Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Sean Mirrsen]

Why the hell would you want to remove embark points? As it is, at least you're limiting yourself to something. If I had no embark point limit, I'd never make it past the embark screen.

Seriously though, they bring purpose to the process of preparing to embark. Even at the maximum 10000 points, you still won't be able to take a crew of seven full-round-legendaries in adamantine armor, but you'll be able to if the point system is removed. It'd completely destroy what little strategy there ever was in embarking. It's the whole point of the game to provide a challenge, having the player invent challenges is ridiculous. While we have at least some sort of embark limit, the game can still provide some sort of challenge. The reason you don't have godmode on at all times is because it makes the game dull. Same here.

If anything, just replacing the thing to represent a sum of money proportional to your civ's general wealth would work better.

I agree that the setting could be moved to the init file, but then again I also see why it makes sense to have it as it is. The point system is the closest thing the game has to a clear difficulty slider. Want an easy game, jam it all the way to 10000. Want a harder game, see if you can make it with just 100. Things like difficulty settings have a place inside the game. Just because you can, you don't have to shovel every option into an external config file. I'm perfectly fine with being able to generate worlds with varying embark difficulty without having to close and reopen the game.

[Nigma]

Edit: Ah yea. I am not saying just remove it, i agree without limits i would never get out of the embark screen as well. Replacing it with something else would be best.

Even at the maximum 10000 points, you still won't be able to take a crew of seven full-round-legendaries in adamantine armor, but you'll be able to if the point system is removed.

Sorry but no, you wont ever get legendary dwarfs or adamantine items on your embark list as far as i know.

It'd completely destroy what little strategy there ever was in embarking. It's the whole point of the game to provide a challenge, having the player invent challenges is ridiculous. While we have at least some sort of embark limit, the game can still provide some sort of challenge. The reason you don't have godmode on at all times is because it makes the game dull. Same here.

Yes i agree there is some strategy in having a limit on your embark points. However how can players inventing challenges for a game that has no real objective be rediculous? One of the main points of fun in DF is the fact you can play it in any way you like, so why not make challenges for yourself?
Yes if godmode makes your game dull turn it off and make a challenge for yourself!

Also if you want to limit yourself you could just do with prementioned presets right?

I agree that the setting could be moved to the init file, but then again I also see why it makes sense to have it as it is. The point system is the closest thing the game has to a clear difficulty slider. Want an easy game, jam it all the way to 10000. Want a harder game, see if you can make it with just 100. Things like difficulty settings have a place inside the game. Just because you can, you don't have to shovel every option into an external config file.

I have to disagree on that part, it is more a pre-game difficulty slider, after 1 or 2 years you are either dead or doing fine. (in my experience anyway )

I'm perfectly fine with being able to generate worlds with varying embark difficulty without having to close and reopen the game.

Yes that is nice but if i really like a challenging world i generated with a low embark point setting and i would like to have a relaxing ez mode game it is pretty annoying that i cant.

I still personally think it would improve the game to get rid of the point part and base embarks purely on presets, it would make players able to make it as hard or easy as they want, profiles can be easily shared online so if you are looking for a new challange you can just get one of those.

Is it so bold of me to think this setup could -add- more strategy then it removes?

[Medicine Man]

No...Just no. The embark system helps n00BZ select their own difficulty level, I don't see why you would have to replace it with something or remove it as it is really all we need.

[Nigma]

Hmm i guess there isnt anything it could add right now that is of value..
Perhaps in the future i get to necro this thread with an "i told you so" or something.

n00BZ could also select their own difficulty level with presets =P

[Medicine Man]

n00BZ could also select their own difficulty level with presets =P

I would prefer to do my own things than use presets

[Nigma]

If you wanna do your own thing you could just add and remove anything you want from the list without embark points OR load a preset and modify that.

[Medicine Man]

Then it would make the game too easy, I could start with a maximum of about 100 steel bars with the current system but I could embark with thousands with that system.

A definite no.

[OmnipotentGrue]

But what if you wanted thousands of steel bars? If you want to play it that way, it's your choice. If you want to challenge yourself, don't play it that way. As long as there is an option for embarking with nothing but your wagon and your 7 dwarves, it is no different.

[Medicine Man]

But what if you wanted thousands of steel bars? If you want to play it that way, it's your choice. If you want to challenge yourself, don't play it that way. As long as there is an option for embarking with nothing but your wagon and your 7 dwarves, it is no different.

True...If embark points are going to be removed how about a system where it tells you how much embarks points you have spent? you should be able to set a maximum of embark points that you want and if you exceed it you will get a message saying "Are you sure you want to exceed the set embark points?" and if you say yes it will remove your maximum so you can cheat to your hearts content.

[OmnipotentGrue]

That's not a bad idea.

[Medicine Man]

Thanks.

[FGK dwarf]

Was there a dev item once that said your fortress expedition should have some back-story? If so, embark points could be tied to that, Eg a well-equipped military expedition into dangerous territory would get lots, maybe restricted to spend on weaponry, while penniless refugees who've had their homes sacked by a Goblin onslaught would just embark with the clothes on their backs.

[Andeerz]

Or the embark points could be representative of the wealth of the benefactors that sponsored the expedition (which would fall nicely under the previous post's suggestion, methinks).    That could be a way to tie it into whatever economy arc gets into the game at some point. 

Also, Dwarf mc dwarf, I also think yours is not a bad idea.

[Naros]

Yes, I've seen this mentioned under the heading 'alternative embark options'.

You could have various embark options, besides the ones that give a lot, or very few embark points.
For example one which allows for more starting dwarves, but with fewer points.
Or an option that comes with long term benefits in exchange for virtually no embark points (think highly skilled starting 7 dwarves, or with higher than average possitive traits, or starting with a pair of giant war-tigers, etc.)

The variable amounts of points really appeals to me, but removing them sounds silly, and replacing embark points or pre-sets sounds just plain horrible!