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Author Topic: Flow  (Read 2021 times)

Sphalerite

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Re: Flow
« Reply #15 on: August 17, 2010, 02:20:24 pm »

No, because then you will end up with a bunch of 7/7 water that wont move your wheels at all, as the pumps will just be teleporting the water to the outflow.
7/7 water can have flow for purposes of turning water wheels, I've had many water plants with solid 7/7 under them turning happily.  It won't push objects, but it will turn wheels.  I don't know exactly what is used to determine if water is flowing however,.
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Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex... It takes a touch of genius --- and a lot of courage to move in the opposite direction.

jfsh

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Re: Flow
« Reply #16 on: August 17, 2010, 02:31:34 pm »

Power transfers through the gear assemblies above the pump/waterwheel setup.  Each is controlled by a lever, so I can isolate, say, 3 units only.  This is handy for kickstarting it back into operation if it goes offline (like if it overloads), or just for keeping it as lightweight as possible.

I just thought of a possible improvement to that design - reorganize the mechanical linkage on Z+1 so that the generators are connected in parallel instead of in series (see below), then place a pressure plate on each pump's output tile, set it to be triggered by water of depth 2-7, then link it to the pre-toggled gear assembly above the pump. The result will be that each generator will only transmit power to the rest of the system as long as it's actually running - if the water level on the output tile drops below 2/7 for more than 100 steps (which generally shouldn't happen as long as it's running), the pressure plate will release and disconnect the generator so its water wheels will stop dragging down the rest of the system.

Code: [Select]
###############
 #*   *   *   *#
 #|   |   |   |#
##|   |   |   |#
#**===*===*===*#
#||   |   |   |#
#||   |   |   |#
#|*   *   *   *#
#|##############

That's a smart improvement!  I figured there were more clever ways to build this, but it was my first time through.  It might make it tricky to turn it back on, though.  I usually only have to fire up one, and then I bootstrap on the rest in 3-4 unit segments.  If the pumps automatically disconnect themselves from the grid when not running, they won't be able to be started by nearby pumps.  I'm sure there's a solution to that problem...  I would definitely be interested in figuring out ways to have them auto-start, as well.  Using a dwarf to manually start them is actually pretty quick and easy, but I'm a perfectionist. ;)

As the wiki notes, you can also have all the gears and linkages on the Z level, but I find it to be a cleaner design if I separate out the components.

No, because then you will end up with a bunch of 7/7 water that wont move your wheels at all, as the pumps will just be teleporting the water to the outflow.
7/7 water can have flow for purposes of turning water wheels, I've had many water plants with solid 7/7 under them turning happily.  It won't push objects, but it will turn wheels.  I don't know exactly what is used to determine if water is flowing however,.

Maybe those were tiles with intrinsic flow (e.g. connected to a brook)?  I didn't seem to get power on one of the numerous times I accidentally flooded the system - it sits beneath a very, very deep lake - but I had other concerns at the time.  I know for sure that when a level was filled with 7/7 water, it did not have flow.

Sphalerite

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Re: Flow
« Reply #17 on: August 17, 2010, 02:34:27 pm »

7/7 water can have flow for purposes of turning water wheels, I've had many water plants with solid 7/7 under them turning happily.  It won't push objects, but it will turn wheels.  I don't know exactly what is used to determine if water is flowing however,.

Maybe those were tiles with intrinsic flow (e.g. connected to a brook)?  I didn't seem to get power on one of the numerous times I accidentally flooded the system - it sits beneath a very, very deep lake - but I had other concerns at the time.  I know for sure that when a level was filled with 7/7 water, it did not have flow.
It could have something to do with that, the times I've had waterwheels working over 7/7 water have been the times I've had a water source coming directly from a river, and the most recent time I tried to build a self-contained water reactor it shut down when the water reached 7/7.  It may be that flow from pumps is treated differently than flow from rivers somehow.
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Cotes

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Re: Flow
« Reply #18 on: August 17, 2010, 02:40:26 pm »

Just wondering, would it help to have a greater inflow than outflow? Either by pumping into 5 tile wide channel with 7 (or more) pumps or by making the drain only (4 or less) tiles wide?


No, because then you will end up with a bunch of 7/7 water that wont move your wheels at all, as the pumps will just be teleporting the water to the outflow.

Water does not follow any sort of intuitive rules in DF, unfortunately.
In the case of making the outflow smaller than the channel maybe, but adding more pressure with extra pumps shouldn't clog the system.
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gtmattz

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Re: Flow
« Reply #19 on: August 17, 2010, 05:18:29 pm »

The reasoning behind my statement is that once water has been pumped it loses any 'built in' flow that it had from being part of a river/brook/stream.  Water that is directly connected to a natural flowing source will always have flow, but once it has been pumped the flow only seems to happen while the water is between 4/7 and 6/7, and sporadically at that.  When you take a bunch of pumps and pump an area full of 7/7 water, any additional water actually teleports to the nearest non 7/7 tile, meaning that all those 7/7's behind the pumps have no flow associated with them.
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