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Author Topic: Magma Pump Stacks: Not worth the pain?  (Read 1533 times)

AMRIV

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Re: Magma Pump Stacks: Not worth the pain?
« Reply #15 on: September 05, 2010, 10:12:09 pm »

I have recently learned that Dwarven Science (TM) has found an alternative to pump stacks. You may wish to look into that.

http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=59894.0
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KrazyDocK

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Re: Magma Pump Stacks: Not worth the pain?
« Reply #16 on: September 05, 2010, 10:30:25 pm »

First thing that comes to mind for me is to mod worldgen parameters to have 1 cave layer which brings the magma up to a more manageable depth.  Second is to embark on an area with sand and build all the components of magma proof green glass, then before designating the pump construction go into your stocks screen and forbid any non-glass blocks, pipes, and corkscrews.  The third thing is completely optional, and adds some work and uses a lot more(2x) power, but also ensures your stack does not deconstruct, and makes digging out the area for the stack easier to build, is to make the pump stack 2 pumps wide and only channel through one side making every level of the stack have a pump on a solid foundation.  This also has the added benefit of pumping the magma a bit faster.
The 2 wide pump stack sounds like a very elegant solution.  If stability is your top priority (which it might be given the collapse of your pump stack... twice!), then it sounds like a good fit.
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Larry421

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Re: Magma Pump Stacks: Not worth the pain?
« Reply #17 on: September 05, 2010, 10:50:57 pm »

I just build a horizontal axle attached to the walkable side of each pump. Doesn't take very long, and puts everything on a stable foundation. There's a negligible increase in power requirements, and no chance of leaking.
For power, just extend an axle towards a gear assembly sitting on top of the pump in the perpetual motion machine.

Course I've modded worldgen to only have 1 cavern, and only had to pump 15 z-levels. Not 150.

Then I learnt that pumping magma directly onto a glacier causes all kinds of Fun.
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Jurph

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Re: Magma Pump Stacks: Not worth the pain?
« Reply #18 on: September 06, 2010, 09:35:20 am »


(...)  The third thing is completely optional, and adds some work and uses a lot more(2x) power, but also ensures your stack does not deconstruct, and makes digging out the area for the stack easier to build, is to make the pump stack 2 pumps wide and only channel through one side making every level of the stack have a pump on a solid foundation.  This also has the added benefit of pumping the magma a bit faster.
The 2 wide pump stack sounds like a very elegant solution.  If stability is your top priority (which it might be given the collapse of your pump stack... twice!), then it sounds like a good fit.

There's a nice in-between solution that incorporates this: I can use a stable adjacent pump every 10 levels or so, and include a reservoir at that pump's Z-level just in case there's a pumping-rate problem.  This breaks the stack into 10 sections, each anchored by a stable pump at each end so that no single pump failure can cause a cascading break.
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Khift

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Re: Magma Pump Stacks: Not worth the pain?
« Reply #19 on: September 06, 2010, 10:54:28 am »

Another thing to note is that pump stacks don't just disassemble when they run and aren't made of magma safe materials they can also disassemble when being built. If a single item that was slated to go into the pump stack is moved in between the designation of the pump and the dwarves actually building the pump the dwarves will cancel construction, un-designate the pump, and cause a mass collapse of the stack. I've had this happen to me three times and trust me, it sucked.

Using axles sounds like a good idea. Less power usage, that's for sure. I like to plan around murphy's law, though, and don't want any part of the stack to not be magma safe so I would have to insist on nethercap axles and that would just be a pain.
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Fayceless

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Re: Magma Pump Stacks: Not worth the pain?
« Reply #20 on: September 06, 2010, 11:30:28 am »

Forbid any magma-unsafe blocks/screws/pipes until the pump is complete.  Makes things easier.
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Sheb

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Re: Magma Pump Stacks: Not worth the pain?
« Reply #21 on: September 06, 2010, 11:43:06 am »

I don't understand, I always have my pumps on stable ground, since I only dig one channel per z-level.
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Hyndis

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Re: Magma Pump Stacks: Not worth the pain?
« Reply #22 on: September 06, 2010, 11:49:56 am »

I only ever build magma safe pump components. Never had any issues with pump stacks deconstructing.

Also if you want to be absolutely sure you can anchor the pump onto solid ground every few levels. It doesn't need to be much. Just a gear assembly. Have it set on solid ground so that if you lose a pump for any reason you will only lose the pumps between anchors.

It could be as simple as a gear assembly put into the magma floor plain, where you pump the magma. It doesn't need to be hooked up to anything. Just make the mechanism out of iron or nickle and it will never melt.
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Tyrius

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Re: Magma Pump Stacks: Not worth the pain?
« Reply #23 on: September 06, 2010, 12:33:28 pm »

I'm really confused now. Do you now require both of the screw pump's tiles to be connected to the one below to transfer power? I've not tried a pump stack in .31 yet so it may just be something I've just not come across, but in 40d at least you could just alternate floor tiles so that every pump was on stable ground, and could transfer power through the 'blocked' tile downover.
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Reuzel

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Re: Magma Pump Stacks: Not worth the pain?
« Reply #24 on: September 06, 2010, 02:42:26 pm »

I'm really confused now. Do you now require both of the screw pump's tiles to be connected to the one below to transfer power? I've not tried a pump stack in .31 yet so it may just be something I've just not come across, but in 40d at least you could just alternate floor tiles so that every pump was on stable ground, and could transfer power through the 'blocked' tile downover.
Just one tile needs to connect to a pump above or below, the other pump tile can rest on a floor.
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Kanddak

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Re: Magma Pump Stacks: Not worth the pain?
« Reply #25 on: September 06, 2010, 03:28:55 pm »

I don't understand, I always have my pumps on stable ground, since I only dig one channel per z-level.
How do you power them? With a separate power shaft with an axle leading off to each pump? You can do it that way and all your pumps will indeed be stable, it's just more of a hassle than conventional pump stacks.

I'm really confused now. Do you now require both of the screw pump's tiles to be connected to the one below to transfer power? I've not tried a pump stack in .31 yet so it may just be something I've just not come across, but in 40d at least you could just alternate floor tiles so that every pump was on stable ground, and could transfer power through the 'blocked' tile downover.
Nothing's changed in 0.31. If you look again at pumps in 40d stacks they will indeed say "hanging" and not "stable foundation" because only one of their tiles is on a floor.
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