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Author Topic: Plenty of iron/coal Too much of a good thing?  (Read 2077 times)

Shurhaian

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Plenty of iron/coal Too much of a good thing?
« on: August 19, 2010, 06:56:20 am »

Let me start by stating that this thread is in no way a complaint. I find the situation described amusing, and maybe a tiny bit frustrating, but it's more good than bad, for certain.

I'm currently playing with Civilization Forge 2.23. My current map has sand, a stream, and reasonably abundant vegetation, and it's a good biome, so some of those trees are the quite valuable Silverwood.

When I dug down, I noticed several good stones. Dolomite - magma-safe, and good for flux. Bituminous coal and lignite. Limonite.

And then I noticed some more of them.

And then I found more. Mostly dolomite, with veins of mostly coal, but still enough limonite to be quite content.

Then, as I was getting my magma works in place, I found some sphalerite, and lots of cassiterite.

I wound up with over 700 bars of tin and a decent amount of zinc. My military(small yet, but I'll probably add another squad with the next migrant wave) is wearing head-to-toe steel, with crucible steel warhammers.

And yet through all this I have yet to find much in the way of other metals. A goodly portion of galena, some garnierite - but precious little of the other base metals, or indeed reliable veins of precious metal. No aluminum, no platinum. No magnetite nodes, alas - that would have been a great thing to dig out for my vault; excavate an entire magnetite cluster, line the pocket with steel walls and a few steel supports, seal it with steel doors, the works. Anyway, I have enough limonite that that's not crippling. But aside from one vein of tetrahedrite, I haven't found any copper ore to speak of - yet piles and piles of metal for alloying it.

I usually find plenty of copper but none of the alloy metals. Ironically, CivForge turns the weighting of copper to additive in those alloys from 1:1 to I think 4:1... if I was finding copper, I could try to import tin and zinc, and run with it. But no. Tin, zinc, and more tin.

Ever feel like you're getting too much of a good thing?
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Abaddon

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Re: Plenty of iron/coal Too much of a good thing?
« Reply #1 on: August 19, 2010, 07:41:04 am »

Coming from 40d into this version I was ecstatic about all the iron/bit. coal, then my second fortress I was less enthused... at this point I don't even bother mining out veins because I have sufficient amounts for a metal industry by just building my fortress as normal.

I'm currently fortifying my entrance with copper/bronze serrated metal disk traps.
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Josephus

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Re: Plenty of iron/coal Too much of a good thing?
« Reply #2 on: August 19, 2010, 08:07:54 am »

Have you been ambushed or besieged yet? Maybe you'll be able to put all that steel to good use.
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FleshForge

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Re: Plenty of iron/coal Too much of a good thing?
« Reply #3 on: August 19, 2010, 08:38:26 am »

Seems to me your embark is pretty much exactly as hard as you want it to be - if you want the challenge of less metals, there's certainly plenty of embark points where you won't have a lot of metal OR trees OR easy-access magma :)  Even if you don't have coal or surface trees, eventually you can make an underground tree farm unless you're terribly unlucky and there isn't enough water underground, and make renewable charcoal.
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existent

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Re: Plenty of iron/coal Too much of a good thing?
« Reply #4 on: August 19, 2010, 08:54:14 am »

Coming from 40d into this version I was ecstatic about all the iron/bit. coal, then my second fortress I was less enthused... at this point I don't even bother mining out veins because I have sufficient amounts for a metal industry by just building my fortress as normal.
This. I've never had to mine out a vein, except on rare occasions when it cut through the a cavern.
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krenshala

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Re: Plenty of iron/coal Too much of a good thing?
« Reply #5 on: August 19, 2010, 01:47:12 pm »

... you can make an underground tree farm unless you're terribly unlucky and there isn't enough water underground, and make renewable charcoal.
I have to ask ... to the Elves bitch about harvesting from underground tree farms?  If they didn't that would be a good way to avoid messing with them (if you didn't want to, that is  8)).
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abadidea

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Re: Plenty of iron/coal Too much of a good thing?
« Reply #6 on: August 19, 2010, 02:01:46 pm »

had a DF2010 fort where ALL the metal I could find was gold and silver. So much gold. I made everything out of it. Had to start buying bronze toys off the humans to try and make some armor. So yes, too much of a good thing  ;D
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Evergod41

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Re: Plenty of iron/coal Too much of a good thing?
« Reply #7 on: August 19, 2010, 02:31:35 pm »

... you can make an underground tree farm unless you're terribly unlucky and there isn't enough water underground, and make renewable charcoal.
I have to ask ... to the Elves bitch about harvesting from underground tree farms?  If they didn't that would be a good way to avoid messing with them (if you didn't want to, that is  8)).
they bitch about anything wood, even when (as i have found out) wood is 'created'.

I have so much iron and copper, it's not funny, The only precious metal I have is aluminum which is enough to make some pretty good rooms... NO coal, NO lignite, NO tin ores, NO flux, NO sand; and the good part, I hit cavern at -5Z. Im importing all of my flux, and tin, but the best part, no caravan (except dwarven) has left my lands alive, and suprizingly their deaths aren't by my hands, i've been cranking out so much rock crafts crap, the goblins are constantly ambushing. and even Goblinite isn't enough to satiate my hunger for steel and bronze...

Dahenk

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Re: Plenty of iron/coal Too much of a good thing?
« Reply #8 on: August 19, 2010, 07:20:06 pm »

Well after about 3 years in game time i began to ignore that adamantine strands were used for the hospital and i made gold bins to clear up the stockpiles. I get annoyed when the military uses something as useless as masterpiece steel weapons...
Very little platinum though but I don't bother too much :P

Water is a more scarce resource than adamantine atm...
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existent

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Re: Plenty of iron/coal Too much of a good thing?
« Reply #9 on: August 19, 2010, 07:20:53 pm »

You could always use Lofn's black lung mod to make coal more Fun.
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Shurhaian

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Re: Plenty of iron/coal Too much of a good thing?
« Reply #10 on: August 19, 2010, 08:32:16 pm »

I am not yet a sufficiently good player of the game that I need to make it any harder on myself than I already have. :) I already have trouble dealing with even small ambushes - mostly because I try to push for a full steelworking industry, and it takes too long, rather than finding a suitable solution before that.
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Dahenk

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Re: Plenty of iron/coal Too much of a good thing?
« Reply #11 on: August 19, 2010, 09:06:54 pm »

I am not yet a sufficiently good player of the game that I need to make it any harder on myself than I already have. :) I already have trouble dealing with even small ambushes - mostly because I try to push for a full steelworking industry, and it takes too long, rather than finding a suitable solution before that.
Learn some fun ideas for traps or make up your own ideas. cage traps are very efficient but ultimately rather boring.

my latest trap is one i got from the wiki.

I've built a spiral of walls, dug a 5 Z lvls deep spiral-shaped pit under the walkway of the spiral, and then covered the hole with bridges.
almost at the center of the spiral i left one tile un-channeled and placed a pressure plate linked to all those bridges.
in the center of the spiral is a chained animal (usually a kitten. that'll put them to some use at least)
at the bottom of the pit i have upright spears in a spiral =)

now when the goblins/kobold/whatever try to enter the fortress, they will suddenly hear a meow from inside the weird building and get that unstoppable urge of mutilating a kitten.
I actually found an ambush AFTER they had fallen down the pit. got a bloody surprise when i was gonna pick up the trash from the earlier spotted ambush when i found a few more unconcious goblins in there. "An ambush! Curse them!" turns out they had already been cursed =D
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shadowform

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Re: Plenty of iron/coal Too much of a good thing?
« Reply #12 on: August 20, 2010, 01:48:13 am »

I'm actually on a map with no iron right now - I'm having to import whatever I want to use.  I am getting lots of gold (and ridiculous amounts of copper, as well as plenty of silver), but the gold thing is good since I'm using it to build the towers in my mighty wall.
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Abaddon

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Re: Plenty of iron/coal Too much of a good thing?
« Reply #13 on: August 20, 2010, 03:00:55 am »

I am not yet a sufficiently good player of the game that I need to make it any harder on myself than I already have. :) I already have trouble dealing with even small ambushes - mostly because I try to push for a full steelworking industry, and it takes too long, rather than finding a suitable solution before that.
Learn some fun ideas for traps or make up your own ideas. cage traps are very efficient but ultimately rather boring.

my latest trap is one i got from the wiki.

I've built a spiral of walls, dug a 5 Z lvls deep spiral-shaped pit under the walkway of the spiral, and then covered the hole with bridges.
almost at the center of the spiral i left one tile un-channeled and placed a pressure plate linked to all those bridges.
in the center of the spiral is a chained animal (usually a kitten. that'll put them to some use at least)
at the bottom of the pit i have upright spears in a spiral =)

now when the goblins/kobold/whatever try to enter the fortress, they will suddenly hear a meow from inside the weird building and get that unstoppable urge of mutilating a kitten.
I actually found an ambush AFTER they had fallen down the pit. got a bloody surprise when i was gonna pick up the trash from the earlier spotted ambush when i found a few more unconcious goblins in there. "An ambush! Curse them!" turns out they had already been cursed =D

Are those spears linked to anything?  The way you describe it they're just constructed, which wont damage enemies if they just fall on them (The same way it wont damage your dwarves to walk on them if they aren't being powered)
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mnjiman

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Re: Plenty of iron/coal Too much of a good thing?
« Reply #14 on: August 20, 2010, 03:37:31 am »

You can pretty much decide what your map will have depending on the layers.. you can find a map easily with no Iron at all, if you find the right layers.
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I was thinking more along the lines of this legendary champion, all clad in dented and dinged up steel plate, his blood-drenched axe slung over his back, a notch in the handle for every enemy that saw the swing of that blade as the last sight they ever saw, a battered shield strapped over his arm... and a fluffy, pink stuffed hippo hidden discretely in his breastplate.
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