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[NullForceOmega]

And the H&K L30 gattling laser?  The Winchester P94 plasma rifle?  Fallout intentionally tries to be immersive by throwing the known in alongside the new and different.

[Rolan7]

Edit:  And the Brotherhood will continue, because it is part of the setting and until New Vegas, was in fact the single most important part of the setting.  Even with its diminished role, the BoS isn't leaving any time soon.

Yeah, beyond the annoyance mechanic of radiation, they're the most constant factor in the series.  Even if (like many things) their nature changes drastically in FO3 (distance, developer) and FO:NV (time).

But even in FO:NV I can blame the change on the NCR, and still sympathize with both.

Urgh.  The possibilities.  The "Legion" should have been an excessively loose federation of tribes united to oppose the imperialism of the NCR.  Essentially native american culture.  The savage survivalism of the new world versus the regimented survivalism of the old world reborn.

But instead the NCR is flawed but good, and the Legion is not just evil but distasteful.

[Bohandas]

The Legi9n isn't just evil and distasteful, it's consoderably more evil and distasteful than any other faction, including the Fiends.


EDIT:

As for the brotherhood, they're bad guys too. Like the Legion they're actively trying to turn back the clock on technology and civilization, although unlike the legion they're not stupid anough to do it to themselves aas well; they just do it to other people

[Sergius]

I can't sympathize with a faction that willingly irradiates their own genitals by wearing skirt things in the wasteland.

At least you can rad-proof a pair of pants or something.

[NullForceOmega]

The Brotherhood does not attempt to 'turn back time' for the other inhabitants of the wastes, they just remove the most dangerous tools from play.  They don't jack peoples computers, they take their laser rifles.  They don't smash up peoples irrigation systems, they grab the suit of power armor great-grandpa left in the shed.  If you fight back, they kill you.  You don't like it, that doesn't make them evil.  If a raider is attacking you and your family to take your food, you fight back.  If your baby is starving and someone else has food, you try to take it.  Stop trying to moralize the factions, from their own perspective they are ALL the good guys.  I don't agree with them, I agree with BoS.

[Flying Dice]

So it's okay to fight back against people trying to steal your property and threatening you with violence if you resist, but only if it isn't the Bloody Magpies Brotherhood that's nicking it?

(Seriously, that's the biggest connection between BoS and Space Marines, not the power armor.  )

[Darkmere]

There is still the fact that they went to open war with the NCR just because NCR wanted to use old world tech AT ALL.

[mainiac]

While I tend to sympathize with the NCR, that is judging the BoS by their worst moment.  Without the BoS around the supermutants probably would have wiped out all human life on the west coast before the NCR even existed.

[Rolan7]

There is still the fact that they went to open war with the NCR just because NCR wanted to use old world tech AT ALL.

Citation needed, I guess?  Oddly, neither the Gamepedia nor Wikia wikis explain the start of the conflict...  Except using non-canon Van Buren info (that Fallout 3 which wasn't made).

[hops]

So I'm trying to play a sniper, but so far all playthroughs have been too frustrating and unsatisfying for me to continue.

What's a good way to deal with close combat when you're a sniper? It's kind of annoying having to run around shooting an armored enemy who won't die despite repeated headshots. Enemies also seem to see me before I see them.

[Astral]

Either a mod that makes headshots more difficult and realisic, preferably both for you and enemies (with some of the damage mitigated by, you know, wearing a helmet), or by saving up for the anti materiel rifle.

Being squishy sucks, especially early game, and generally involves a lot of kiting if they do manage to get close up.

Barring that, be sneaky and grab land mines, then drop a few in their path before you start shooting. Most enemies will attempt a shortest path, or straight line, to get to you, so they end up trampling over every single explosive in their way.

You could also abuse the pathing by jumping on a rock or something. But that would be mean.

[Darkmere]

There is still the fact that they went to open war with the NCR just because NCR wanted to use old world tech AT ALL.

Citation needed, I guess?  Oddly, neither the Gamepedia nor Wikia wikis explain the start of the conflict...  Except using non-canon Van Buren info (that Fallout 3 which wasn't made).

The wikia cites it as a loading screen source from NV. It doesn't say anything except that the Brotherhood started it, but... that means the Brotherhood started it. The only BOS across all the games that help anyone NOT directly forwarding their own cause is the Capital Wasteland group... which was disowned by the rest, and the midwestern from Fallout tactics, which is so disturbingly non-canon I can't even.

I also offer as example Veronica's quest should she decide to leave. The instant she decides to try and use her knowledge to help people (not fight... HELP people) the immediate reaction is to murder the Followers contact and try to kill her/the courier. And these were the liberals who didn't toe the open war line, Elijah notwithstanding.

They really, really aren't nice people, even to their own who disagree.

While I tend to sympathize with the NCR, that is judging the BoS by their worst moment.  Without the BoS around the supermutants probably would have wiped out all human life on the west coast before the NCR even existed.

I said before that the old Mariposa stuff is now long in the past, and I'm not willing to give them a free pass on destabilizing an already turbulent region just because their great-grandfathers helped take out the Master.

[scriver]

I can't sympathize with a faction that willingly irradiates their own genitals by wearing skirt things in the wasteland.

At least you can rad-proof a pair of pants or something.

Led thongs. Stylish and practical.

[Neonivek]

Look at worst the NCR are the necessary evil of the wasteland. They might do despicable things but never out of malice but at a false sense of "greater good". Yet it is aided by the fact that yes... someone needs to consolidate power and the NCR are the cuddliest blood thirsty bear to do it.

Mind you that is if the new fallout series has narrative consistency... which it doesn't.

the NCR are morally ambiguous mostly done right... You don't trust them, but you know that in the end if they aren't the victors then far worse things are going to happen.

Caesar... Is just flat out cackling villain and they don't make any sense whatsoever...

But that is New Fallout for you... villains need to be really OBVIOUSLY EVIL!!! MWAHAHAHAAA! What was that? They could get what they want without being evil and that their evil actions actually hurt them in the short run AND long run? Who cares EVIL!

[BFEL]

Yeah to all the BoS fans saying how much peaceful tech they share:
NOOOOOOO THEYYYYYY DOOOOOOON'TTTTTT

Seriously. The Brotherhood's strategy is very much stated as "cower in bunkers with ALL THE TECHS and wait for everyone else to die off"

I am an obvious supporter of the Wild Card ending simply because it means you get to choose how to deal with all the different crazies and thus actually use the parts that aren't totally insane.

With NCR or House they both go "nope, we CLEARLY know exactly everything we need to, fuck all those people, WE are the authority now and the things they developed are just there for us to cannibalize"