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[Khift]

This tech is going straight into my training arena; if a squirrely goblin tries to escape, it triggers the one way hatch and either stops and turns back around or falls in and is rerouted back into the arena for my military to chase. No more need for locking doors or pulling drawbridges and watching for shift rotations so the hungry, thirsty, and tired dwarves can do recuperate -- they'll be able to do it on their own using one of two possible entrances to the arena and I'll be able to almost fully automate the system.

[darkrider2]

I only read OP but OMG you are a genius. I love it all.

[Bryan Derksen]

I think there's a very simple solution to goblins that happen to fall down through the hatches; simply have a tunnel leading from the bottom of the pit back up into the middle of the grinder. A goblin that falls down there will pathfind his way back up into the grinder, but no goblins will deliberately pathfind their way down into the pit via this tunnel since it's just a dead end as far as they're concerned.

No escape.

[gimlisonofgloin]

Simple design, just add a downward stairs in the middle, with a matching upward stairs, and fill the lower pit with traps as well.
 
Floor 1:    ¢^^>^^¢
Floor 2:    ^^^<^^^

[Satarus]

I have found the safest and most efficient way to be rid of goblins is to drop them 10ish Z levels to their deaths via bridges linked to pressure plates.  However this won't thwart flying mounts so have some traps (with a ceiling over them) at the other end to finish those off.

[James.Denholm]

Heh, heh, heh... This sure has given me a few ideas.

[ledgekindred]

I think there's a very simple solution to goblins that happen to fall down through the hatches; simply have a tunnel leading from the bottom of the pit back up into the middle of the grinder. A goblin that falls down there will pathfind his way back up into the grinder, but no goblins will deliberately pathfind their way down into the pit via this tunnel since it's just a dead end as far as they're concerned.

No escape.

Yea, up to my current fort I wasn't taking into account grinder setup until much later, where I would run out of effective spaces to set it up.  On this one, I took that into account right away so it's got plenty of room for underground tunnels to catch and cage or kill anyone unlucky enough to fall through the pit.  I've placed more space between the entrance and the first set of traps to hopefully catch an entire siege before the stragglers panic at the first group getting slaughtered and run away.  The latest version is a long hallway that leads into a large room with another hatch holding them in the room and scattered traps on the floor rather than a channel right into a deathtrap.  It's funnier to see the goblins start to panic and run around the room, unable to escape, while randomly tripping into traps and getting churned into goblinburger.

 

[krenshala]

I wonder if you can set up a drawbridge as your main entrance, and have it raised by pressure plate, with the result that invaders then path into the auto-grinder?

Also, you could have it so if something falls into the hatch, it has a path back out towards the entrance (to the grinder) of your fort, but that path is also lined with pressure plate triggered traps.  Nobody would path into that since there aren't any ramps/stairs UP from it (basically a dead end, with some places you can fall into it), and things that fall into it would auto-path out, and (in theory) if they survived walking out they would path right back into the grinder since it is the only way they see into the fortress.

[expwnent]

Everyone so far seems focused on the enemy grinding systems, but I think that the high-speed trigger part of this has a lot of potential.

This is the original design:

Code: [Select]

#D#    D = Door
#H#
#^##     <--- Attached to the adjacent hatches
#HD#
#^##     <--- This plate is linked to whatever you want to trigger
#HD#
#^##     <--- Attached to the adjacent hatches
#H#
#D#
But I've tested this simpler one and it seems to work.

Code: [Select]

#H#
#^# (both pressure plates are attached to adjacent hatches)
#D#
#^#
#H#

You can put doors on the ends, too if you want. If what's inside is hostile, doors will be necessary if dwarves are ever going to walk past.

I've found that this still gives disappointingly high latency between when you unforbid the door and when the creature walks to the other plate. Typically, it takes about 35 frames between when you signal and when the dog actually starts moving. But sometimes, it'll take over a hundred frame for it to even start moving. Using captured hostiles makes it always take about 35 frames, but the following design makes it even faster.

Code: [Select]

D#####D
#H###H#
##^#^##
###D###
##^####
#H#####
D######

Here's the same one with spaces instead of #:

Code: [Select]

D     D
 H   H
  ^ ^ 
   D   
  ^   
 H     
D     


Leave the lowest door forbidden, and all the others unforbidden. The goblin will pace back and forth between the two upper pressure gates. This makes the goblin "primed" for pathing, if you will. When you're ready to trigger the bottom pressure gate, unforbid the bottom door. I've found it takes about 25 frames. Sometimes. But I've only tested each one a few times, and it varies a lot.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

I hypothesize that if you captured a demon and used it in this way, it would be even faster, since demons try to path to the surface. But I've never captured one, because you have to knock them out first which is really tricky.

[Fenwah]

I'm glad someone is interested in the switches, since even the most carefully designed trap system can be brought down when levers go unpulled for too long.

My design is a bit overly complex I suppose, because they were originally designed to work with a magma dumping trap where the signal needed to be a well timed pulse. I designed it to automatically capture the dog so that theres no chance of it running back. I was originally just going to use a few doors and manually forbid them when the dog was in the right place, but the one way floors allowed me to trap it automatically.

Also, your work with improving the response time gives me an idea. Try using dogs, but rather than forbidding the doors, toggle them between pet passable and tightly closed. In a wiki page about dwarfputing with animals I read that animals will try to path through tightly closed doors continuously, even though they can't get through. See if that gets you better response times.

EDIT: Just tested this quickly, and it seems to work pretty well. I cant give quantitative results as to how long it takes them, but it seems to be faster

As for demons, they have trap avoid, flying and building destroyer, so they would not be a good choice for use ing a switch....

[Corsec]

I read somewhere on these forums that retracting bridges used over solid floor will throw creatures without blocking their pathfinding. May not be true now, but if it is...

My idea for a gravity trap is to force goblins to travel in alternating directions along z-stacked single-width corridors covered with retracting bridges.

From side-
/ or \ = ramp or stair
_ = single-width floor with retracting bridge over it

\____________
 ____________/
\____________
etc as far down as needed

Most importantly, there is open space immediately to the side of all bridges

From the top-
O =  open space
F = floor with retracting bridge over it, as far as desired
w = wall
R = Up *OR* down Ramp (or stair)

OOOOOOOOOOOOO
WRFFFFFFFFFFFRW
OOOOOOOOOOOOO
...stacked on top of each other for many z-levels until last level (killing floor) is just plain floor with no open space.

The retracting bridges are attached to a fluid repeater. For extra convenience, attach a 'master' lever to control both the repeater and entry to the system. Only one lever thus controls the whole system.

Naturally, the goblins are thrown off the bridges and fall down the sides. Upright spear traps (which can't be dodged if fallen upon when in the upright position) are placed in the areas the goblins will land. To increase lethality add more z-levels to the fall from the last bridge traps to the kiling floor, ensuring walking access from bridges to killing floor remains. To bring the goblins in, place bait on the killing floor. This system should work on creatures with the trapavoid tag.

It'd also be wise to place weapon/cage traps in the last corridor to deal with possible survivors who were quick enough from ramp to ramp. Survivors are less likely with longer corridors and quicker repeaters. Also, the walls can be fortified to allow marksdwarves to fire in. Ballistas would work great in these long corridors and help deal with the megabeast problem.

Bridges won't retract if megabeasts are on top, so use building-bait branched off before the first bridge to entice them to walk over cage/weapon traps rather than the bridges. This will be less effective if building destroyers don't attack the nearest building first. To deal with flying creatures coming in, place the statue/creature bait in a corridor off from the killing floor and stuff the corridor with weapon/cage traps. If there are flying, building-destroyers creatures with the trapavoid tag, then you're pretty much screwed anyway...aren't you?

For extra convenience, use magma to clean the killing floor while killing anyone who reaches the bait on the bottom level. Make sure the lever that lets magma in will close the route back upwards. Place killing floor near magma furnaces, perhaps on same z-level.

I'm also toying with another idea of letting goblins walk down a very long up/down stairwell, and manually flushing water downwards from a cistern at the top to force them to fall the whole way down and land in a spike pit.

I have some questions-
How long will it take for a retracting bridge to respond to a pressure plate?
How far will a goblin have to fall for his body to disintegrate? How far to disintegrate his weapons?
Will building destroyers attack the nearest building first?

[Hans Lemurson]

I tried to make an "livestock only" zone using pressure plates triggered by citizens but with a carefully selected minimum weight.  It turns out I cut it too close with my minimum-weight designations and ended up with one of my stockier dwarves trapped in there as well.

Then I learned that your milkers will take animals out of cages to milk them and then put them back again, and the entire effort was rendered moot.

I have yet to build a full-fledged goblin-grinder though, since I'm really not sure where it lies in terms of an "exploit".  I think I'll just go ahead and try it and see that it is super-awesome and never go back.  I'm also thinking that it would probably be a good idea to place this near my archer range, but a ballista-alley is tempting too.

[Urist Imiknorris]

Weapon trap with a single base-quality adamantine warhammer.

[mrtspence]

Weapon trap with a single base-quality adamantine warhammer.

That is, literally, a grinder. Would take eons to kill them xD

[The Grackle]

Some great ideas in this thread; can't wait to try them out. 

Pressure plates go ON/OFF as as creatures pass over them, but you can't make them stay on. (right?)  But to do that you could have a pressure plate linked to a hatch in a remote 1x1 room with a dog in it. One z level down you have another pressure plate in a 1x1 room, so the dog falls and triggers it and keeps it on.  It would be good for sealing a front door once invaders are so far inside, etc.  Or you could have it dump a dog from a holding cell down into your repeater-hallway for extra automation.  Then the invaders would turn it on and the player would high-speed turn it off whenever he wanted.