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[Abi79]

I hate the NSV Luna map...

That,  I agree. It's a bad map, for roleplaying (kitchen, bar, all far away from where the more active jobs are), for engineers, for atmosphere (I mean, as in mood, not air atmosphere). It's not that sense of a crew I got a year ago, from the donut-ish map, myself. I wish we had a functional smaller map to replace the Luna with.

Airflow is an incredible pain...

The automated threat containment locks are a major danger to the crew.

Again agreed, and we hope to remediate as much as we can in Complex/ion.

Finally, I am sick of the standing admin prohibition against killing traitors for any reason. I do not believe that someone who has murdered crew members and is intent on slaying the remainder should retain their right to live, especially in the heat of combat.

You are wrong. We have no rules AFAIK regarding killing traitors during combat. It is of course preffered to hold them for RP questioning and such, but if killing is the only safe solution, by all means go ahead.

Apparently there's some notion of due process, but the one time I bothered holding a trial the resident admin responded by opening a black hole in the courtroom and fussing at me for keeping the traitor restrained.

Impossible, we cannot spawn any events apart from meteors, that was just the random generator, and not even if we could, we wouldn't do that. Otherwise why would we be pushing for trials or for jailing if they were captured alive? As for keeping the traitor restrained, that's something I'd do as well during trial.

Finally, broken bones are annoying and more difficult to fix than they have any right to be. Combined with airflow issues, they quickly become tremendously unfun and can ruin a round.

EDIT:That and all the weird coding side-projects that have sprung up like broken bones, anomalies and virology without fixing longstanding and annoying bugs like the dysfunctional cloning pods.

Unfortunately, the coders who came up with those ideas ended up not sticking with them. Googol did the bones and virology (the latter which could have been fun in time), while Alfie did the anomalies. Both of them are gone from the team now.

[BurnedToast]

It's not really a combustion engine at all, I don't even know what it is. The gas should all explode basically instantly if the ratio is correct, but instead it smolders... and also magically burns completely clean with absolutely no byproducts at all which is impossible unless toxin is actually anti-oxygen.

But really, it should just be a nuclear reactor. The though of a combustion engine powered spaceship is.... silly.

I used to love the old plasma heat exchange engine. The shenanigans I pulled with it, turning the entire station to a star at 1 trillion degrees Urist, ah those were the days.

Just so you know, yeah, there are no byproducts, but it isn't impossible for it to burn away clean. For example, a 4h2 + 2o2 reaction would net you an output of 4 H2O, and combusts rather rapidly, explosively in fact. Considering most water disappears rather rapidly, it is possible the byproduct is water, or some other similar end product. (Make the byproduct space lube. Any tile which had a fire on it would be coated with it. Would make fire fighting even funnier.)

You're right about burning clean in the sense of non-polluting, but I meant it's impossible to be a combustion engine with no combustion byproducts at all. Yes, it could combust into pure water (though the only thing that will do that is hydrogen of course) but the engine is totally sealed and airtight so that water is not going to go anywhere - it's just going to sit there in the engine as water vapor clogging things up till it gets filtered or vented. The water is not going to just magically disappear.

Actually making space lube a byproduct is not that much of a stretch, since space lube = oxygen + plasma + silicon. Maybe not the main byproduct, but it's not too difficult to imagine it leeching enough silicon from windows etc to coat the floor with space lube. It would be pretty funny too - burning people sliding around everywhere.

HLBeta - The only thing I agree with you about is the trials. The one trial I was part of was just a mockery with everyone shouting random things constantly, half the jury went braindead due to boredom, then there was a massive cockup of the jury deliberation where 2 people kept saying not guilty despite it being pretty goddamn obvious (one person's theory? the dead guy stole the gun from the accused's hands and then committed suicide right there in front of her, the other saying it was not beyond a reasonable doubt because no-one had literally seen her pull the trigger... I shit you not) so eventually, after like 2 hours, it was a mistrial. The person playing the accused had to go anyway so it was not a problem to permabrig them (waiting for a new trial "tommorow"), but what if they hadn't? It was just completely stupid and made me wish the traitor had successfully blown up the ship.

Everything else seems to have been improved upon, or I guess I just don't find as annoying as you.

[Mini]

We have a prison shuttle now, so that's the preferred method of dealing with traitors. I have never heard anyone say that a trial is required, especially since people seem to be unable to actually be in a trial for its entire length without being dumb.

While I can think of many cases where the auto-locks have killed crew members I am at a loss to recall even one such occasion where they may be credited with saving the life of one.

That's because they save people passively, not actively. I don't think people would like it too much if 5 minutes into every round the entire ship was depressurised, killing every single new arrival before they could even walk out of the pod, let alone be assigned. There is also the problem of the limited amounts of internals on the ship, eventually they are going to run out (with the frequently >2 hour rounds we have, it's more likely than you think) and then everyone will die.

[HLBeta]

Finally, I am sick of the standing admin prohibition against killing traitors for any reason. I do not believe that someone who has murdered crew members and is intent on slaying the remainder should retain their right to live, especially in the heat of combat.

You are wrong. We have no rules AFAIK regarding killing traitors during combat. It is of course preffered to hold them for RP questioning and such, but if killing is the only safe solution, by all means go ahead.

I'm glad to hear that policy has vanished with time. Constantly playing a dread revengineer doing the job security wasn't allowed to always seemed kind of dumb.

Apparently there's some notion of due process, but the one time I bothered holding a trial the resident admin responded by opening a black hole in the courtroom and fussing at me for keeping the traitor restrained.

Impossible, we cannot spawn any events apart from meteors, that was just the random generator, and not even if we could, we wouldn't do that. Otherwise why would we be pushing for trials or for jailing if they were captured alive? As for keeping the traitor restrained, that's something I'd do as well during trial.

I'll take your word for it on admin capabilities. Between the adminchannel complaint (the traitor was known to have a freedom implant, so we stunned him and welded him into a "high security solitary confinement pod") and oddly specific timing of a very rare random event I had assumed that some degree of admin abuse was involved.

We have a prison shuttle now, so that's the preferred method of dealing with traitors. I have never heard anyone say that a trial is required, especially since people seem to be unable to actually be in a trial for its entire length without being dumb.

The prison shuttle works now? Whoo!

While I can think of many cases where the auto-locks have killed crew members I am at a loss to recall even one such occasion where they may be credited with saving the life of one.

That's because they save people passively, not actively. I don't think people would like it too much if 5 minutes into every round the entire ship was depressurised, killing every single new arrival before they could even walk out of the pod, let alone be assigned. There is also the problem of the limited amounts of internals on the ship, eventually they are going to run out (with the frequently >2 hour rounds we have, it's more likely than you think) and then everyone will die.

I'm not really buying that. I've dealt with a few blowouts on the NSV and I still think the auto-locks are more of a danger to the crew. When actually trying to recover a room, I can't access through the constantly re-sealing airlocks, which would minimize atmospheric transfer by sealing again behind me. Instead I have to manually construct small adjoining rooms to stand in while I cut through the nearby wall, greatly increasing rescue/repair times and introducing many new and exciting points of failure.

[BurnedToast]

meh, it's not like anyone ever repairs the ship anyway - the instant something goes wrong everyone screams to call the pods and the captain does. I literally don't think I've seen a hull breach ever repaired even once (I've only seen one person even try not counting myself).

Anyway, I agree with mini - this is not goonstation with it's poo filled slow moving slime air, atmos drains FAST. What would happen is someone would see the breach, run out (not closing the door, of course) venting the hallway, then panic and run straight for medical (venting the next hallway and venting medical) Then everyone in medical panics and runs and suddenly half the crew is dead and the ship is airless.  I've seen this exact thing happen with plasma contamination (instead of vacuum) which ended up igniting almost the whole damn ship and crashing the server.

Making it a bit more annoying to get in to repair it is just not that big a deal in comparision, imo.

[Necro910]

meh, it's not like anyone ever repairs the ship anyway - the instant something goes wrong everyone screams to call the pods and the captain does. I literally don't think I've seen a hull breach ever repaired even once (I've only seen one person even try not counting myself).

Anyway, I agree with mini - this is not goonstation with it's poo filled slow moving slime air, atmos drains FAST. What would happen is someone would see the breach, run out (not closing the door, of course) venting the hallway, then panic and run straight for medical (venting the next hallway and venting medical) Then everyone in medical panics and runs and suddenly half the crew is dead and the ship is airless.  I've seen this exact thing happen with plasma contamination (instead of vacuum) which ended up igniting almost the whole damn ship and crashing the server.

Making it a bit more annoying to get in to repair it is just not that big a deal in comparision, imo.

Like dwarf fortress!

[Jacob/Lee]

Meh. Sometimes, you need to trade realism for fun. Getting slammed into a wall and shattering half the bones in your body as soon as you poked a screwdriver through the hull would be no fun, now would it? Sure, the Goon's atmos sucks, but it's better than getting half the station killed as soon as some jackass puts a tiny hole in the ship.

[Urist Mcinternetuser]

Meh. Sometimes, you need to trade realism for fun. Getting slammed into a wall and shattering half the bones in your body as soon as you poked a screwdriver through the hull would be no fun, now would it? Sure, the Goon's atmos sucks, but it's better than getting half the station killed as soon as some jackass puts a tiny hole in the ship.

I like the BS 12 hull breaches, and it's not very easy do cause it by accident, either a traitor or meteor will cause it. But the former would probably get banned depending on the damage.

[Necro910]

Meh. Sometimes, you need to trade realism for fun. Getting slammed into a wall and shattering half the bones in your body as soon as you poked a screwdriver through the hull would be no fun, now would it? Sure, the Goon's atmos sucks, but it's better than getting half the station killed as soon as some jackass puts a tiny hole in the ship.

The breaches would be the BEST THING EVAR if it didn't break bones. Then I have to limp around and fall over the whole round until I find someone who knows how to fix bones AND is permitted to know how to know how to fix bones.

[BurnedToast]

I cut a hole in the wall in supply dock once in sandbox just for laughs.

I was not slammed around that bad, none of my bones were broken (though I was moderately injured from slamming into the grate where the wall used to be) and the atmos seal slammed shut preventing it from effecting anything else on the ship.

Similarly due to a venting bug in plasma research (the burning gas refused to vent no matter what I did) the heatshield melted and all the air was sucked out. I was standing a few squares away and I was not thrown around at all, I think it just pulled me back a little bit till the air was gone, I was completely uninjured (at least till I suffocated because I didn't get to the masks in time).

I've got more examples (I..... suffocate a lot...) but they are basically the same as those. Atmos venting does not seem THAT deadly (other then the lack of air, which should be deadly).

[Necro910]

Meh. Sometimes, you need to trade realism for fun. Getting slammed into a wall and shattering half the bones in your body as soon as you poked a screwdriver through the hull would be no fun, now would it? Sure, the Goon's atmos sucks, but it's better than getting half the station killed as soon as some jackass puts a tiny hole in the ship.

I like the BS 12 hull breaches, and it's not very easy do cause it by accident, either a traitor or meteor will cause it. But the former would probably get banned depending on the damage.

Why would a terrorist be banned for terrorism? It's the perfect crime for the syndicate D:

[Urist Mcinternetuser]

They banned Tirist Plot (AmnestyInternational) when he blew up both of his targets and most of the important crew. I was like, "That's so badass", but no he was banned. I would like the game more if the syndicate had a license to kill whomever.

[Jacob/Lee]

Except revolutionaries (if they have that mode, never been to BS12). Goonstation has proven time and time again the revs will curbstomp any non-rev that gets in their way if they can.

[Urist Mcinternetuser]

I only partake in peaceful revolutions... Now that I think about it, the guy who was on the same team as the admin wasn't banned for brutally clubbing five people (who weren't proven revolutionaries) to death.
That round was depressing.

[BurnedToast]

BS12 has revolution but it never gets played.... it would be pretty dumb with only like 10 or less people and no security anyway which is the normal situation. It's also got RP rev which does get played sometimes but I think is kind of a silly mode (people were saying the heads all had to RP being mean/cruel/self absorbed etc otherwise the crew would have no IC reason to rebel and it would be fail mode).