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[scriver]

And they only did it out of kindness so the modders wouldn't have to do so many workarounds to make them playable. We're just back to square one now.

[Rakonas]

Actually originally muslims and pagans were playable but only in the demo or version 1.0 (which wasn't what you got from any online stores) due to a convenient and totally useful bug. Then they fixed the bug on release, then they added the [playable=yes] line a few patches later. Now all they're doing is tying the new dlc features to the [muslim] group or whatever, but you can (and there definitely will be mods that do it for you) simply make all muslims be called something slightly different in the files which would make them playable without the dlc yet lacking all the muslim-specific features added by it. The fact that they're releasing the features to everyone makes it so that making muslims only playable with the dlc is the only way they could make money with it.
This is much, much, more reasonable than the original bullshit of them releasing the game without muslim or pagan playability. I honestly see nothing wrong with what they're doing with that as it's the nicest way to do it (well, except for just releasing the dlc for free).

[Knight of Fools]

Okay, I understand. I thought they were charging for something that was already there. You will still be able to play as the Muslims as they are now, but if you get the DLC you'll be able to get the new stuff.

That makes a lot more sense.

[forsaken1111]

Okay, I understand. I thought they were charging for something that was already there. You will still be able to play as the Muslims as they are now, but if you get the DLC you'll be able to get the new stuff.

That makes a lot more sense.

Er.. no. As I understand it you cannot legitimately play as Muslims unless you buy the DLC. The DLC includes muslim-specific events, art and play methods. THAT is what you're paying for.

[scriver]

You will be able to play Muslims as they are now, if you use mods. Because the game will think they are Muslim2s instead of Muslims.

[forsaken1111]

You will be able to play Muslims as they are now, if you use mods. Because the game will think they are Muslim2s instead of Muslims.

Ahh okay, they will just play exactly like christian culture groups?

[scriver]

Most likely. Or more like pagans, perhaps. Very bland, at least (just like they are now). I'm unsure how moddable religions are though, since they'll essentially be creating a second Muslim religion and they would have to make them able to call Jihads and such. But most of it should be able to be replicable, I think.

[forsaken1111]

Can't wait to see modded muslims calling a holy crusade against the heathens.

[olemars]

Patch has been released (on Steam), but apparently the DLC isn't. Anyone know to what degree saves will be borked by the patch? Would it be best to start over?

[Duuvian]

I lost my save when I had to revert to backup due to the Maya 3d modelling software's free trial being installed by Akamai. Screw that bunch of spyware/malware. If I 3d model I'll have to get a new/used trash computer for it I guess.

[Vonyx]

Patch has been released (on Steam), but apparently the DLC isn't. Anyone know to what degree saves will be borked by the patch? Would it be best to start over?

From what I've read on the paradox forum your save will be borked a lot.

Probably best to start a new game.

[RedKing]

I have a quandary. My king, Coenwulf I Rex Hibernia et Caledonia has two sons: Finn (the elder, Duke of the Isles and rightful heir) and Mael-Morda (the younger, Duke of Albany).

For some cockamamie reason, Finn decided to assassinate his brother's daughter. When she was about two. And he got caught. Needless to say, there's some bad blood between them. But more pertinently, Finn is now tagged as a Kinslayer. I've played out the succession a couple of times, and it's clear that if/when Finn succeeds to the throne, all hell will break loose.

Finn is currently in my prison (thanks to an event I got), but I'm not sure how to resolve this crisis. Coenwulf is getting up in years, and there will be a succession soon. Even if I strip him of all titles and banish him, he remains the rightful heir. If I execute him, I become a kinslayer myself. I could try to assassinate him, but the odds are fairly low. I can't seem to plot against him and use others to help my chances, probably because Coenwulf is a content, kind, loveable imbecile. (Honestly, I think of him as being like Lennie from Mice and Men.)

Ideally, I'd order his execution on my deathbed, so that Mael-Morda would assume the throne free of taint, but that's difficult to predict (and the game doesn't allow for player-initiated suicide). And, Finn has two young sons who would precede Mael-Morda in the succession.

Complicating matters is that Finn is married to a princess of Norway, who at the moment stands to inherit the throne when her aged father dies. It's a matrilineal marriage, but that doesn't matter because she's of a cadet branch of our same dynasty. If Finn were to succeed without ripping the kingdom in half, his child could wear three crowns (albeit Norway is somewhat reduced due to poor fortunes and revolts).

I could potentially change the succession laws from Primogeniture to Seniority, but that raises all kinds of issues in and of itself. And then I'd still have to wipe out Finn's line (or strip him of titles) to keep those lands from falling to Norway. Finn's wife is also a countess, so I need to keep her lands under my crown as well. A veritable bloodbath would be required.


None of this would be a problem if the dumb bastard hadn't decided that killing a little girl was a bold strategic move. 

[Duuvian]

Man, that is a quandary. Can you make Finn a Prince Bishop or would that not help? You'd get a -20 tyranny for revoking an existing Bishop unless you can plot against one I think but that might still be better.

[Vactor]

I am facing a similar problem with my Norwegian game, my second son is more fit to rule, and my first son died in the crusades while running down fleeing peasents. 

I needed to clean out the grandchildren, but their spymaster loved them.  The easy solution for me was to grant their spymaster a county, forcing him to leave their court.  The new spymaster was happy to go along with my plots.

[RedKing]

Nice. My problem is that I never seem to be able to plot against my children. Wives, yes. Grandchildren, yes. Children, no.

I'm not sure but I'm guessing it's related to your ruler's traits. A ruler who isn't particularly cruel or deceitful just may not get that option. Poor Coenwulf, he doesn't want to kill people, he wants to love them and hug them and pet them and call them George. Funny thing is, despite being born an imbecile he's had a good, mostly peaceful reign.