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Author Topic: Natural Gas pipeline explodes in Texas..... times 2!  (Read 3157 times)

Virex

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Re: Natural Gas pipeline explodes in Texas.....
« Reply #30 on: June 07, 2010, 06:27:26 pm »

I thought the point wasn't to get hydrogen across. I mean seriously, a hydrogen pipeline is a ridiculous waste of money. You can set up a massive power line for the same money, and have hydrogen processors installed right at the refuel stations. Getting power can be solved by non-fuel methods that are location-based, like HEPPs and windtraps. And those massive solar power stations, which will require water to be delivered to them, since they can handle the heating at much less expense than any other powerplant.
That kind of deppends on the economy of scale at work here. If there's little efficiency drop from producing hydrogen on-site that would be an option. But if the efficiency drops steeply for small units, then producing it on site still is a problem

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Getting hydrogen to a decent density is also the key to getting it to be safe. There was some research on solidifying it somewhere, but I can't remember where it was or what it involved. Ideally, you'll be carrying it around liquid or solid, in some sort of a supersponge that will keep it contained, but release it when "squeezed". And hydrogen-fueled cars won't be any more dangerous than cars on natural gas, that share a lot of the same problems with safety. Except containment, of course.
My dad worked on sollidifying it. That requires a HUGE amount of pressure. At his lab, they used diamonds as the press heads. The alternative was steel drums fed with pipes, but the pipes could decapitate someone if they yielded under the pressure.
But the fact remains that the energy density per volume unit's quite low, as opposed to, say, glucose solutions (biologically available) or methanol (readily synthesized out of syngas, which is biologicaly available, and water. Alternatively, it can be directly formed by bacteria. Only problem is that it's toxic, so it's brother ethanol could be a better participant)
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Footkerchief

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Re: Natural Gas pipeline (and maybe Oil well?) explodes in Texas.....
« Reply #31 on: June 07, 2010, 06:32:19 pm »

b.) Storage. Hydrogen has a huge energy density per mass unit. It also has a really low specific density. To get a decent energy density per volume unit, you need to compress it quite a bit. This first of all costs energy, but secondly, it also greatly complicates the design of hydrogen storage tanks and fuel cells, because they too need to cope with such high pressures.

Also its nasty habit of http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrogen_embrittlement
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MetalSlimeHunt

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Re: Natural Gas pipeline explodes in Texas.....
« Reply #32 on: June 07, 2010, 09:46:43 pm »

Struck by a digging machine? Didn't they see the gas line signs?

And if we're going to war with Earth, then I suggest we listen to the greatest authority on Earth destruction.

http://qntm.org/destroy

Oh, wait, the Earth is already destroyed. Well, we'll just have to destroy it again!
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Sean Mirrsen

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Re: Natural Gas pipeline explodes in Texas.....
« Reply #33 on: June 08, 2010, 12:50:38 am »

By solidifying, I didn't quite mean freezing and compressing. There could be a way to store hydrogen chemically, bound to some extremely aggressive (but still handleable) element that'd be easier to churn out in chunks. Buut really, I know nothing of this. There's gotta be a way somewhere, but let's keep to the discussion.

Now, how about we discuss ways of stopping this humongous disaster? I propose nuking. It always works.
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HideousBeing

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Re: Natural Gas pipeline explodes in Texas.....
« Reply #34 on: June 08, 2010, 12:58:27 am »

By solidifying, I didn't quite mean freezing and compressing. There could be a way to store hydrogen chemically, bound to some extremely aggressive (but still handleable) element that'd be easier to churn out in chunks. Buut really, I know nothing of this. There's gotta be a way somewhere, but let's keep to the discussion.

Now, how about we discuss ways of stopping this humongous disaster? I propose nuking. It always works.

We just need to find an antimatter galaxy! Then maybe we will have enough energy to compress hydrogen down! ;)

They usually just close the valves on the pipe and let it burn, but nuking it is definitely a fun option.

Also, who dug into this thing. Was it marked properly? Who do I blame for being a fuckup here?
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smjjames

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Re: Natural Gas pipeline explodes in Texas..... times 2!
« Reply #35 on: June 08, 2010, 05:26:55 pm »

Okay, either people were being stupid in both cases or there is something else going on. CNNs 'situation room' mentioned that it happened a moment ago and then went to a different topic. They probably don't have any info other than something happened.

Edit: The breaking news ticker on the CNN site says a pipeline. So I'll wait for an article to come out before actually saying anything more.
« Last Edit: June 08, 2010, 05:28:31 pm by smjjames »
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Cthulhu

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Re: Natural Gas pipeline explodes in Texas..... times 2!
« Reply #36 on: June 08, 2010, 05:30:01 pm »

We need to pick up some small asteroids and slam them into an uninhabited or densely inhabited part of the earth, to show Mother Nature who's in charge now, bitch.  She's getting a little rowdy.
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smjjames

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Re: Natural Gas pipeline explodes in Texas..... times 2!
« Reply #37 on: June 08, 2010, 05:32:43 pm »

We need to pick up some small asteroids and slam them into an uninhabited or densely inhabited part of the earth, to show Mother Nature who's in charge now, bitch.  She's getting a little rowdy.

Good one. :)

While yesterdays accident looked like simple human stupidity, what are the odds of having a second accident happen the next day?

EDIT: http://www.news10.net/news/national/story.aspx?storyid=83117&catid=5

Another case of people fucking up...... Seriously though, two days in a row?
« Last Edit: June 08, 2010, 05:49:08 pm by smjjames »
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Cthulhu

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Re: Natural Gas pipeline explodes in Texas..... times 2!
« Reply #38 on: June 08, 2010, 07:08:07 pm »

Maybe the corner-cutting oil companies do was way more extensive than we were expecting.

Maybe it was sabotage.

Maybe it's just a crazy coincidence.  I dunno, but we're gonna run out of oil at this rate.
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Aqizzar

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Re: Natural Gas pipeline explodes in Texas..... times 2!
« Reply #39 on: June 08, 2010, 07:09:56 pm »

Maybe it's just a crazy coincidence.  I dunno, but we're gonna run out of oil at this rate.

Luckily we have natural gas to make up the difference.
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sneakey pete

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Re: Natural Gas pipeline explodes in Texas..... times 2!
« Reply #40 on: June 08, 2010, 07:13:12 pm »

Heh, heard bout the second one on the news here thismorning and i was thinking "what, two people undied, and they're reporting it a day late"
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sonerohi

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Re: Natural Gas pipeline explodes in Texas..... times 2!
« Reply #41 on: June 08, 2010, 09:18:15 pm »

Maybe it's just a crazy coincidence.  I dunno, but we're gonna run out of oil at this rate.

Luckily we have natural gas to make up the difference.

Yeah you are right, all that natural gas we are getting from Texas will keep us going...
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Duuvian

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Re: Natural Gas pipeline explodes in Texas.....
« Reply #42 on: June 09, 2010, 10:13:24 pm »

this just marks the further loss of America's superpower status, and the rise of China
China produces ~3,750,000 bbl/day compared to the U.S.A.'s 8,400,000 bbl/day. Or is there something I'm not seeing?

China's rural areas are not nearly as heavily populated by cars as American rural areas (unless I'm badly mistaken)

Also, I think scooters and smaller vehicles are encouraged for those that do have a vehicle. On top of that, when various family members of mine were in China on a Student Ambassador trip or my fathers old business trips, the Chinese had a massive amount of bicycle traffic.
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Knirisk

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Re: Natural Gas pipeline explodes in Texas..... times 2!
« Reply #43 on: June 10, 2010, 01:50:13 am »

Maybe it's just a crazy coincidence.  I dunno, but we're gonna run out of oil at this rate.

Luckily we have natural gas to make up the difference.

Yeah you are right, all that natural gas we are getting from Texas will keep us going...

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kuro_suna

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Re: Natural Gas pipeline explodes in Texas..... times 2!
« Reply #44 on: June 10, 2010, 02:11:31 am »

Maybe it's just a crazy coincidence.  I dunno, but we're gonna run out of oil at this rate.

Luckily we have natural gas to make up the difference.

Isn't compressing natural gas to a high enough energy/volume for vehicles almost as hard as hydrogen.
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