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Author Topic: YAGI: Yet Another Game Idea  (Read 1398 times)

Kagus

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YAGI: Yet Another Game Idea
« on: May 19, 2010, 07:38:04 pm »

Yes yes, we all know how futile it is to just yammer on about the great new idea for a game we had, or how everything would be better if only things were "this" or "that"...  But however unproductive it may be to discuss ideas we'd like to see in games, it certainly can be fun.  So hop on or sod off, ya gits!


This was something I thought about some time ago when I was considering the possibilities for a WH40k mod that was under development at the time for an FPS game.

The basic idea is that this is a kind of of team-based FPS in the vein of Battlefield or somesuch.  You hop into the game, pick a side, choose what kind of character/loadout to play as, and then work your way through domination of the map.  Standard issue stuff, yeah?

The catch is that you're not going to play as one of the grunts.  When you enter into the game, a small group of AI-controlled goons will also spawn and will follow you around wherever you go (giving short-range commands is also a possibility).

This basically means two things:  First, you will always have at least a little backup when you get into a firefight, so there's always someone watching your back.  Second, even with just a few players the map will turn into a massive swirling chaos of opposing grunts, as the AI "enhances" the playercount on both teams.  I've always had a thing for the big, flashy fights, and I'm fairly certain that there are others who would agree with me.

The available player classes would generally be commander types who could either charge into the fray alongside their supporters, or hang back a bit and shout encouragement at the sacks of meat that take his place on the front line.  The option could also be made available to have specialist combat types who operate without backup for the purpose of stealth or whatnot.

This would mostly just be for aesthetics, as the grunts would be far less physically robust or capable of damage as the players themselves, but by no means should they be harmless.  This would pave the way for squad-based combat in a multiplayer FPS without needing a full squad of those hard-to-find people who are actually willing to engage in any sort of teamwork.  Of course, it's still quite effective to buddy up with a couple other players and have a whole gaggle of goons charging around, but even without the, you'll very rarely be left completely alone.

Dead grunts could be restocked at spawn points should you happen to deplete your reserve.  After all, there's always more where they came from!

Soulwynd

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Re: YAGI: Yet Another Game Idea
« Reply #1 on: May 19, 2010, 09:18:29 pm »

I remember there was already a game like this. Just can't remember what game it was.
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Kagus

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Re: YAGI: Yet Another Game Idea
« Reply #2 on: May 19, 2010, 09:25:45 pm »

Really?  That'd be cool, I'd like to see how it's implemented.  Shame the name isn't coming to you at the moment.

Jerimy

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Re: YAGI: Yet Another Game Idea
« Reply #3 on: May 19, 2010, 09:54:04 pm »

Sounds like Brothers in Arms: Road to Hill 30 or whatever
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Soulwynd

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Re: YAGI: Yet Another Game Idea
« Reply #4 on: May 19, 2010, 09:59:35 pm »

I think it was ghost recon in co-op? Not sure about against eachother.
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Grakelin

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Re: YAGI: Yet Another Game Idea
« Reply #5 on: May 19, 2010, 10:09:15 pm »

The downside to this idea is that skilled players would pwn your AIs and change nothing.
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Googolplexed

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Re: YAGI: Yet Another Game Idea
« Reply #6 on: May 19, 2010, 10:35:05 pm »

The downside to this idea is that skilled players would pwn your AIs and change nothing.
With the right amount of balance this wouldn't happen.

Ever played VS an aimbot ?
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Grakelin

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Re: YAGI: Yet Another Game Idea
« Reply #7 on: May 19, 2010, 10:37:06 pm »

Sure, but that's just bullshit, and nobody wants to play that.
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Re: YAGI: Yet Another Game Idea
« Reply #8 on: May 19, 2010, 10:58:49 pm »

Yeah, but it shows that computers CAN beat normal players.

With a bit of balancing, it would make your squad useful, without being overpowered
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Grakelin

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Re: YAGI: Yet Another Game Idea
« Reply #9 on: May 19, 2010, 11:02:00 pm »

It doesn't beat you based on the AI ability to fight, though, it beats you because it automatically sends bullets to you. There is no way to balance an aimbot, except to make it miss a certain amount of the time, which AI already does.
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Kagus

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Re: YAGI: Yet Another Game Idea
« Reply #10 on: May 19, 2010, 11:17:02 pm »

I think that's more of an issue with realistic-style shooters, rather than "classic" shooters where you can take (and give) a fair amount of punishment without being all that badly worked-over.

This is supposed to be the chaotic in-the-fray kind of hoohah, not the peek-over-a-wall realism firefight.  After all, this idea did pop up when I was looking at a WH40k modification, I was thinking about orks and the like.

Grakelin

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Re: YAGI: Yet Another Game Idea
« Reply #11 on: May 19, 2010, 11:18:51 pm »

The over-top shooter and the realistic shooter are both susceptible to aimbots being too powerful. I used to play against aimbots on Quake 3, for goodness sake.
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Kagus

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Re: YAGI: Yet Another Game Idea
« Reply #12 on: May 19, 2010, 11:28:11 pm »

When I said "that's less of a problem", I was referring to the perceived need for aimbots, not the aimbotting itself (something that annoys me, personally).  I just meant that it's not quite the same for some guy to wipe out your hangers-on in something like that as it is for them to do it in a realism shooter, an arena where the AI of today is hilariously inept.

Sure, there's not really much preventing players from focusing on taking out another player's lackeys before nabbing the player themselves, but it does still have an effect on gameplay in terms of bullets shot, flash, and tactical maneuvers.  Like I said, this is primarily an aesthetics thing.  One way of thinking about it would be to consider the squaddies as sort of "extensions" of the player himself, serving as a kind of portion of the player's health bar or ammo belt.  Not that you'd program it in that way, but you know what I mean.

Pathos

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Re: YAGI: Yet Another Game Idea
« Reply #13 on: May 19, 2010, 11:43:35 pm »

I have lots of game ideas. And book ideas. And script ideas.

They're all written out in my head, I'm just far too lazy to put them to paper.

I don't really get the idea expressed in this thread. Sounds a lot like Starfox.
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LeoLeonardoIII

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Re: YAGI: Yet Another Game Idea
« Reply #14 on: May 20, 2010, 01:51:23 pm »

AI that can kill you is easy to make. In fact, games generally make the mistake of stopping there in AI development.

Making AI that can convincingly fail to kill you but will do it sometimes is more difficult.

Also I think it would be nice to have no AI grunts, because you could easily have too many players as it is! Maybe start out with the ability to recruit grunts, but reduce the number of available grunts based on current player load.

I'd love the idea of a simple-graphics (nothing flashy, but 3D) WW2 game with vehicles and stuff. Maybe miniaturized, so your character is a fraction of the complexity of one from Battlefield 1942. The whole point is to present the world and the objects with the minimum system / server resources.

Players who did very well would get promoted, which wouldn't improve their effectiveness but it would give them a command radius. Friendlies within a command radius take less damage from friendly fire and maybe gain some slight bonus.

Equipment loadout should be set up by the player before deployment. He can create several different loadouts so he doesn't have to waste time after dying. Each piece weighs something, and there's a maximum equipment weight. If you get to say half the maximum, you move slower.

Each piece of equipment would give a benefit. Like a radio allows a nearby friendly to communicate on the server radio chat, call in airstrikes and artillery, or call for backup.

Binoculars let you zoom in and see things from farther away.

A pistol is a handy backup if you run out of rifle ammo. Or you could forgoe the rifle altogether to save weight. Or maybe instead of a rifle you want a shotgun, which is shorter range and doesn't work well against body armor.

A heavier gun, like a machine gun, must be braced on the ground but it's really good against infantry.

A bazooka is great against armor. A mortar is even stronger but fires indirectly, which makes it useful only from a distance.

A flamethrower has short range, makes you vulnerable to fuel tank hits, and weighs a lot. But great for clearing buildings.

You could wear body armor, but it takes up weight. A helmet also takes up weight, but helps if someone hits your head and especially against shrapnel and debris from above.

A medical kit can be used to patch up someone to stop bleeding and heal a little, but has limited uses.

Flares can be used to signal or to distract, or to light something up.

Grenades, smoke grenades, poison gas canisters.


Oh and when you call in an airstrike, you're actually calling to players in planes up above. Same with artillery, you had better give them the right coordinates or the players firing the guns will hit the wrong place.


The countryside has towns and stuff, plus natural formations like rivers and cliffs and ridges, which form natural combat zones because they're choke points. Communication lines, radio towers, power plants, factories, bridges, vehicle depots, fuel supplies, etc. would make obvious targets that all sides would want to control. Controlling a site (which would take some time to stabilize) would give you a forward spawn point and whatever resource that facility gives you.

High ranking officers can requisition vehicles and such at any spawn point, and players may need to drive them (and supplies they carry) to some other place for the operation. But these requisitions cost officer points, which renew slowly. The points renew faster if you personally do cool stuff, and if your side has secured appropriate facilities.


Of course, one side will inevitably begin to win. At some point, the losing side will automatically gain the support of some third country that was previously unwilling to enter the fight. At that point, requisition points for them become very cheap, and the winning attackers have to face waves of excellently equipped fighters. If the balance shifts back, the other country stops their support and requisitioning becomes normal again. If they're smart, the losing team will sabotage their requisitioned vehicles so before capture they can be blown up.

But if one side actually wins, then they get a little "victory point" on their account based on how active they were. Say your account is Axis, and you were always at the front doing stuff. You would get the full "victory point". But if you only logged on for a little bit, ot logged on a lot but didn't do anything, you would only get like 0.1 VP. So it wouldn't help to create six dozen accounts on each side, log them in, and have them sit around. These are really just for bragging rights, and for purposes of team rankings. You can tell how important you are to your team, and also how active the members of each team are.

Nor could you switch sides if your side was losing, because your account is stuck with that side. This could also help prevent spying by people who just switch back and forth.

Finally, the best part I think is that it's fun to be on the winning team but it's also fun to be on the losing team. Do you want to try flying a plane but you don't know how? Other people always seem to grab up the planes? Well if your team is losing then there are like a dozen planes just sitting out so grab one and start learning! It creates this feeling os the "last push into the enemy's hardest territory" facing huge waves of tanks and kamikaze jeeps and stuff.
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