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Author Topic: Picks are apparently very good weapons  (Read 3130 times)

fivex

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Picks are apparently very good weapons
« on: September 12, 2010, 10:43:06 pm »

As far as I know, no one has really done any studies about using picks for weapons.
So I went and did  some tests in arena mode.
All tests have the specific weapon skill as unskilled, because you can't set mining skill when creating things in arena mode and I wanted to be fair
All skills unskilled and unarmored:
3 adamantine pick using dwarfs vs. 3 adamantine battle axe using dwarfs: The axedwarfs win with no casualties on their side.
3 adamantine pick using dwarfs vs. 3 silver war hammer using dwarfs: The hammerdwarfs win with one casualty
3 adamantine pick using dwarfs(I'll just call these guys miners for now on) vs. 3 silver whip using dwarfs: The lashers win with one casualty
Grand master fighter, armor user and shield user and unarmored.
Miners vs. 3 adamantine battle axe using dwarfs: The miners won with one casualty.
Miners vs. 3 silver war hammer using dwarfs: The hammerdwarfs one with one casualty
Miners vs. 3 silver whip using dwarfs: The miners won with... one casualty
Unskilled and armored:
Miners vs. 3 Adamantine battle axe using dwarfs:  The miners won with minimal injuries
Miners vs 3 Silver war hammer using dwarfs: The hammerdwarfs won with minimal injuries
Miners vs 3 Silver whip using dwarfs: The lashers won with no injuries.
Grand master fighter armor user and shield user and armored:
Miners vs 3 adamantine battle axe using dwarfs: The miners win with one casualty. The two remaining miners had no injuries
Miners vs 3 silver war hammer using dwarfs: The Hammerdwarfs won with no injuries
Miners vs 3 silver whip using dwarfs:  The lashers won with no casualties.

So picks seem at least slightly superior to battle-axes
« Last Edit: September 13, 2010, 02:00:36 am by fivex »
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Urist Imiknorris

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Re: Picks: How good they are as weapons
« Reply #1 on: September 12, 2010, 11:00:30 pm »

Duly noted. I can train these guys up pretty easily too. I have a full z-level mushroom farm that I want to set up.
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fivex

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Re: Picks are apparently very good weapons
« Reply #2 on: September 14, 2010, 03:24:25 pm »

Um... bump?
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Sean Mirrsen

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Re: Picks are apparently very good weapons
« Reply #3 on: September 14, 2010, 03:31:24 pm »

Nobody did any studies, but picks were always known for their lethal qualities. I mean, seriously, it's like an axe shaped like a spear - the weight of one, the piercing capabilities of the other. And it uses one of the most easily trained skills.
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Gearheart

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Re: Picks are apparently very good weapons
« Reply #4 on: September 14, 2010, 04:07:31 pm »

They're one of those odd weapons which get a heckton of instakill criticals. Spears are another.
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Alastar

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Re: Picks are apparently very good weapons
« Reply #5 on: September 14, 2010, 04:40:40 pm »

Strangely, picks modded to use another weapon skill appear considerably less impressive at higher proficiencies compared to other weapons. If mining trains faster in combat, this would explain it.

I always liked them. Fast, big enough contact area to send limbs flying, small enough contact area to do adequately against armour, no junk attacks of being an inferior blunt weapon.
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Hyndis

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Re: Picks are apparently very good weapons
« Reply #6 on: September 14, 2010, 04:44:29 pm »

Miners are generally very tough, strong, agile, armed with lethal weapons and they know how to use those weapons. Against wildlife miners usually handle themselves just fine. They get cornered by a trog? No problem. The miner can usually resolve the situation on his own.

Against goblins or FB's the miners are probably doomed unless they have extensive training in other skills, like dodging.
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Foxbyte

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Re: Picks are apparently very good weapons
« Reply #7 on: September 14, 2010, 05:07:22 pm »

Picks have long since been militarized. I'm not surprised they make such fantastic weapons.
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Khift

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Re: Picks are apparently very good weapons
« Reply #8 on: September 14, 2010, 06:33:56 pm »

I always recruit my miners and woodcutters and equip them with armor and shields. It's came in use more than once, being able to activate them and send them out to kill.
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Tywuzhere

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Re: Picks are apparently very good weapons
« Reply #9 on: September 14, 2010, 08:05:16 pm »

Hey, miners have to dig out entire complexes underground. I mean, surely they'll have hugely buff arms, and they'll be really good at swinging those picks around. It's no wonder they're at least somewhat decent when it comes to combat.
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ungulateman

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Re: Picks are apparently very good weapons
« Reply #10 on: September 14, 2010, 10:22:56 pm »

I have this mental image of a dwarf mining through a group of goblins.

"You have struck Hammergoblinite!"
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Alastar

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Re: Picks are apparently very good weapons
« Reply #11 on: September 15, 2010, 12:08:53 am »

Yes, miners are usually buff and know how to handle their picks and will make useful emergency recruits. I think the point was more to ponder if picks are a good choice for dedicated military dwarves, and I believe they are.
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Hyndis

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Re: Picks are apparently very good weapons
« Reply #12 on: September 15, 2010, 11:09:06 am »

Picks are great weapons for military usage, on par with swords or spears.
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beorn080

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Re: Picks are apparently very good weapons
« Reply #13 on: September 15, 2010, 11:41:34 am »

Looking at the DFwiki page on weapons.

Picks have one attack they can do, which is considered an edge attack and thus takes off limbs easily.

Every other weapon type has a spread of blunt and edge attacks, well, except for the blunt weapons, and none of them seem effective.
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Re: Picks are apparently very good weapons
« Reply #14 on: September 15, 2010, 12:33:43 pm »

Picks have actually been nerfed a bit since .40d, since that 'Misc. Objects User' skill now governs their usefulness in combat; previously, it was determined by skill in Mining.

Looking at the DFwiki page on weapons.

Picks have one attack they can do, which is considered an edge attack and thus takes off limbs easily.

Every other weapon type has a spread of blunt and edge attacks, well, except for the blunt weapons, and none of them seem effective.
I've never seen any of the blunt attacks mentioned for swords, spears etc get used; dwarves seem to prioritise edged attacks over blunt ones right now, even when a blunt attack might do more damage.
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