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[fenrif]

I agree with Ein. It's like people forget that Plan 9 From Outer Space ever existed, and so they get all uppity about how much they hate modern cinema, even though 2008 and 2009 were great years for the film industry.

It's like this for all forms of media. People have always wanted to decry their generation as the worst.

With cinema it's at least understandable. Look at a list of the top 100 films of all time... More than half of them would never get green-lit in modern Hollywood. Sunset Blvd. 12 Angry Men, One Flew Over the Cookoos Nest etc.

Though this is mainly beacuse of the Hollywood buisness model churning out low-risk crap most of the year and recouping their losses on a handfull of mega-successfull box-office weekends, plus the increased cost of making films.

Don't get me wrong, there was plenty of crap back then too, but they also experimented and weren't afraid to put out something that wasn't aimed at the lowest common denominator.

[Pathos]

Great thing about movies is that the horrible B Movies are fun because they're so horrible.

Whereas, with anime, the horrible is just plain horrible.

[Grakelin]

Movies like 12 Angry Men and One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest are still produced, and by mainstream actors, but they don't get a large amount of immediate marketing coverage, because it's true they aren't the big sellers.

There was Darjeeling Limited, with Owen Wilson, Adrien Brody, and Jason Schwartzman in 2007, or The Last Station, with Christopher Plummer and Helen Mirren in 2009.

12 Angry Men was a star-driven film, incidentally, and Cuckoo's Nest was an adaptation of a novel, which are bankrolled all the time, such as in the case of Precious.

[Jackrabbit]

Great thing about movies is that the horrible B Movies are fun because they're so horrible.

Whereas, with anime, the horrible is just plain horrible.

There's always one or two that are hilariously bad, just like any medium. But the screaming. I mean my God, I've seen a few trashy animes that they put on on a Saturday morning over here and the amount of "OH BUT THAT'S WRONG BECAUSE SOMETHING SOMETHING I AM ANGUISHED AND OOOOH I'M GONNA HURT YOOOU". I mean, Jesus, how is it that shows like that are popular enough to keep going? Aren't all the fans deaf?

[fenrif]

Star driven films and adaptations are still done all the time yeah, but not necissarily about the same subject matter as cookoo or 12 angry men. Also precious wasn't an indie film AFAIK, and Wes Anderson can do pretty much whatever he wants. I'm not familiar with The Last Station, and CBA IMDBing it so I'll give you that one out of laziness.

I was only really talking about Hollywood to be fair. In recent years digital distrobution and internet word of mouth has made it drastically easier for indie companies to fill in the niches that Hollywood has abandoned in their complete aversion to risk. Plus the comparitive ease of getting art-house and foreign films means we have more selection than ever, so yeah those kinds of films still get made. My point is that Hollywood, which dominates the box office here in the UK (and I assume most of the english speaking world) doesn't make as wide a range of films as they used too.

There's always one or two that are hilariously bad, just like any medium. But the screaming. I mean my God, I've seen a few trashy animes that they put on on a Saturday morning over here and the amount of "OH BUT THAT'S WRONG BECAUSE SOMETHING SOMETHING I AM ANGUISHED AND OOOOH I'M GONNA HURT YOOOU". I mean, Jesus, how is it that shows like that are popular enough to keep going? Aren't all the fans deaf?

Aren't the target audiences of saturday morning cartoons like 10 year olds and younger? I think that's your answer.

[Jackrabbit]

Ten year old kids have eardrums too.

Maybe they're made of adamantium.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

Man, I remember when cartoons used to have plot. Or were at least genuinely funny. But those days are over now, replaced by things like Chowder.
^{_{Hello, my honey! Hello, my baby! Hello, my ragtime gal...}}

I found out recently that they filmed the whole of 12 Angry Men in a single take. Those were some damn fine actors.

[Jackrabbit]

Man, I remember when cartoons used to have plot. Or were at least genuinely funny. But those days are over now, replaced by things like Chowder.
^{_{Hello, my honey! Hello, my baby! Hello, my ragtime gal...}}

I found out recently that they filmed the whole of 12 Angry Men in a single take. Those were some damn fine actors.

Oh God Chowder. What the hell is that show? I mean... what is that show? It's impossible to explain.

[ein]

Some of the older cartoons were full of black humour too.
Makes them fun to rewatch as an adult with a better sense of humour.

[Leafsnail]

Some of the older cartoons were full of black humour too.
Makes them fun to rewatch as an adult with a better sense of humour.

I guess it's usually written by adults.  It's probably fun making jokes they know will fly over kids' heads.

[MetalSlimeHunt]

Some of the older cartoons were full of black humour too.
Makes them fun to rewatch as an adult with a better sense of humour.

I guess it's usually written by adults.  It's probably fun making jokes they know will fly over kids' heads.

I always found the black humor weird. I mostly got the adult jokes as a kid, but didn't find them very funny. I think they were mostly put in for the entertainment of children's parents, so they too might watch the shows, albeit at lesser rates.

[Sir Pseudonymous]

If you're talking about Loony Toons, I seem to recall reading that they were originally played before movies in cinemas and targeted towards an older audience, rather than kids.

[Jackrabbit]

I hear Animaniacs is good for that sorta stuff.

Hehe, "finger Prince".

[Kogan Loloklam]

By contrast, Indian longbows were fearsomely fast and precise--''far better than the average musket of the Plymouth colonists in rapidity and accuracy of fire," according to the noted arms scholar Harold L. Peterson. Wielded by people who had practiced archery since childhood, they could shoot 10 arrows a minute and were accurate up to 200 yards. To the dismay of colonists at Jamestown in 1607, a Powhatan Indian sank an arrow a foot deep into a target the Europeans thought impervious to an arrow shot--''which was strange," Jamestown council president George Percy observed, ''being that a Pistoll could not pierce it."

The Boston Globe

I've seen a lot of second-hand statements about how Native American arrows can punch through 1600s breastplates, but nothing with a source as creditable as this. This is George Percy from May 20, 1607, gathered from Here

The twentieth day of Werowance of Paspiha sent fortie of his men with a Deere, to our quarter: but they came more in villanie than any love they bare us: they faine would have layne in our Fort all night, but wee would not suffer them for feare of their treachery. One of our Gentlemen having a Target which hee trusted in, thinking it would beare out a slight shot, hee set it up against a tree, willing one of the Savages to shoot; who tooke from his backe an Arrow of an elle long, drew it strongly in his Bowe, shoots the Target a foote thorow, or better: which was strange, being that a Pistoll could not pierce it. Wee seeing the force of his Bowe, afterwards set him up a steele Target; he shot again, and burst his arrow all to pieces, he presently pulled out another Arrow, and bit it in his teeth, and seemed to bee in a great rage, so hee went away in great anger. (Percy 1606)

HOWEVER, Popular Science in July of 1926 did contain in it a reference to Southern Native Americans piercing through Spanish armor, and in one case pinning an armored leg to his horse. Since I couldn't find the source of this claim, I can't tell what the armor was made out of, although I'm pretty confident it would be steel if it was Spanish Conquistadors and Armor references.

[Leafsnail]

HOWEVER, Popular Science in July of 1926 did contain in it a reference to Southern Native Americans piercing through Spanish armor, and in one case pinning an armored leg to his horse. Since I couldn't find the source of this claim, I can't tell what the armor was made out of, although I'm pretty confident it would be steel if it was Spanish Conquistadors and Armor references.

And thus, weeaboo culture is not Japanese culture.

QED.