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[Rkui]

Hi, i have few of those beasts wandering in my cavern, and some don't seam to have head... I already killed one (with head), but i needed to reload a saved game, Ho horror!!!
Anyway i won't do this again, i promise 

So i need to make some efficient trap for them.

The first beast i killed had wings so it jumped my walls, the few others i have now don't have wings so i'm thinking about making a pool like trap, maybe put in the center some chained animal or goblin to attract them. I never used those pressure plate, but i guess i would need those right?
In anycase it won't work with winged beast, any one have some good trap design for those, would a door with lever stop them? if this work maybe i can trap them behind some fortifications to have my marks dwarf train, mayeb a big room on more z level?

I wonder now if you can trap them in an ordinary cage trap since i have 2giants caged already, i didn't manage to have the giantess, had to kill her, i was thinking about breeding them, but i missed it.

And last question would 2 of those beast fight each other if they get close? I also taught of setting free one of the giant in the middle of a gobos siege just for the fun, i really should try this to train the giants a bit.

[Nil Eyeglazed]

They don't set off traps.  Not cage traps, not even pressure plates.

They destroy doors with levers.

Many of them have ranged attacks far in excess of what your marksdwarfs are capable of.

They don't fight each other, but sometimes they end up killing each other accidentally via secretions.

Your best bet is to wall off the underground.  If you don't want to do that, it's going to take some creative traps.

Here's something I do:

Code: [Select]

____bb_________________
    \___________________^+XMAGMA

That's a retracting bridge blocking off a ramp access.  Below is a pressure plate set to go off on 0 magma.  It sits in front of a door and a floodgate.  The floodgates just so I can reuse the trap.  I also have a lever linked to the bridge and the floodgate, and both start open.

The FB is lured into the hallway by the door.  When it destroys the door, magma spills over the pressure plate, closing the bridge.

[Creamcorn]

Well, all creatures, regardless of coding origin, are susceptible to all forms of traps unconscious.

Just make this.

Key
X= Cave floor
^= Cage Traps
I= Support beam

XXX Zlvl2
XXX
XXX

^^^ ZLvl3
^I^
^^^

When you FB knocks over the column, he should bring the floor crashing up top him. Personally I've never tried this design on a FB; it's been floating around the forum for years actually. Make sure caveins are on in your init text, here's more on cave ins.

[rodya_mirov]

Cave-ins don't just knock a critter out - they completely obliterate it.  Even unkillables.

[Double A]

Well, all creatures, regardless of coding origin, are susceptible to all forms of traps unconscious.

Just make this.

Key
X= Cave floor
^= Cage Traps
I= Support beam

XXX Zlvl2
XXX
XXX

^^^ ZLvl3
^I^
^^^

When you FB knocks over the column, he should bring the floor crashing up top him. Personally I've never tried this design on a FB; it's been floating around the forum for years actually. Make sure caveins are on in your init text, here's more on cave ins.

This is your only guaranteed kill.

Works for megabeasts too, but then you can't get their valuable corpses. Although, losing 1500 dorfbucks beats losing a fortress to a Bronze Colossus.

[Nil Eyeglazed]

I've said this in another thread-- but I've made support traps to bait FBs, and the FBs don't destroy the supports.  The come up and destroy every door next to the support, but leave the support.  I think the support thing might just be a good idea that's based on previous versions that doesn't work.

But a support trap isn't your only guaranteed kill.  An obsidian trap is also a guaranteed kill.  Some modification of the building destroyer pressure plate trap can be made to make an automatic obsidian trap:

Code: [Select]

    #water  #
    #bbbbbbb#
    #magma  #
    #bbbbbbb#     notice that that last "b" on this line is a separate bridge from the first 7 bs--- this is to prime the area behind the door below with magma
#####bb__^+_#
_____/

The trap needs to be longer than this, because there's going to be a delay, and you don't want the beast escaping the trap.  You have a basic trap hallway, with magma dripping down from above, but held behind a door.  Immediately above is magma held in place with a retracting bridge; and above that, water held in place with another retracting bridge.

The only automated part needs to be the pressure plate and the lowest bridge, to trap the beast.  The rest can be done at leisure with levers.  If you really want to automate the way it goes off, it's possible.  You'll need an extra pressure plate, linked to both magma bridges and to the water bridge, which is set to go off on 1+ magma.  Just be sure to build the magma bridges BEFORE you build the pressure plate, and the water bridge AFTER you build the pressure plate, so that the water drops a tick after the magma.

Reloading the trap can't be automated.  You'll need to dig out the obsidian and install a new door.  Magma reload isn't pictured, but can be added on to the magma level, which is inaccessible to forgotten beasts.

If you really, really want to get a FB in a cage trap, and, as I suspect, they don't target supports, you're going to build a complicated, one use trap:

Code: [Select]


from side:

  bbbbbbb_^X_#
/#       ^^^S

top:
           ###
  bbbbbbb_^X #
           ###

top, z-1:
        ^^^
/#          S
        ^^^


In other words-- you have to make an artificial cistern to hold water, held up by a support.  A pressure plate is build on constructed floors, such that it triggers the support when the cistern is broken into.  Not pictured is the fact that you need a long passage of constructed floors held up only by the support-based constructions, because there's going to be a delay.  One z-level below this long passage, you have cage traps-- not directly underneath the constructed floors, but on either side, because when the floors collapse, the'll destroy anything underneath them.

So when the FB penetrates your artificial cistern, it triggers the support, and drops the beast.  Since the beast isn't getting anything collapsed on it, it suffers falling damage only, but the dust knocks it out, and the beast will be scattered a square.  6 of the 9 squares it can be scattered to contain cage traps.  Not perfect, but I'm pretty sure it's the best that can be done.

[Hyndis]

A cave-in definitely works. You can rig up floors held up by supports and nothing else. All building destroyers will bring about their own doom. This works wonderfully as a passive defense against building destroyers, such as FB's.

Downside is that resetting the trap takes a lot of work, but you don't get a FB that often.

You could even chain an animal up behind a bunch of these traps as bait. Seal off the rest of your fortress with drawbridges. Open up the trap chamber with the dog chained up. FB goes to attack the dog but on the way there is destroys the supports, bringing the roof down on top of its own head, killing it.

[Nil Eyeglazed]

If I'm mistaken, and FBs destroy supports, then the FB cage trap becomes much simpler:

Code: [Select]

side:

#####
  bbS        support is built on a constructed floor, attached to ceiling
/# ^^^

top, z and z-1 shown:
 # ^^^
/#bbS^
 # ^^^

And you've got 8/9 to cage the bugger...

[Quietust]

Well, all creatures, regardless of coding origin, are susceptible to all forms of traps unconscious.

Trouble is, it is 100% impossible to render a forgotten beast unconscious - they have [NOPAIN], [NOSTUN], [NONAUSEA], [NOFEAR], [NOEXERT], [NO_DIZZINESS], and [NO_FEVERS]. This same combination of tags (mostly) was also present on the Spirit of Fire in 40d and earlier, which is why you couldn't use cave-ins to trap them in cages the way you could with the other demon types.

This also applies to all titans and all demons.

As already mentioned, though, dropping a cave-in directly on top of a creature will kill it instantly, 100% guaranteed.

[CognitiveDissonance]

I'd go for an obsidian trap. If designed right, it's fully reusable, and you get obsidian!

Or, design the "trap" from glass, and seal it off with water inside. Give your dwarves a nice terrarium, with their own collection of forgotten beasts.

[Nil Eyeglazed]

What about using giant cave spider webs to get a FB in a cage trap?

[Rkui]

I think i don't want to kill them, i'll rather trap them or lock them in a kind of room or labyrinth.
I want to make them usefull if i can, so if i can use the fact they are almost unkillable it would be even better.

So can they swim in magma, and can a raised bridge stop them? Sorry for the spoiler, maybe i should just test it myself and shut up...

Most beast are easy to kill, but as i said one of them was really a pain, i think i got a lucky roll in my second attempt, so i managed to cut his head, but i don't want to risk further, i already know my fort is wide open now to them.
At first I used a labyrinth kind of room to give me time to wall the access of the cavern (its not to lost them inside since they have computed pathing, but rather to give me time to wall, so its not a labyrinth, its just a very long corridor packed in a room), but i replace it with floodgates so i have wider and easier access...
I also walled the inside of the cavern thinking i was safe, but i didn't walled all the z level ...
I have a strong military, but i know i can't count on it too much now, i just can't let them fight during few season or even years, and its really a pain to manage them so they quit the fight to go drink, eat and sleep 

[Hyndis]

A funny little trick is that you can use an artifact furniture as bait.

Building destroyers love to destroy buildings.

Artifacts cannot be destroyed.

If you build an artifact furniture at your entrance, building destroyers will get stuck trying to destroy it.   You can then wall off the creature or do whatever else you wanted to. This is how I defeated a forgotten beast liaison that was destroying my fortress. He got distracted by an artifact tower cap armor stand, and while he kept trying to destroy it I quietly walled him off and then collapsed a ceiling on him.

[Rkui]

I'll use this only if i need to save the childs... the wifes can die, but not the childs...

[Nil Eyeglazed]

So can they swim in magma, and can a raised bridge stop them? Sorry for the spoiler, maybe i should just test it myself and shut up...

I've seen some die in magma, and some that didn't die in magma, even after several years.  The ones that wouldn't die in magma still wouldn't path through magma, and retreated from it.  Regarding drawbridges-- I'm not sure.  I wouldn't trust a raised drawbridge as a good defense.  But I've had no problems with bridged ramps.  They won't destroy a bridge above them, or a bridge that they're standing on.  So that's how I block them off.

It's probably not necessary to wall at the z-level.  Even flyers don't move places that they can't walk to.  But depending on your beast, you may need to be careful of people walking by.  Some beasts have powerful ranged attacks.

I wouldn't use floodgates in your labyrinth.  A FB can destroy closed floodgates.