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Author Topic: Crusader Kings 2 is released.  (Read 2114332 times)

Cthulufaic

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Re: Crusader Kings 2 is released.
« Reply #2235 on: November 06, 2012, 03:02:49 pm »



Right now the main reason why I use prince bishops is the faction system is still completely broken and helps to make things less tedious.
The only thing more broken than the faction system is the factions with the Fatimids.  I think one guy played as them and did NOTHING for three years and nothing happened.  The ruler is six over his demense limit and no one hates him for it, so the first thing before the factions get fixed is that the Fatimids get fixed.
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Re: Crusader Kings 2 is released.
« Reply #2236 on: November 06, 2012, 03:08:38 pm »

Why Paradox made the Fatamids the way they are is just perplexing for me. They were in a god damn three-way civil war! There are various mods that attempt to nerf them but they almost always seem to hold together and nobody has any clue as to why.
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Karlito

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Re: Crusader Kings 2 is released.
« Reply #2237 on: November 06, 2012, 03:33:34 pm »

So, I'm playing as Byzantines expanding slowly but surely duchy by duchy, when I look north and see what the AI did.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)
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lordcooper

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Re: Crusader Kings 2 is released.
« Reply #2238 on: November 06, 2012, 03:40:58 pm »

So, I'm playing as Byzantines expanding slowly but surely duchy by duchy, when I look north and see what the AI did.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

That may actually be a great thing for you.  Just wait for the inevitable clusterfuck of rebellions and jump in with an invasion while the Emperor is distracted.
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Johuotar

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Re: Crusader Kings 2 is released.
« Reply #2239 on: November 06, 2012, 03:56:53 pm »

Some time ago I thought asking about the Fatimid, but apparently no one else either knows why they were made powerful like that. :S
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Re: Crusader Kings 2 is released.
« Reply #2240 on: November 06, 2012, 05:49:51 pm »

I've seen the fatmids being defeated by crusades. In one game the Papal States conquered nearly all of it. I'll try to find the screenshot.


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« Last Edit: November 06, 2012, 05:58:43 pm by Deathsword »
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Squanto

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Re: Crusader Kings 2 is released.
« Reply #2241 on: November 06, 2012, 06:45:58 pm »

So, I recently started a new game as an irish minor.  Guess what happens by 1085?
England becomes Norway.
All of it was inherited, and they proceeded to take chunks out of tons of other places too.  I didn't see if those were wars or not, but that was some nice playing by the AI.
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pisskop

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Re: Crusader Kings 2 is released.
« Reply #2242 on: November 06, 2012, 07:08:06 pm »

Ive never played a 400 year game, but who can I expect to crumble or be likely to lose a piece of land?  HR seems pretty together, with only one truely large rebellion during my first game.  I regret to say I failed to take part in it. :(
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Re: Crusader Kings 2 is released.
« Reply #2243 on: November 06, 2012, 07:45:08 pm »

So, I recently started a new game as an irish minor.  Guess what happens by 1085?
England becomes Norway.
All of it was inherited, and they proceeded to take chunks out of tons of other places too.  I didn't see if those were wars or not, but that was some nice playing by the AI.
Harald Hardrada has a strong claim on the kingdom of England instead of a more historical weak one. This means that when Normandy takes England and it gets plunged into long civil wars either Harald or his sons come back and conquer the crap out of a much weakened England. This happens quite a lot in my games and it's often through Norwegian rule that England becomes the most stable/powerful.

EDIT: Found this on the forums, it will replace my nightmares.
« Last Edit: November 07, 2012, 12:47:05 am by Catastrophic lolcats »
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Duuvian

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Re: Crusader Kings 2 is released.
« Reply #2244 on: November 07, 2012, 03:59:38 am »

A key to defeating the Fatimids when I've fought them was to have a strong navy to transport your (hopefully near 10k at the very least) army to one of their remote counties. You'll probably have some allies available or else you did it wrong. Try to bribe the Fatimids into attacking somewhere else by waiting until there is about to be a succession there and sending the heir a gift. If you are lucky like I was he will be a minor when you move into the area. I sent him some Eastern European wives as betrothal and 20 gold and he's still distracted elsewhere now that he is an adult. I also keep my chancellor there to tell him I'm a really cool guy. Also if you can invite a lot of holy men to your court, you can sort of stun lock him by offering to marry your courtiers to his female courtiers. He runs out of female courtiers and princesses eventually though. He doesn't seem picky as to who he marries princesses to either as long as they can make babies eventually. The best thing is you get to keep the babies. I stalled him for long enough that way to have my Chancellor talk him out of an inevitable invasion of Israel. Some of his Princesses were really well educated too, and are now teachers for the next generation of landless cousin Piasts who might benefit from walking like an (Catholic) Egyptian in the off chance I find an opportunity to take the County of Cairo and all it's sweet, sweet holdings without having all the Shia nations jumping on me for my treachery.

Polrusalem lives on, though I'll probably wait for a few patches while they work on factions. Hopefully I can make my own, though maybe their thought is to require the expansion for that which is fair enough. I admit I screwed up in changing both crown laws and inheritance laws in Hungary and Poland on the ruler when he was likely to die and has a weird succession; but I thought his badasserry would make up for it and I could make a group of loyalists of the new generation who weren't ruling before I changed both laws at once. The minority younger generation of vassals who weren't in power at the time of approval of both the crown law change and the change to Primogeniture adore my 21 diplomatic but otherwise mediocre character. The older generation have despised him ever since he passed the laws.

The King is Hungarian Piast due being the son of the first Piast king of Poland who was himself the son of the first playable King of Poland. This King was born and educated in Hungary to a Hungarian mother and Polish turned Hungarian father. He and his father both were controlled by the AI for significant amounts of time, including his childhood education. As such, his stats are pretty terrible except for 21 diplomacy. Piasts control nearly everything East of Germany that isn't Muslim, though that AI part of the dynasty keeps breeding itself out of the Kingship of Rus by ending up with normal marriege princessess inherit and thus the children are non-Piast; which is of course unacceptable to the AI controlled Piast Dukes which results in having Rus-Piast-Queen brothers, nephew or cousin Dukes retake the crown through wars the next generation. Some Piasts minorities control Volga Bulgaria somehow; I assume through swapping relatives with Rus. Much of Volga Bulgaria, including the capital, are still Tengri which means eventually someone will probably take their lands though they are extensive for a half pagan state. If it's Rus that's not a problem since they are Piast also, but if it's those pesky Byzantines or Muslims who go expanding moderate power-heathen-ways my dynasty in Volga Bulgaria could either be wiped out eventually or become the Byzantine Emperers. Most likely though they'll be taken by Rus or the Horde if they ever arrive to face Ultra-Poland.

The weird succession is that the King's first son died after the king became king of Hungary and Poland and some lands in Italy, and also some in Russia and Finland which I grabbed while everyone was still beating up heathens. After the primary son died though, I earned Jerusalem from a Pope's Crusade, and also claimed Sicily on my own. I have another Crusade granted kingdom in either France or Spain but I can't recall which as it's brand new. I joined the timely Crusade because the vassals in Hungary and Poland were forming huge factions to take my crowns or become independant. These factions are made up almost solely of those Nobles ruling previous to my raise crown and set primogeniture succession law changes in as many of my Kingdoms as I could.

The problem is that the newer Kingdoms are split between all the sons. The old Kingdoms go to various grandsons or great grandsons. The heir I will continue as is going to receive the Kingdom of Jerusalem and the two duchies the King has in Israel. He also has a portrait of a Middle Easterner because the second wife of the King was a Fatimid Princess. Unfortunately, either because I don't have Sword of Islam or because it doesn't work on Catholic Hungarians, the heir does not show any sign of genealogical holiness. The Fatimid Princess also lost her Shia traits when the king asked her to convert to Catholicism.

What I'm going to try to do is educate my heir until he is 16; then give him all my titles and hope the vassals are less pissed at him than they are at me until my by then 70ish year old ruler dies. In addition it allows me to keep all my Kingdoms and territories instead of most of them splitting off and going independant. After that the heir will hopefully be able to lay non religious claim to Egypt or a caliphate or something else significant the Fatimids own. If not it's holy war for Sinai or perhaps whatever is still Sunni in Spain. At some point maybe I'll convert to a Religion I'll hastily look up on wikipedia if I get the chance, if it sounds ok and I am powerfull enough to withstand a Crusade or Jihad.



I started this by starting as a Piast and betrothing my first heir to the daughter of the Hungarian King. I expanded Poland at the expense of the small non-Christians states whenever they were collaborating against some kind of invader, whether German, Danish, Norwegian, or Russian. The young Hungarian royal sons then met with a surprising amount of accidents due to their personalities, which made their spymasters susceptible to bribes. Eventually the heir became King of Hungary, Heir to Poland. Poland's first ruler had at every opportunity claimed land from the local Pagan states, the immediately north of which are on the sea. It's crucial for Poland to have a Navy large enough to transport it's army to the Mediterranean; because you probably married Matylda the Italian Duchess and your Heir will have half of Italy which is conveniently situated adjacent to Rome. I took Rome as a second generation Piast female ruler once; I should have tried to make a puppet Piast Pope but that was a different game, which I lost the save of. The very first thing to do as Poland is to plot to kill your inept brother. He just screws everything up, every single time. Plus, you are his heir. Then plot to kill as many childless Polish dukes as you can as they all have you as their error before they have children (one was homosexual the last time, I dunno if that's set, but you don't have to kill him as his heir is you.) I ended up with two minor Dukes managing to reproduce before I could slay them outrageously, and only one produced a male child before he died. That male child was next after I betrothed his sister to a son of the king, and then Poland was either owned by me or to be inherited by girls to be married to my male children. I even had a female child left over to send to matrilinearly marry a daughter of a Duke in Novgorad and her progeny ended up forming the Kingdom of Rus. I had to compete with his descendants for Tengri land near Siberia before it was all taken by Russian states. The exception was the fairly large Kingdom of Volga Bulgaria, which was also ruled by Piasts. Luckily, that particularly Tengri branch of the Piast tree did not seem to mind Piast Rus and Polrusalem conquering their fellow Tengri states.
« Last Edit: November 07, 2012, 06:43:38 am by Duuvian »
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Dutchling

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Re: Crusader Kings 2 is released.
« Reply #2245 on: November 07, 2012, 05:54:07 am »

How are factions broken? I've never had a problem with it, even when I had a whopping -160 tyranny relations penalty with my vassals. Sure, there were a few plots, but they either didn't reach more than 20% strength or it was to press a claim for someone in my dungeon. I can execute the guy, and get an automatic white peace. It is actually better than the previous system as there are no more 'I hate you so I want to be independent' wars.
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Duuvian

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Re: Crusader Kings 2 is released.
« Reply #2246 on: November 07, 2012, 06:22:11 am »

I'd say that if I could lead my own faction as a ruler it would be OK if it would nullify some of the nobles who are sort of on the fence. I have nobles joining the independance faction who have an opinion of say 34 of me. However they might have an opinion of 56 or so for the faction leader. Since most of them are on the low end for me with most hovering just above positive the independance faction has recruited around 45%-55% of the manpower in my enormous territory due to the faction leader having all kinds of great traits and decent stats with good diplomacy and the best martial skill in the nations.  Meanwhile my ruler is a very skilled diplomat while failure at everything else due to being raised by a cruel AI father; with an attractive Egyptian Princess economic genius wife with claims on Sultanates who keeps having daughters after having one son who will be my heir.

I don't know; I suppose it's fair for raising the crown and succession laws at the same time and then hoping to last another 10 years as the same ruler, but it still seems like there ought to be a way to form your own faction of loyalists to draw away some of the supporters of the independance faction who seem to join because they don't have anything else to do sometimes, especially with all the prestige that particular King has.

I suppose I could give the heir his kingdoms a few years before he is an adult; but that would mean he is in charge of his own education and marriage which usually means he marries the closest cousin possible if it's like how my Polish nobles turned out.
« Last Edit: November 07, 2012, 06:51:27 am by Duuvian »
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micelus

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Re: Crusader Kings 2 is released.
« Reply #2247 on: November 07, 2012, 01:51:10 pm »

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Re: Crusader Kings 2 is released.
« Reply #2248 on: November 07, 2012, 03:27:31 pm »

So has anyone tried playing as a good guy vassal? Being extremely loyal to the king and helping him expand his kingdom without going independent or usurping the throne.

I tried it a few times but I really don't know what to do. I usually go down the marshal route and try to play as an El Cid like character. The main problem is proving myself because the king will almost always have you preforming menial tasks in his capital and also the fact that my own army always pales to that of the king's.
There's also the problem of deciding where to play. You need somewhere that has a lot of balanced factions fighting each other on smaller scales. You'd want to be next to heathens or heretics so there's room for you to expand. Starting near pagans will give you tribal raids to deal with for your liege. I'm thinking a duke in Denmark might be decent for these reasons.

I've also noticed that even with extremely high relations with the king he'll almost never give you more holdings. In a Castile game I helped to turn the tides of a holy war and the king honoured me by completely ignoring my efforts and granting the conquered land to some lowborn courtiers. The same scumbag king had me training troops in his capital when the crusades were called and I couldn't go off to join them, granting me the crusader trait. >:(

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