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[Teldin]

Let's theoretically say that there was a recent release of old-school 2D Dwarf Fortress, back when you had a single cliff heading east, then your river, chasm, magma layers. Let's say all those old, horrible bugs were fixed (oh god channels), the dwarves had personalities, there was a vastly simplified UI, and so on. A lot of today's stuff.

Would you prefer that over the present day's 3D DF, with all the increasingly-complex mechanisms for playing? The new military, for example, is almost incomprehensible, but that may just be because it's so buggy.

Personally, I would prefer a much more simplified, streamlined DF with high FPS and less complexity. Think about it: what is DF going to look like in 5 years from now? An Aspergian nightmare of commands-within-commands, letting you trim individual dwarven nose hairs? Or would you prefer a simpler, intuitive game?

This is an honest question: simple or complex?

ps. saying "both" is cheating.


Also: hi guys! I'm back again!

[Diablous]

Complex!

[Capntastic]

I'd like a complex game that's also streamlined and has a more coherent UI.   Being able to do what you want and being able to get it queued up quickly are both important.

[Dakk]

Complex. Current DF just needs a UI overhaul.

[Salabasama]

Complex, of course.  For me at least, the complexity is what draws me in.  In most cases, I tend to come to hate place-management type games, because of the lack of complexity, yet in this one case it's my favorite game of all.

[Exponent]

Rather than using the adjective "simplified", I'd recommend "focused".  Focus still allows depth, and in my opinion often promotes high quality depth.  Lack of focus on the other hand can lead to low quality complexity.  Given that perspective, it should be no surprise that I'd like to see a lot more focus and depth in DF development.

[Urist Imiknorris]

Complexity is rewarding once you adapt to it. As someone else said (roughly) elsewhere on the forum:

I like DF because after learning how to play, I'm too elitist to consider not liking it.

The introduction of the z-axis, while adding complexity, opened up new options and playstyles. The new military and medical systems, while complicated and kinda buggy, have the same potential. For instance, in 40d you had to screw around and forbid absolutely everything to get your dwarves to use the right equipment. Now you just tell them what to use. The hospital and wound changes gave a future to those who have had their hand cut off, as opposed to 40d, where they would spontaneously pass out every so often because of a missing finger. The complications are justified, and the reward is worth the bugfixing and learning.

Besides, DF players' mentality can be described as "SCIENCE," the way a zombie's would be defined as "brains." We crave knowledge, and if we don't understand how to do something, we try random things until it works. We conquer the unknown every day, what's so hard about understanding a bunch of menus?

Tip: When in menus, look for green letters. The things next to them tell you what pressing that key does.

[yarr]

Complex+1

Sorry OP

[Chicken Launcher]

An Aspergian nightmare of commands-within-commands, letting you trim individual dwarven nose hairs?

Might just be me, but that actually sounds pretty awesome.

[Diablous]

An Aspergian nightmare of commands-within-commands, letting you trim individual dwarven nose hairs?

Might just be me, but that actually sounds pretty awesome.

That does sound awesome.

[Urist Imiknorris]

An Aspergian nightmare of commands-within-commands, letting you trim individual dwarven nose hairs?

Might just be me, but that actually sounds pretty awesome.

That does sound awesome.

As an Aspie, I lend my support to this idea.

[cowofdoom78963]

Of course you're mainly going to get complex, as anyone who plays dwarf fortress regularly has to already be somewhat of a fan of complexity.

[Makbeth]

An Aspergian nightmare of commands-within-commands, letting you trim individual dwarven nose hairs?

Might just be me, but that actually sounds pretty awesome.

That does sound awesome.

As an Aspie, I lend my support to this idea.

Has anyone ever done a survey of how many aspies there are on these forums?

On-topic, I'm more into complexity for the sake of gameplay than for the sake of complexity, so I can't really say one way or the other.  I don't use the military schedules much, but I love the control over equipment and burrows in .31.  I also think improved cave-ins and bouyancy would be awesome.  But, I would like the option of saying "Make me a steel battle axe" and the game queuing up the entire job list for it, from magnetite, coal, and limestone to finished product, just to speed the game along.  I've still never produced homemade clothes for the reason that it's just not something I want to attend to every step of.

[crucifier]

leave it as complicated as it is, just make more intuitive decisions with the AI and interface.  AI is terrible, i cant stop my dwarves from endlessly collecting corpses outside my fort without locking them in.  i know i could set them to not collect, but then one might die inside my fort and i wont notice, miasma and everyone goes crazy.  there should be a designation for corpse/item removal, if there is one someone please tell me lol.  the bad thing is though, even if i set them to not collect corpses, all the corpses outside my walls are already unforbidden and my dwarves will collect them anyway.

[Urist McDepravity]

Definitely complex. Moreover, I find current implementation too simple on most areas. Singe type of 'steel'? No rust? Lack of supply/demand cost? Even stuff like bodyparts could enjoy some more complex design, like proper metabolism and neural activity simulation. Attributes are simplification.
Oh, and, obviously, complex magic. That one should be even more awesome.

The new military, for example, is almost incomprehensible, but that may just be because it's so buggy.

It just takes few days to get accustomed to it, but once you do it, you will love it.
Alerts and uniforms are great ideas. If only dorfs would stop generating bad thoughts after switches...