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Author Topic: League of Legends  (Read 164906 times)

umiman

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Re: League of Legends
« Reply #2415 on: May 09, 2011, 12:45:06 am »

For those who didn't catch the new items:

Cloak and Dagger:
20% Attack Speed, 20% Crit Chance, 25 Tenacity
1450 gold

That's insane. The only thing holding it back from being godlike is the fact that it doesn't build into anything.

Moonflair Spellblade:
50 AP, 25 Tenacity
1290 gold

I think most mages don't fear CC too much. The only ones that care about CC are close range mages like Ryze, Vlad, or Morde who need to go into CC range. So this is probably for them.

Eleisa's Miracle
25 Health regen, 20 Mana regen, 25 Tenacity
1200 gold

Considering this is the only item other than Shurelia's that Philosopher's Stone builds into, I think this will be pretty useful.

Mipe

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Re: League of Legends
« Reply #2416 on: May 09, 2011, 01:19:06 am »

2. Shen getting changed. I did always say for months now that Shen's damage is too high for a tank.

Wait, what? How is Shen's damage too high? He feels more like lowest damage output among all tanks... the Ki strike doesn't do that much.
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V-Norrec

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Re: League of Legends
« Reply #2417 on: May 09, 2011, 01:39:07 am »

So... I bought Poppy.  I think we might have a new contender for favorite character ever.  This is a pretty decent video, I didn't get fed in the beginning but by the end of it, I was able to go toe to toe with Rumble who had been fed 40 kills (by end game anyhow.)

Once again, please feel free to offer me tips, the following I already know.

1)  Yes that tower dive in the beginning was stupid, but I thought I had Malphite.  Live and learn I suppose. 

2)  Yes I died to dragon, really, just don't even bring that up, it was stupid and I was really tired at the time so I wasted a lot of mana rather than just mash q which would have had me win (by my estimation anyhow).

3)  Anyone who brings up either of the two above will be brought to the torture chamber where elephants will trample you until you are a fine paste.

Some of my own observations, I'm a lot better once Trinity force is done, I pretty much need the move speed, I've been thinking about moving up boots in the build order to compensate in games where I can't get champion kills early on.  I also am probably a bit too aggressive so I might need to reign that in a bit, though I'll probably never be entirely successful at that (a bit too greedy, what can I say)  I can also say that sometimes I lose track of my character, that caused one of my deaths (I think I rushed into all 5 of the enemies, but I'm not really sure).  Finally, I'm a little bit slow in getting the defensive Diplo off to save my ass in situations where I can't win.  There, free criticisms for those who are too lazy to actually watch the video lol.

The vid of awesomeness.  ((With cherries on top))
« Last Edit: May 09, 2011, 01:42:32 am by V-Norrec »
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Pandarsenic

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Re: League of Legends
« Reply #2418 on: May 09, 2011, 03:12:14 am »

The Vorpal/Ki Strike harass combo does huge damage in a lane.

Good luck to any Shen junglers now, though.
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umiman

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Re: League of Legends
« Reply #2419 on: May 09, 2011, 03:29:38 am »

2. Shen getting changed. I did always say for months now that Shen's damage is too high for a tank.

Wait, what? How is Shen's damage too high? He feels more like lowest damage output among all tanks... the Ki strike doesn't do that much.
Yes it does. It also scales with health. And it cools down each time he's attacked. For all intents and purposes, in a teamfight, once he taunts, Shen has perma Ki Strike for three attacks or so.

In the laning phase, especially if he's solo lane, it translates into freaking easy last hits. It's does extra base 65 damage at level 5. For all intents and purposes, he gets a free crit every 8 seconds. Even faster if people hit him. At level 18 it does 200 damage or more each time it procs and remember, with one good taunt hitting 2 people, he can easily do over 600 damage no problem to one target because of instant cooldown. That doesn't sound too impressive on paper, but I did say "for a tank". Compared to Rammus who is completely reliant on his ultimate to do any real damage whatsoever or Amumu who does damage based on % of enemy's max hp, Shen's passive nuke is pretty scary. Especially to squishy targets.

However, the real meaning behind my words was that given how capable Shen is at saving his teammates (heal + taunt + global super shield) and reorganizing teamfights to his whim, he can still output respectable damage. Sure there are other characters which can be built tanky and can probably out-damage Shen, but those guys have inferior CC and tanking capability. Not to mention his damage scales with something he will 100% of the time get. The only other tanks with this trait are Rammus and Galio. But Rammus only scales with armor and even then DBC with 300 armor doesn't do nearly as much damage as base Ki Strike without items. Galio on the other hand scales quite well with MR, but even if Galio had 300 MR (how?), it's only bonus 150 AP which translates even less once converted to actual damage to spells (extra 120 damage to resolute smite). Considering even further that almost all of Galio's abilities cool down longer than Shen's passive and well... you get the idea.

You could even say that the entire reason why Shen is so popular is his ability to split push like a crazy bugger. His Ki Strike lets him clear waves at good time. Normally on any other champion, this is meh at best. But since Shen has that super global ulti that basically translates into "even though I'm pushing another lane, I'm still actually with my team", it makes his pushing power pretty insane. With this nerf, we'd probably see less Shen split pushing as it'll take him much, much longer now. Or he could buy a dps item and do it even faster. Who knows what the future has in store?

tl;dr:
Shen: free crit every 8 seconds / infinite free crit without items (if you still don't understand, he gets double damage and he gets even more with any health items)
Rammus: extra 75 damage with 300 armor. Wow, that's almost as much as Shen's base passive without any items when he's level 10!
Galio: 150 AP with 300 MR. Cooldowns longer than Shen. Ratios translate to less bonus damage than Shen. That's with THREE HUNDRED MR. Something I've literally never seen before.
Amumu: Does health%-based AOE damage and doesn't scale with tanky items. Also less tanky than Shen but has better CC.
Singed: Gets more health from mana. Damage doesn't scale at all with tankiness. All his damage comes from poison. Good damage, but it's an AOE DoT that's equivalent to an autoattack per second. Nowhere near free crits.

I can go on, but you get the idea. Unless the champion can both tank as well as Shen can and yet still get free crits worth of damage, he does less damage than Shen. At least to a single target.

Journier

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Re: League of Legends
« Reply #2420 on: May 09, 2011, 09:35:44 am »

;/

there goes my karthus...

WHYYYYYYYYYYY god WHYYYYYYYYY

I bought trynd, but my god i found a new character i suck at.

Anyone got a reccomended build/strategy for using him?

I can never survive early battles before lvl 6, and when i hit lvl 6, team fights seem to last far too long to survive a battle. Later on im sure this changes but ive lost 2 games in a row horribly with like 2-8-2 stats. first game i was super terribad, now im slightly super terrible with him.
« Last Edit: May 09, 2011, 09:38:50 am by Journier »
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Bluerobin

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Re: League of Legends
« Reply #2421 on: May 09, 2011, 10:11:48 am »

So... did people notice that the new Merc treads don't have move speed on them? Is that intentional, do you know?

Edit: Ok, found a post on the forums that makes it sound like it could just be a tooltip error. Plus, just thinking about it, the price wasn't decreased, so they would be pretty overpriced without the move speed.
« Last Edit: May 09, 2011, 10:29:37 am by Bluerobin »
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Akigagak

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Re: League of Legends
« Reply #2422 on: May 09, 2011, 12:14:23 pm »

;/

there goes my karthus...

WHYYYYYYYYYYY god WHYYYYYYYYY

I bought trynd, but my god i found a new character i suck at.

Anyone got a reccomended build/strategy for using him?

I can never survive early battles before lvl 6, and when i hit lvl 6, team fights seem to last far too long to survive a battle. Later on im sure this changes but ive lost 2 games in a row horribly with like 2-8-2 stats. first game i was super terribad, now im slightly super terrible with him.

The successful Tryns I've seen usually act as bait. They jump into the enemy team with their ult ready, then try and kill the squishiest member. If that looks impossible, flee into your team mates. As you'll have no health at all, the enemy will likely chase, though they might give up if its an obvious trap.

Also, towerdive. Towerdive like a lunatic the instant you hit level 6. Kill the quishiest/lowest-health member of the enemy lane, then fleeeee, leading the other one into a place so that your lane-mate can kill them or at least get them off of you. Beware CCs, for they will kill you if you try this.
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Jopax

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Re: League of Legends
« Reply #2423 on: May 09, 2011, 12:29:01 pm »

Also don't be too aggressive early on, tyrind is freaking fragile until he hits lvl 6, and don't just stack crits, get some lifesteal and health if you can.
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Fikes

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Re: League of Legends
« Reply #2424 on: May 09, 2011, 01:37:37 pm »

Is it still possible to find patch preview notes? I hate their videos.

I recently started playing trynd. He is tough. My general build is Zeal, inf edge, either attack speed boots or merc treads (if the team has good mages and CC), upgrade Zeal to Phantom Dancer, then grab Spirit visage.

I don't remember my rune setup exactly, but I start the game with around 33% crit chance. When I am done with Inf Edge and PD my crit chance is 91% and easily raises to 100% when I take some damage.

Early game you have to play cautiously. You suffer from the same problem every melee class does, you have to put yourself in the enemy zone to attack but you have the added bonus of a self heal. At level 1 if you crit strike kill a minion you can heal yourself for 30 points. If you are going to take more than 30 damage getting that shot in you have a net loss of health. Generally it is better to just get those last hits at the tower.

In mid/late game team fights it is possible to "spinning slash" in and have it off cool down by the time you need to run (it is on an 8 second CD, lowered by crits, your ulti means you always survive at least 5 seconds). If you are the first one in, however, this will rarely ever work and you will die without causing much damage.

The best way to play Trynd in a team fight is to wait for your tank to engage, pick a target and hit them with everything you have. Use “w” to lower the attack damage for their entire team, spinning slash in, throw everything you have at their support or squishy DPS and hope for the best.

What I have found is that people really like to focus Trynd. If you can get the enemy team to blow their abilities on you and STILL get a kill, you are doing a good job.

I have had mixed results with Trynd, but enjoy a positive kill to death ratio.

Bluerobin

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Re: League of Legends
« Reply #2425 on: May 09, 2011, 01:52:54 pm »

Pretty much everything in the video has already been mentioned in the thread. I think they put out preview patch notes periodically, but they'll be out tomorrow when they do the actual patch, if nothing else.
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The moment the lever was pulled, somebody's pet kitten stepped onto the bridge. I read somewhere that if a cat falls more than 11 stories, it instinctively flares its legs out to increase air resistance. This slows it down enough to stick the landing with relatively minor injuries. In Dwarf Fortress, apparently, cats don't do that.

Dakk

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Re: League of Legends
« Reply #2426 on: May 09, 2011, 03:05:02 pm »

The jarvan changes are pretty manageable, I never play him full tank  and I take philosopher's stone as my first item, so the mana change on dragon strike is a minor issue. I don't think the cataclysm and golden aegies changes were needed though.
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Akigagak

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Re: League of Legends
« Reply #2427 on: May 09, 2011, 03:26:13 pm »

They say the new Tenacity items don't stack with each other, but will they stack with the abilities of people like Singed and Olaf?
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But then, life was also easier when I was running around here pretending to be a man, so I guess I should just "man up" and get back to work.
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umiman

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Re: League of Legends
« Reply #2428 on: May 09, 2011, 03:27:35 pm »

They say the new Tenacity items don't stack with each other, but will they stack with the abilities of people like Singed and Olaf?
Yes. However it no longer stacks additively. It stacks multiplicatively.

So technically it nerfs them.

Dakk

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Re: League of Legends
« Reply #2429 on: May 09, 2011, 03:30:35 pm »

They should, how will mundo and irelia remain hilarious if it doesn't. They only mentioned they were changing the name and making more items that give it, so it shouldnt change that.
And I think they meant the tenacity items not stacking with eachother, it should still stack with champion abilities.

http://www.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=728080

Note phreak said "if you have all 3 items that give tenacity, it'll just give you the singlest highest value, if you have all these 3 new items that give tenacity plus mercury threads, it will still give you only the 35 tenacity from mercury threads", champion abilities weren't mentioned at all.
« Last Edit: May 09, 2011, 03:34:50 pm by Dakk »
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