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[RedKing]

You know, when I first got this game, I knew this game had problems with the Grim Reaper coming a bit too early.

Spoiler: But I didn't know it was THIS BAD. (click to show/hide)

I had something similar the other day, wherein one of my dukes *and* his elder son died on the same day, leaving the younger son to inherit. Both sons were still children, and both deaths were listed as natural. I'm suspicious that with the changes in plots, perhaps sometimes a plotted assassination that makes a high enough successful roll doesn't show up as "suspicious death"??

Cause that is WAY too coincidental. That, or there's some kind of "accident" event that's taking place that has the chance to take out multiple family members simultaneously?

[Johnfalcon99977]

I don't think so. If it had been a "Multi-death" accident event then it wouldn't list them as having died natural deaths.

Could it have been pagan magicks?

[olemars]

The duke was really fat and fell on him.

[Duuvian]

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Hey guys, I'm currently stumped with my current game and it seems to boil down to one question. Is there any advantage to being the defender in a war rather than attacking?

I started as Palermo (Shia just to be clear, only other Shia state of worth are the Fatimids) and I'm now Sicily and have all of the kingdom of sicily and a few duchies in Italy. Of course this now means I'm facing down both the HRE and the Byzantines who will both happily declare holy wars on my territory when not busy elsewhere. Of course, I can declare holy wars and such back against them, so considering that I know they'll declare war at some point is there any benefit to waiting instead of just attacking?

From what I can tell, if I'm on the defensive I stand to lose territory if I lose, and if I win (white peace since getting 100% warscore would probably be too difficult) I simply gain a truce for 10 years and I can't press the advantage and try to get something tangible from the victory without breaking the truce, and dismissing/regathering my armies from far away.
If I decide instead to attack, then I stand to gain territory if I win, and if I lose I simply lose I gain a truce which lets me rebuild and lose some prestige, piety and money depending on what type of war and how badly I lose, none of which is a big loss in my eyes.

The truce doesn't help much besides letting me replenish my armies because my expansion options are: swipe territory from the HRE (which is what I've been doing by taking advantage of their internal strife whenever possible) or declare a holy war for something overseas, which means I'm fighting either France for Corsica (HRE would probably jump in, no way I'd win), Croatia/Provence/Genoa (same problem), Byantines for something (I'd win by calling in the Fatimids but they could implode from decadence any moment now) or one of the two smaller (4-8 territory) Sunni states in north Africa, but the Almoravids (who are huge) might jump in.

For completeness sake here's most of the world map, I'm the Kalbids in southern Italy. The Almoravids hold Granada and such, and most of the west of the HRE is independent and mostly grouped into Lower Burgundy but all the independent states there are grey as well which is irritating.
[spoiler]

An advantage of being attacked that I've benefitted from is that they must pay you a hefty amount of gold. If it's a particularly rich state attacking you it can be a very large amount.

Spoiler: For example (click to show/hide)

For example, the Papal state attacked my holdings in Italy as they had a De Jure claim. I mustered the Polish armies and supplemented them with mercenaries in Krakow, and marched my Italian armies away from the Pope's armies who then settled down to siege a few provinces of mine in Italy. I consolidated my forces and stomped the Pope's army. The Pope can apparently muster forces quite quickly so I had to stomp his reconstituted armies several times in quick succession and then keep the Pope from summoning more troops from all the Papal states by occupying them. I also had to save scum multiple times as the HRE kept intervening for the Pope and I had no hope of beating them.

As a result the Queen of Poland I was playing as sacked Rome and the other Papal holdings after the Pope declared De Jure war on me. At 100% warscore I offered the Pope peace and he was forced to pay me over 1000 gold. I used this gold to build a castle holding in Krakow for the ruler to hold in order to increase their troop numbers.

[Grakelin]

Played for the first time since the update. Ragequit after waiting for 30 years, and the reign of two leaders, for an assassination event to pop up while I had 200% Plot Power. Am I supposed to believe that the Earl of Breifne wasn't in a vulnerable position in all that time? Ironically, I got the event where a drunk blabs about the plot two times.

How many backers did you have? I haven't tried the new patch yet, but I imagine the number of co-conspirators is more important now.

I had five backers at one point. If they need more than that, it's now impossible to assassinate people.

[scriver]

It's very possible, Grakelin, I've killed off (or at least had a lot of assassination attempts) a whole bunch of people with less supporters and in shorter time... It's possible you just had extreme bad luck with the RNG.

[lordcooper]

extreme bad luck with the RNG.

This happens to me all the time.  It took around 25 years to fabricate a claim once.

[olemars]

Annoys me how long religious conversion missions take. Can't be that time-consuming to kill people until they're christian.

I had five backers at one point. If they need more than that, it's now impossible to assassinate people.

Must be bad luck. It's at least good that they've tried to make it harder to assassinate. The way it was they might as well have installed heart plugs in everyone.

[Johnfalcon99977]

How the fucking hell does someone in JAIL usurp a title from the person who imprisoned him? That makes *No* sense.

[scriver]

The regency-dude does it for him.

[lemon10]

As it is, its way too easy to take out the pope IMHO, and proceed to steal all his money.

The papacy really needs some better defenses (or at least a bunch of nations willing to jump in to defend them because you are trying to overthrow the pope), because at the moment, its way too easy to just A) set up a antipope B) invade with a claim on the papacy C) invite the old pope to your court (with a matralinial marriage), grant him land then D) kill off both him and his wife, and E) since he has no relatives (and you have crown laws to stop someone else inheriting his estate), you will get all his money (went from 40k money (half of which I stole from a rebelling doge) to 200k money by stealing all the money that the papacy had acquired over the generations).

While it would have been a bit harder as someone besides the combined emperor of about a dozen different kingdoms (Empire of brittania+85% of spain+85% of francia+sweden (and parts of neighboring countries)+Hungary), anyone with a kingdom and 2k money saved up could do it pretty easily.

[Johnfalcon99977]

...the combined emperor of about a dozen different kingdoms (Empire of brittania+85% of spain+85% of francia+sweden (and parts of neighboring countries)+Hungary)...

0.0

Can we see a map of that save?

[Rakonas]

Annoys me how long religious conversion missions take. Can't be that time-consuming to kill people until they're christian.

I had five backers at one point. If they need more than that, it's now impossible to assassinate people.

Must be bad luck. It's at least good that they've tried to make it harder to assassinate. The way it was they might as well have installed heart plugs in everyone.

Can't say I'm fond of the new plot system. The only time I have plots happen in a reasonable amount of time is when I have 300% plot power, and even then it can take years. Sometimes I find myself using the assassinate button after waiting for years at 90-100% plot power with no success.

[warhammer651]

I recall a post on the paradox forums that they will be reducing the MTTH (Mean Time To happen) by quite a bit in the next patch

[lemon10]

Annoys me how long religious conversion missions take. Can't be that time-consuming to kill people until they're christian.

I had five backers at one point. If they need more than that, it's now impossible to assassinate people.

Must be bad luck. It's at least good that they've tried to make it harder to assassinate. The way it was they might as well have installed heart plugs in everyone.

Can't say I'm fond of the new plot system. The only time I have plots happen in a reasonable amount of time is when I have 300% plot power, and even then it can take years. Sometimes I find myself using the assassinate button after waiting for years at 90-100% plot power with no success.

The new plot system is pretty useless if you have the money for assassinations, because at the moment plain assassinations are so much better because:
A) No real negative side effects besides wasting money (if you have enough money to kill them and you are planning on doing it, then it won't really matter if you lose 20 piety and they dislike you a bit more before they die).
B) You can always assassinate someone (compared with only being able to plot against some people semi-randomly).
C) Instant (able to end annoying rebellions, get heir in power instead of some that hates you, get a regent in place so you can push a claim, able to kill multiple people in a single day if you can afford it) vs probably within a decade (slow enough that they have a good chance of dying naturally, they will probably get more heirs before they die, lands can pass out of your country, kids can grow up, and it won't end any wars except with extreme luck), and thats at 100% plot power.
D) Plots require annoying micromanaging (inviting a dozen different nobels to plot, paying them money to get to like you if they have high plot power, and then renewing the nobles every couple of years when they die/lose their positions)

I think they plots and assassinations would be much better balanced if:
A) Non-plot assassinations had a cumulative penalty the more attempts are made on a life in a short time (eg. every assassination lowers success by 5% and raises chance of being caught by 5% for 6 months)
B) Plots show your annual chance of getting a assassination attempt, so you know at least that you have a 30% chance per year, even if it takes 5 years to happen it will feel a bit better.


I feel like it would be better would be having assassination plots be multi-staged (eg. stage 1 is planning and hiring assassins, stage 2 is setting up the attempt, stage 3 is the assassination attempt itself), so it would be more distinct and so there is a little bit of feedback on how its going.

...the combined emperor of about a dozen different kingdoms (Empire of brittania+85% of spain+85% of francia+sweden (and parts of neighboring countries)+Hungary)...

0.0
Can we see a map of that save?

Ill upload it in a few hours when I get home.