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[Lap]

Sourceforge: http://sourceforge.net/projects/crimelike/
Blogspot: http://crimelike.blogspot.com/
Forum: http://76.26.38.52/crimelike/





Alright, so we all watched in horror/amazement at the whole SK roguelike thread. Oddly enough, a lot of good gameplay suggestions did come up and I heard many people say that they were going to try and make it themselves. Please, let's not have like 6 unfinished versions by separate authors in the works. I'd really like for us to be able to work together and focus our efforts.

Anyways, this whole thing reminded me that I've had this old design document laying around my computer for a while, but I never really got to doing anything with it. It's a bit broader in scope than the serial killer focus so I think a lot more people would be able to enjoy and participate in it. Here's the basics of it:

Source of Inspirations - The Sting/The Clue, Crimefighters, Liberal Crime Squad

Setting - Modern day city or large town.

Atmosphere - Fairly normal. Definitely not crazy like HellMOO or extremely dark like Gotham.

Overall Player Goals - Most goals are greed based (money), but some specific characters might have more specific end game goals (ie. infamy, amassing X number of gang members, etc.).

Specific Character Types - Each type is based around a specific playstyle to keep everyone entertained.

Thug - Mostly violence based. Robberies, heists, and muggings. These characters are also likely to be members of gangs and have followers.

Dealer - Similar to thugs, but more focused on mercantile and smuggling then outright violence.

Thief - Stealth based and works mostly alone.

Scam Artist- Based on tricking others into giving money. Focuses on disguises, identity theft, and intelligence.

Hitman - Narrowly focused violence.

Serial Killer - I hesitate to add this in, but it does seem that he could be a viable variant. By adding "compulsions" or other mental sicknesses it would add a twist to the standard of just killing people. Something like each night a voice tells you to "Target X type of person with Y hair and then do weird ritual X". When you're forced to occasionally do very irrational things, it can get much more difficult than standard thug or hitman based gameplay and is less based on money.

These should satisfy just about every playstyle.

Of course, anyone can just play and do whatever they want. Player starting roles are there simply to provide a start or more direction for players who desire it.

Evidence/Heat System - The most important system in the game that is universal to everyone is the system that essentially manages how infamous you are. Things like leaving evidence and being seen are the primary ways to raise your heat. Doing things like laying low, having/forcing someone else to take the fall for you, hacking into police database, and wearing disguises are ways to reduce your heat.


[As far as the gruesome torture stuff, I couldn't care less. If there's some sort of valid gameplay mechanic it can be linked to then whatever, but I'd prefer this to not be made purely for shock value.]

That's the basic premise without getting into too many specifics. I'm just trying to gauge interest and to see if anyone wants to collaborate. Most likely would be using an existing RL engine to save time (probably TE4). If someone really feels up to being project lead, by all means take the reigns. I just don't want to see so much scattered effort.

[vagel7]

Sure, i would love to help you and the game seems fun, theres also an Estonian internet browser game called crime where you are a dealer. So, you might want to chance the name as Crime is a pretty successful game.

[Blaze]

I believe the "Serial Killer" begins as a different "class" which would degrade into one depending on the player's actions. Stealing a lot, might cause you to develop kleptomania which will urge you to steal things even when you might be discovered. You could start with an urge like pyromania which starts as a small mental defect and eventually blossoms into a full-blown illness.

Say that you're a "brand new" thief, you break into homes and steal stuff for a living because you can't make any money otherwise. After pulling a few successful crimes you feel a bit confident in yourself; thus breaking into a more secure building. Then comes the unavoidable scene of you being discovered; you can't risk being identified and thus resort to silencing the witness. This can come in a variety of ways. You're no fighter after all, and have almost no combat expertise (as a thief), you might accidentally inflict a fatal wound or other intentionally/unintentionally kill him/her.

That acts kind of like a gateway drug, in the beginning you might experience remorse but it gets easier every time. And since there is no "return to a normal life" option for you just have to keep going. Eventually it becomes something "naturally done" and continues to degrade into an urge, eventually becoming insatiable. Similar to how the sexual criminal begins, peeping tom to molester to rapist, though they may skip/add a few phases.

[Muz]

I've always wanted to make a proper robbery and escape from prison game. But too many other things on the list.

[Lap]

There's actually a surprisingly large market for sims focusing purely on being a dealer. I'm always amazed at how popular Dope Farmer is/was. Any favorite mechanics from those that should be replicated?

I think most of them devolve into copies of any generic trading game so I'd probably choose to emphasize things like smuggling and secret production instead of leaving it as a simple "buy low,sell high" thing.

Blaze - The system you describe sounds extremely similar to World of Darkness's Humanity/Morality rating. The more you do these terrible things the worse the rating and the more likely you are to suffer psychotic attacks, compulsion, and rage. Eventually, you can barely interact with other people. It's not a bad system and it does a good job of preventing people from immediately killing every NPC that looks at them funny.

Muz - I actually have an entire document on trial, prison, escape/breakouts and how they could fit in here. It could definitely be done in it's own game if expanded on enough.

[Muz]

I'll be happy to take it off your hands when you don't want it. For once, I'd like to make a game without having to design it first

[vagel7]

I will note that you should chance the name again but also you should have a court trial where you can have a lawyer and all that and also they should decide on what you did like a robbery without a weapon gets less(in Estonia it does anyway, don't now about america)

[Blaze]

Blaze - The system you describe sounds extremely similar to World of Darkness's Humanity/Morality rating. The more you do these terrible things the worse the rating and the more likely you are to suffer psychotic attacks, compulsion, and rage. It's not a bad system and it does a good job of preventing people from immediately killing every NPC that looks at them funny.

Well in my case it would be both beneficial and hindering. Kleptomania like I mentioned above, may cause expensive items to be revealed more clearly, like appearing as a brighter symbol. At the same time, since your attention is focused on said items, you're not as aware of the possible defensive measures that might be around you. Eventually it turns into a "sense" that you just KNOW the item is expensive coupled with an decrease in your "stealth rating". People will notice you if you start acting strange, though your own self-control may factor into that.

[Lap]

I'll be happy to take it off your hands when you don't want it. For once, I'd like to make a game without having to design it first

Half of the stuff I have is on actual paper so I'll have to see what form it's in, but I'm all for sharing information. I don't know how useful it would be though as most of it is based on the interactions and effects that prison has on the rest of the game and not surviving prison itself. I'd imagine that an item improvisation and crafting system would be very important in a solely prison based game and there's so much I skipped over about prison life.

Blaze - I love mechanics and traits that aren't entirely positive or entirely negative. Games need more of these.

[Blaze]

Blaze - I love mechanics and traits that aren't entirely positive or entirely negative. Games need more of these.

To be honest, I wasn't really thinking like that :S, things like this help you develop a criminal profile. Are you one who hides and sneaks at night or a brazen person who prowls during the day? Do you go in and randomly tear through everything or neatly come in, steal your choice tidbits, and leave with barely a trace? Are you a madman who sadistically tortures and mutilates his/her victims or are the wounds you cause quick and businesslike?

If you commit your crimes in a way that is hard to trace to you, the detectives who are hunting you may think they're going after several different criminals. Your own motives like money, infamy, etc may go against this though.

[Megaman]

All I want is a reference to the SK RL hoax. oh and game-play's a good direction too.

[kholhaus]

I'll be happy to collaborate with design and mechanics, but only because I have a feeling my earlier rage-inspired way into coding, that may take a while. Like, a long while. As in, I've never programmed before. :U

So why not contribute to the current efforts, I thought.

[commondragon]

I'll be happy to take it off your hands when you don't want it. For once, I'd like to make a game without having to design it first

Shoot, you could just ask me at that point.  I have way too many unused ideas.


Anyways, the first thing I do when any part of this is released, is Im going to go into two peoples houses and swap their belongings.

[kholhaus]

So, getting this out of the way;

Is there anyone here who can actually START this project, without much trouble or time consumed?

I won't be able to for a few months, prolly.

[Tilla]

I will note that you should chance the name again but also you should have a court trial where you can have a lawyer and all that and also they should decide on what you did like a robbery without a weapon gets less(in Estonia it does anyway, don't now about america)

I doubt this is really a name yet, it's just a start to ideas of a project.