k^eps for all k large enough. Use this with eps=1/2 and you get majorisation by some multiple of 1/kČ.
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Pnx

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Re: Mathematics Help Thread
« Reply #1521 on: April 21, 2014, 03:48:50 pm »

I really don't understand what you just wrote.
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da_nang

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Re: Mathematics Help Thread
« Reply #1522 on: April 21, 2014, 06:51:18 pm »

For the first one I'm not actually sure how you set it up as a sum of polynomials. Which is sort of my problem. I believe I need some method of creating a function for the nth term but I haven't been able to.

For the second... You don't seem to have actually established that (k - 41/3) / (k3-4) > k1/2ln(2k) / (k3-4).
1. 1/P(k) = integral from 0 to 1 of xP(k) - 1, where P(k) is a positive polynomial of degree n > 0. Moving the summation inside the integral results in an integral of a series of polynomials.

For instance, when P(k) = 4k+3, summing the xP(k)-1 terms evaluates this infinite sum to x2/(1-x4) and for P(k) = 2k+5, the sum evaluates to x4/(1-x2). The difference of these rational functions are integrated (as was determined by the partial fraction decomposition). Note I left out the coefficients of the polynomials in the integrands for clarity.

2. Any polynomial of degree n > 0 grows faster than the logarithm. In Big-O notation, O(ln(x)) < O(x^k), k>0
« Last Edit: April 21, 2014, 06:55:49 pm by da_nang »
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"Deliver yesterday, code today, think tomorrow."
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ZetaX

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Re: Mathematics Help Thread
« Reply #1523 on: April 22, 2014, 07:02:20 am »

I really don't understand what you just wrote.
Then you should go back to your material and reread it, as those type of statement ("epsilontics") is very standard and essential to understanding (actually: defining) limits. The property about ln(x) can easily be proven, you should try yourself (after checking the epsilon stuff).
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Lightningfalcon

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Re: Mathematics Help Thread
« Reply #1524 on: April 22, 2014, 08:31:18 pm »

Not exactly math, but it has math in it and I can't find a chemistry thread.  I don't care about the actual answers, all I want to know is how to do them.  Preferably by tommorow morning at 8:15.
How do you determine the order of a reaction by looking at the graph?
If the decomposition of N2O5 to NO2 and O2 is first order with a rate constant of 4.8*10-4:
a. If the initial concentration is 1.65*10-2 mol/L, what is the concentration after 825s?
b. How long will it take for the concentration to decrease to 1*10-2 mol/L from the initial concentration given in a?
d. What is the half life of the reaction?


This is the only part of the review sheet I can't get, which is mostly my fault due to lack of sleep. (Screw essays of any and all kind). 
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Skyrunner

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Re: Mathematics Help Thread
« Reply #1525 on: April 23, 2014, 12:27:20 am »

We had a huge debate about whether the Coriolis effect is inertial force o.O
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MagmaMcFry

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Re: Mathematics Help Thread
« Reply #1526 on: April 23, 2014, 01:09:50 am »

We had a huge debate about whether the Coriolis effect is inertial force o.O
An inertial force is a force that appears in non-inertial reference frames as a correcting factor for Newton's laws, so the Coriolis effect is in fact an inertial force. What's there to argue about?
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Skyrunner

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Re: Mathematics Help Thread
« Reply #1527 on: April 23, 2014, 01:22:28 am »

It's because the textbook definition of inertial frame of reference, inertial force, and inertia is confusing. Also, the words for "frame of reference" and "system" are identical.

Heck, in the end the teacher concluded that the Coriolis effect isn't inertial!
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bay12 lower boards IRC:irc.darkmyst.org @ #bay12lb
"Oh, they never lie. They dissemble, evade, prevaricate, confoud, confuse, distract, obscure, subtly misrepresent and willfully misunderstand with what often appears to be a positively gleeful relish ... but they never lie" -- Look To Windward

MonkeyHead

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Re: Mathematics Help Thread
« Reply #1528 on: April 23, 2014, 10:43:50 am »

Hey, don't blame Physics, blame language for being shit at representing Physics. :P

Furtuka

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Re: Mathematics Help Thread
« Reply #1529 on: April 24, 2014, 03:02:06 pm »

​Does anything worth writing up happen when you start with a 3D vector field Field[x, y, z] and calculate the curl of curlField[x, y, z] which is given by
curlcurlField[x, y, z] = ∇⨯(∇⨯Field[x, y, z])?​
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It's FEF, not FEOF
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