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[Kav]

I do iron and bronze/bismuth-bronze only military quite frequently without much trouble at all. Besides, if you have steel in every single fort it is no longer special.

Since it was not made abundantly clear in this thread I'll just throw this out there just in case:

Flux does not need to be listed as a layer explicitly at embark to find it, only sedimentary. You need to locate Sedimentary layers which all contain some kind of flux stone. It differs which flux you get with the different sedimentary layers, but you are guaranteed to always have flux if you have a sedimentary layer. The only flux that is not in a sedimentary layer is marble which is in Metamorphic layers.

In short, you should be looking for these at embark for flux. They appear in white while all the other layers are in shades of gray.

    * sandstone
    * siltstone
    * mudstone
    * shale
    * claystone
    * rock salt
    * limestone
    * conglomerate
    * dolomite
    * chert
    * chalk

Source: http://df.magmawiki.com/index.php/Sedimentary#ixzz0tV1Z4E00

And actually you should find the largest variety and most valuable gems in bauxite, which is in all sediment layers if I remember.

[gtmattz]

I do iron and bronze/bismuth-bronze only military quite frequently without much trouble at all. Besides, if you have steel in every single fort it is no longer special.

Since it was not made abundantly clear in this thread I'll just throw this out there just in case:

Flux does not need to be listed as a layer explicitly at embark to find it, only sedimentary. You need to locate Sedimentary layers which all contain some kind of flux stone. It differs which flux you get with the different sedimentary layers, but you are guaranteed to always have flux if you have a sedimentary layer. The only flux that is not in a sedimentary layer is marble which is in Metamorphic layers.

In short, you should be looking for these at embark for flux. They appear in white while all the other layers are in shades of gray.

    * sandstone
    * siltstone
    * mudstone
    * shale
    * claystone
    * rock salt
    * limestone
    * conglomerate
    * dolomite
    * chert
    * chalk

Source: http://df.magmawiki.com/index.php/Sedimentary#ixzz0tV1Z4E00

And actually you should find the largest variety and most valuable gems in bauxite, which is in all sediment layers if I remember.

What flux are you talking about that shows up in those non-flux sedimentary layers (I bolded them above)?  The only non layer flux I am aware of is calcite, are you saying that calcite appears in those other non-flux stone types?  Because I have never ever seen calcite outside of flux stone layers myself, and the wiki also states that it only appears in marble and limestone, so maybe you are getting sedimentary and flux mixed together in your mind?  Nowhere in your source link does it say that flux is present in all sedimentary layers, it just states that some of the flux types are sedimentary layer stones.

Wiki article listing the 5 flux stones
Wiki article describing calcite (the only non-layer flux stone)


Please, check your information before posting, this kind of thing just confuses new people. 

[Kav]

I will concede that this information may indeed be out of date. However, in 40d all Sedimentary layers always contained a flux stone. I have not run enough forts in 31 to confirm that this is still the case.

[gtmattz]

I will concede that this information may indeed be out of date. However, in 40d all Sedimentary layers always contained a flux stone. I have not run enough forts in 31 to confirm that this is still the case.

You are wrong there too.  40d flux appeared the same as it does in the current version, there has been no change at all to the flux types and locations.

[Kav]

Interesting. In all the forts I have run I don't think I've ever failed to find flux in any random sedimentary layer. I swear that was information I read on the forum at some point. <shrug>

[Mephansteras]

Were you using a mod?

[Kav]

negative.

I suppose it's entirely possible that I always embarked on sedimentary+flux sites on accident. As I said before I don't always go for flux, so I suppose there may have been enough of a minority of sedimentary layer forts that I just always got lucky and picked sedimentary forts that also happen to have flux every time.

It seems somewhat unlikely, but I'm out of ideas.

[gtmattz]

For as long as I have been playing there have been 5 flux stones, 4 of them layer stones and the 5th being calcite which is fairly rare, shows up in tiny clusters (4 or 5) and only appears in limestone and marble.  It is actually quite easy to confirm this, simply fire up 40d and embark on some sites with non-flux sedimentary stone and run dfprospector.  I will eat my hat if you find non-flux layers with calcite in them using vanilla stone raws.

Maybe you are confusing fuel with flux, as that is something that DOES show up in every sedimentary layer, usually in decent size veins?

[Kav]

I think I need to do just that simply to prove to myself that I'm not insane. However, given what you've said the outlook on that is not good.

[Creamcorn]

I think I need to do just that simply to prove to myself that I'm not insane. However, given what you've said the outlook on that is not good.

Well, not everyone has a perfect memory and besides; the average state of all bay12'ers is full batshit insanity. You need to earn the right to be called semi-sane.

[gtmattz]

Oh I suppose I should also give my opinion on the original question in the topic:

To me flux is very important because I find steel to be indespensable in maintaining the peace in my caverns in order to properly exploit the riches therin.

[morikal]

Hmm, I've used the site finder to request flux, and have had it say it found it (green on the flux toggle), but not had any sedimentary or marble layer.

So I dunno what was up with that. (I didn't embark there, so I don't know if there actually was flux or not)

[JmzLost]

1)  The list of layers only shows the top layers, including duplicates and soil.  Soil layers are usually 1 z-level thick, stone layers are about 5.  If you see 6 stone layers listed, then you know what stones are in the top 30 or so z-levels.  Most of my embarks have had about 150 z-levels to the magma sea, so there is plenty of room for other stones that are not listed.  Marble could just be very deep.

2)  Having flux makes creating your own steel much easier, but it isn't the only way to go.  Depending on the civ, you could be able to order all 5 types of flux from the Dwarven caravan.  If you max the trade request, you will get 4 of each type you ask for.  Also, you can order pig iron and steel bars, or steel items to melt back into bars.  Greaves would probably be the best for that, since trap components are extremely over-priced.

3) Flux for early trade goods was necessary in 40d, but with metal ore coming out your ears in 31.x you can do better.  Tetrahedrite, galena, iron ore, native silver, and native gold are all more valuable than flux or obsidian, and a lot easier to get than in earlier versions.  Also, green glass serrated discs are worth 252 dorfbucks before quality modifiers, and metal trap components are worth even more.  A proficient Herbalist and a proficient Cook can turn out a lot of +prickle berry roasts+, and probably buy most of what you need from the first caravan.

Basically, flux is only really important if you want to make a lot of steel.  There are other metals that will work for weapons and armor, other ways to get a little steel, and other trade goods you can use, even in an early fort.

JMZ

[Dearnen]

My first solo and current fort (31.08) was built on a site that had been found by the embark search engine specifically looking for flux stone.  It took forever to find the flux, though.  There wasn't any in all the sedimentary layers.  Below that were many layers of igneous rock, then huge caverns.  About halfway through the cavern layers I finally found marble.  It must be 20 to 30, or more, layers deep.  Fortunately, the sedimentary layers were loaded with coal, iron, and bauxite.  I was also able to wall off a large area with a brook for a safe water supply and outside refuse/dump pit.  Along with the lack of steel, the bugged training system and marksdwarves made my defense rather difficult until I had finished the wall and a trap gauntlet at the main gate.  Now that I have steel, my troops see little action.  I found adamantine not long after finding the marble too.  While I'm upgrading my forces from iron to steel, adamantine equipment isn't too far off either (stuff's slow to process and a little rare, though).

All in all, I'm not yet sure how vital flux will be for my fort overall.

[Bouchart]

I don't worry too much about it.  You can always import a few bars of steel, or dig straight to adamantium.