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[jaked122]

complexity is the only reason I play DF, there's not a single more needlessly complex game out there.(at least for free).
besides DF has to be the best game in terms of complexity.
however I always say, "everything is complex unless you understand what drives it".
I don't believe in such things as complexity, the rules of the universe are so incredibly simple, they all work together to create what we see, and it is only complex to some of us because we don't understand the rules well enough.

[Teldin]

It's somehow not surprising to me that most of the players who still play this game have (I'm assuming mostly self-diagnosed) Aspergers.

My point was not to make a comparison between very simple games like SimCity (which was mentioned a few times) but in comparing DF to itself. How many players is DF pushing away because it just gets harder and harder to play as time goes on? Not necessarily just due to the increasingly arcane UI.

Also for the passive-aggressive cheap shots: I am not saying it's difficult for me to play. I've been playing everything up to the new one just fine. I just look back at playing 2D and I find I had more fun that than the latest version, that's all.

[Syff]

It's somehow not surprising to me that most of the players who still play this game have (I'm assuming mostly self-diagnosed) Aspergers.

It's somehow not surprising to me that most of the people who criticize this game insinuate that anyone who enjoys it must have some form of disorder to do so.

(while I won't argue that it doesn't exist, asperger's syndrome has become such a horribly over-cited scapegoat for any kind of nerdy behavior that it's no longer relevant to anything.)

[GTM]

I'm going to emerge from lurking to offer a different perspective here.

From what I've picked up from DF Talk and the status updates, DF is almost like an act of rebellion against simplification and streamlining in games.  It wouldn't make a lot of sense for DF to simplify, since it's the complexity that draws most players in and gives it its unique character.  When DF is done and Tarn adds tutorials and polish, it'll be a lot more accessible anyway.

But then again, there are a lot of people who want to get into DF now but are unable to because of the graphics/ui/complexity/learning curve.  I wonder if Tarn were to load up the last version of DF before adding Z levels, slap on some mouse support, and post it on the site as "Dwarf Fortress Junior" or "DF: Boatmurdered Edition" and use it as a gateway drug to get people into the real DF.  It'd be a great way to include more people and put more cool stories out there into the world. 

[breadbocks]

I agree with GTM. The complexity and nonsensical bugs are what are attractive to a lot of the people here. Make a simpler game and use it to introduce people to DF.

[Aribar Hunter]

(Note that I haven't played the Fortress mode for the latest releases, only the Arena and Adventurer modes.)

Personally, I would prefer the hypothetical bug-free 2D version. It actually seemed like a game with milestones and goals in it. It was nice setting up farming or depending upon the floods instead of easily having endless amounts of food in the 3D version. I liked having different, distinct areas and features as I progressed deeper into the mountain. The 3D version of Fortress mode just seems like a boring sandbox builder with numerous features that I don't really care about. There's other games out there that I prefer for this kind of thing, so I've more or less ignored the Fortress mode since the 3D release.

[jaked122]

It's somehow not surprising to me that most of the players who still play this game have (I'm assuming mostly self-diagnosed) Aspergers.

My point was not to make a comparison between very simple games like SimCity (which was mentioned a few times) but in comparing DF to itself. How many players is DF pushing away because it just gets harder and harder to play as time goes on? Not necessarily just due to the increasingly arcane UI.
Also for the passive-aggressive cheap shots: I am not saying it's difficult for me to play. I've been playing everything up to the new one just fine. I just look back at playing 2D and I find I had more fun that than the latest version, that's all.

I wasn't self diagnosed, however complexity is something that aspergers like to toy around with(if my own interests are at all representative or consistant with the majority of asbergers people).
besides, DF has a niche, it is happy there, and it is filled with loving fans who donate frequently enough for toady to make it his life.

[Ahp77]

Am I the only one who remembers reading that the Toady One would write a more comprehensive manual? If he does, I vote Complex. If not, I still vote Complex.

[Toady One]

Well, never mind then, I guess. Back to your spreadsheets, gentlemen.

It's all right to criticize the game.  This quote is ostensibly more criticism of the game than people that play it, though it is moving in the wrong direction.  And then we arrive at...

It's somehow not surprising to me that most of the players who still play this game have (I'm assuming mostly self-diagnosed) Aspergers.

This is out of line.  It was reported.  If the OP can't be polite in their own thread, the thread is locked.