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[gurra_geban]

Ok, so the fort i ran for 5 hour yesterday was erased due to a system crash, and nothing was saved!

Im just gonna play dota until either an autosave is in or the new version is out....

[Doniazade]

There IS an autosave. Check init.txt, the values you are looking for are AUTOSAVE and AUTOBACKUP

[Toady One]

Did you set up the autosave in data/init/init.txt?  You can set it to a seasonal or yearly option in there.

[foolx]

Would be great to insert an normal option "save and continue playing" ...

[Align]

The INIT options should probably be accessible from an in-game options screen though.

[gurra_geban]

lol ^^

gurra_geban cancels whining: pwned!

[Keldor]

Heheh, there is indeed an autosave.  Has been for a few versions.

Anyway, I also think there should be a save and continue option, just because it would be nice to have.

[Keizo]

Hello everyone in this thread, I am the voice of the hardcore roguelike player. And I am going to say:

PLEASE DO NOT PUT IN A SAVE AND CONTINUE OPTION!!!!!

I know it might seem to make sense because of bugginess causing problems & crashes, but a save & continue option has never been implemented in any roguelike (well, any respectable roguelike) in history, for a reason. A save and continue option would hamper the spirit of DF as a real roguelike. If you don't understand where I'm coming from here, look up roguelikes on wikipedia or something, and you'll soon understand what I mean.

[Sagabal]

Keizo, I'm not sure what you mean.  A save and continue function would just remove the hassle of saving and quitting, continuing, and waiting through the long load.  And sure, adventure mode is a rougelike, but saying DF is a "real" rougelike, or is trying to be one, is really stretching it. To me, a save and continue option sounds like a useful, time-saving feature.  Could you explain why you oppose a save and continue function?  I understand that you are a hardcore rougelike player, so maybe you could provide that perspective.

[Dasleah]

Adventure Mode is a Roguelike. No 'Save and Continue'.

Fortress Mode is not a Roguelike. 'Save and Continue' the hell outta it.

[Derakon]

Roguelikes aren't so much about "save and continue" as they are about "obliterate your savefile when you die". The point being, if you aren't risking all your progress when you play the game, then there's a lot less tension, and hence, less interest. If you can always just revert to an old save when you die, then you get careless and make decisions with screwed up risk/reward ratios.

I don't know that that makes much sense in the context of fortress mode, though. The only explicit lose condition already wipes your saves, but there's plenty of other self-imposed lose conditions ("crap, I just poured the magma into my fort instead of onto the goblins") that aren't recognized by the game. The important thing is to have the discipline to not make use of backup saves.

[gurra_geban]

Lol... Save and continue is what you do whenever you stop playing and then start playing again, IT'S IN ALL ROUGELIKES!

The difference being that a save and continue option will get rid of the hassle when loading the game again when making computer-crash safety checkpoints.

This has nothing to do with using the "save/load weapon" as a tool for backtracking. I think savescumming is a rare phenomenon here, as most of us are hardcore purists (mostly at least)

[Neonivek]

I personally don't agree with the Rogue-likes "No saving" policy and feel that it now has more to do with "We just don't want noobs playing the game" then actually trying to improve gameplay.

If ONLY because in order to beat Roguelikes now you need a sheet of tricks and tips the size of the distance it takes you to go to work in order to beat it... using tricks that in order to find out on your own would require you to hack right into the game and pull out information.

It has made it to the point where Roguelike developers don't even pretend that isn't at least part of their goal to "Thin the herd" so to speak. With messages in forums saying "don't ask for an easy mode with saving". Heck even saying Id like to be able to save on some of the forums is to start a flame war... Yet there is always this small group in the corner who keep trying to find ways to save. Save Scumming should be looked upon as a legit way to play the game, since beating the game is frankly cheating in it of itself.

Roguelikes quickly get boring when you don't cheat or look up info. Since you are simply dying rather then playing. After a month of dying because it turns out if you throw Pepsi on the Coke Demon it dies... or because if you actually do well in the game the game's balancers summons an enemy to instantly kill you and you were supposed to be using the "Trick the Game Balancer" Trick. It gets annoying. Don't forget that Roguelikes LOVE to throw in many "Your just dead" moments where you really had no choice but to die such as Nethack's many "You can't find the way out" or IVAN's Leprocy.

To quote Toady: "Losing is fun"
My Retort: Of Course it is, but it doesn't replace gameplay.

Because of my overwhelming need not to cheat... and my obvious sanity... I can't get too far in roguelikes.

The ONLY reason I can stand it in Dwarf Fortress is two fold
1) Adventure mode (And Fortress mode) is so short to finish up everything you would really need to do... There is no point after a few hours play.
2) The MAIN reason... because Dwarf Fortress is also a Simulation and everything you do effects the world. So even dying can feel like a victory in some sense since the world history would adjust to your death.

However the main reason I have for saving in Dwarf Fortress adventure mode is as follows:
1) Dwarf Fortress like many Roguelikes includes fast, swift, and stupid deaths. "Ohh I INSTANTLY turned into a block of ice", "Ohh I got hit by an arrow", and many others. Though Dwarf Fortress by far includes the least... as I can count on my hand the number of Dwarf Fortress insta-deaths when the usual Roguelike includes so many that there are bound to be quite a few that havn't been reported yet.

Of course this could change... when the game gets more developed (as in my oppinions)

This rant is over... I have issues with Roguelikes.

That should end it... for quite some time

[ May 29, 2008: Message edited by: Neonivek ]

[Doniazade]

We could just have a [WIMP:yes/no] tag in init.txt. Yes disables save deletions upon death and allows 'save & continue', no keeps it as it is. That way the people who just want to sandbox(like me) can do so if they wish without hassle(hi Copy(11) of region1) while the "hardcore"  :roll: dudes can keep their permadeath.

[Neonivek]

Psh... better yet

Wimp: Yes

Disables save deletions

It makes more sense.

[ May 29, 2008: Message edited by: Neonivek ]