Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Pandarsenic]

I too got Cobrarsenic powers and I do NOT trust them at all.

Why? The name of the person who gave them to us. Almost any time I've given that many powers to someone, it was:
1) Spartacus
or
2) Utter bullshit

My guess is the protects are fake at best, the inspects are probably naive, and the roleblocks are likely 0%, possibly with us told they worked even if they didn't.

So yeah.

[Cheeetar]

Hmm... ok, well, Webadict, didn't you roleclaim that you got information each night?

Yes, I too got three one-shots. I wonder, are they different for each of us? I gots a protect, inspect, and roleblock.

I've also got these three, but I'm going to assume they're useless. Everybody (most people?) gaining these one-shots would be overpowered for town.

I recieved an Anonymous Spoiler at the end of last night:

The duel between Webadict and GeneralGuy wouldn't have been any better for town if GeneralGuy had won instead.

I take that to mean that Webadict is clean, unless the Anonymous Spoiler came from scum... in which case they could also be trying to frame him. Did anyone else get one of these last night?

Interesting development. I believe the logical thing to do here would be to lynch whoever gave you this information. It'd give us a confirmed townie of Webadict, no less. Of course, I highly doubt whoever gave you that information was town-aligned. I don't think they were mafia, probably some third-party with a plot.

The Anonymous Spoiler was Anonymous. And even if we knew who he was, lynching him wouldn't prove anything, because the only person he PMed was Solifuge.

This is a bit complex, so stay with me.

Okay Org, then think of it this way: If we're both scum, who would be harder to get rid of later?

The logical conclusion here would be "Webadict's harder to lynch than . Why would Webadict tell Org to lynch Webadict?

Webadict didn't tell Org to lynch Webadict, Webadict told Org to lynch sensibly.

Or, is there more? Because once I'm lynched, and I come up TOWN (not mafia, SK, cult, jester, survivor, or lyncher), you can smash your head into your desk several times, okay? Okay.

He seems pretty sure he's going to get lynched here.

So I got curious, maybe he does want himself lynched. I stated as such.

I actually would prefer not to be lynched, but it's nice to see that I can get lynched easily if I'm ever a jester.

The only bonus to me being lynched is that Cheeetar gets lynched.

That's a very bad response. He was justifying lynching himself. Nobody with a brain tries to justify themselves getting lynched. If YOU think it's a good idea, your enemies will certainly think it's also a good idea. And with EVERYBODY ELSE thinking it's a good idea, watch as people join your bandwagon.

This was also very passive. He was saying nothing useful, so I dug deeper. PotC statement here.

Where does he think himself getting lynched is a good idea? He said it was bad except for the me (Cheeetar) getting lynched part.

Wow, way to instill WIFOM, Mr.Person, especially after saying you'd rather have supported me. That seems like an effective way to make everyone suspicious of everything, don't you think?

First off, now that I've had a night of sleep (haven't had a full night of sleep in 4 days, 2 of those were all-nighters), I can call you on your bullshit. Saying "He might be a PotC" is not WIFOM. WIFOM can be best summed up by "Would the mafia do that, or would they know I'd think they'd do that and do the opposite instead?". And I can't fit a PotC callout into that template. Can you?

That being said, Webadict is correct that if we spend all of our time thinking about PotC's and what not, we'll all go insane and "make everyone suspicious of everything". Then again, not only is this mafia, this is a crazy modded game of mafia where we really should be suspicious of everything. It's always best to assume the roleflips are right until something says otherwise. That something can be cop inspections, watchers seeing a "Townie" performing an action, or just missing at lylo and the game not being over.

But ok, you think I'm spreading WIFOM. Do you call me scum? No. Do you ask me questions to determine if I'm scum? No. Do you ask me why I said what I said, or why I'm spreading WIFOM, or anything useful at all? No. Instead, you say the equivalent of this

You're spreading WIFOM, yes?

To which I said, "No, I don't think so, explain."

WIFOM, to my very limited understanding that Webadict will soon start shouting at and saying I'm wrong, is causing confusion in the town with hypotheticals. 'so and so could happen/be true. Think about it'
You were saying Webadict could be a PotC, but why? There was no reason to speculating on his role, and it would only make people doubt if they should go ahead with trusting Webadict's words after he was lynched. Seeing as people are more likely not PotC than they are, making people doubt his alignment even after lynch had no purpose other than to cause confusion over his real alignment after death.

Really? Really?!? You just said that I could be a Pillar of the Community! You moron! Did you have short term memory loss?!? You're pre-WIFOMing my death!

Again, an odd response from Webadict. No questions, no statements of my alignment, nothing. He didn't even answer my question. Fucking useless.

Let's see how Webadict usually reacts to being called a Jester. This is from iPick Mafia, day one.

Lots of crap

You seriously believe I'm a Jester?

... Really? You do realize you're only rationale for that is that you assume I'm wrong about dakarian. I was also almost lynched. I could've easily gotten one more vote and lynched myself by doing much more. You guys are incredibly stupid if you're really thinking THAT was a Jester play. You guys have no idea what a Jester is.

If I were a Jester, I'd simply ignore the game completely. Literally. I would post in EVERY OTHER GAME EXCEPT THIS ONE. I was at one vote away from being able to lynch myself. You either think I'm the worst player that ever played, or you have some really bad ideas popping through your head.

But, hey. If you want to believe I'm a Jester, it only saves me from being killed, right? Once I'm dead, I'm proven Town, and that's that. But, while I'm alive, I can point out the scum and have people listen to me.

Get over yourself, SirBayer, and get some original ideas too.

...

Note that Webadict was town in that game. And since Webadict is acting very differently this game than from iPick, I'm forced to conclude his alignment is different, thus he's scum.

No, not really. Meta only works if a person reacts a specific way to events in the game. (For example, this guy always lurks when he's scum, and he's lurking now when he's active on other parts of the forum)

A single specific response to something on a different game doesn't mean he'll always react that way.

Mr. Person, you are a right silly ninnymuggins if you start suspecting the Mod. Also, did you get any powers?

Seriously? Are you even trying? You're calling me scummy for not trusting the mod? Can the rest of you see his obvious scumminess?

No.
Mr. Person.

[Cheeetar]

Whoops, quote fail. The 'no, not really' bit and the voting for Mr. Person were what I said.

[Jim Groovester]

Mr. Person, you are a right silly ninnymuggins if you start suspecting the Mod. Also, did you get any powers?

Seriously? Are you even trying? You're calling me scummy for not trusting the mod? Can the rest of you see his obvious scumminess?

There's a considerable difference between not trusting the mod, and saying that you think he's scum.

Leafsnail, was the extent of the Gymn Jivester role just to find Lensfail? Not even to know what his alignment was or what his role would do?

[Mr.Person]

You try to find out what everyone else has gotten for their roles during the Night.

Well, we've all gotten one shots, we might as well plan it out to get the best results. Plus, I don't trust them.

You ask from whom Solifuge got his information.

Easily the most questionable of my actions, but I still stand by asking who told Solifuge that information, yes. Note, though, that I only care if the person who told Solifuge this already knew the information before it was sent.

And you ask what I learned from my role. I mean, you know you're a goner, so why not take what you can from the Town, right?

You've already claimed getting information each night, so the only reason you WOULDN'T claim it now is if you were scum.

You're also saying that a THIRD PARTY is sending Solifuge secret information to make me (Am I scum according to your reasoning) look Town. ... Riiiiiiight.

Could be scum, I guess, but that seems too obvious, if you ask me. I'm pretty sure whoever sent it isn't town, in any event.

I mean, if I were a third party, that'd be the PERFECT way to make myself look Town. Also, you wish to lynch the source of this, so that instead of scumhunting or anything useful, we can waste a lynch proving someone who will die the next Night. Thumbs up for the reasoning.

Actually, anonymously telling someone that you're not scum is a pretty good way to confirm yourself since most of the people here are gullible sheep who'll accept Occam's Razor arguments as valid.

I don't know about you guys, but I most certainly have a protection, so if we prove Webadict, I can guaran-fucking-tee that Webadict will be protected if he gets confirmed. Now, if these 1-shots do as they say, I dunno, but I'll risk it.

I told Org to vote whoever because that's the logical thing for him to do. Seriously, if I had a choice between scum Mr.Person or scum Toaster, I'd lynch scum Mr.Person. This is a pretty straightfoward case and does not affect whether I'm scum or not.

I'm not even going to continue this because you're defending yourself against an attack I'm not making anymore.

And I had the majority (Or perhaps I was tied), when I said that. Some of us have to make cases. If I wanted myself lynched, I wouldn't post a HUGE LIST OF INFORMATION. My God! Call that WIFOM, but everyone knows I was the clear shot to be lynched. Maybe not for good reasons, but I was the obvious lynch, no? Using a hindsight bias now just makes your argument terrible and scummy.

Again, I'm not making that attack anymore. I don't ignore possibilities just because they're unlikely, I was just checking.

Either way, even if it's not the true definition of WIFOM, it is scummy in all accounts. You're basically trying to defame me or make yourself look better from my lynch. You're covering yourself because you knew I would come up Town, and with your attacks being repeatedly shot down, you needed something, so you tried to say that I was basically scum when I die and show up Town.

First off, I'm the one that's been shooting YOUR attacks down.

Second, at the time, you had never tried to shoot any of my attacks down because I HADN'T MADE ANY AT THAT POINT! Holy shit, you're trying to argue I called you a PotC because I was getting frustrated my attacks weren't sticking when that was my FIRST ATTACK ON YOU!

And if you're going to complain about me not asking me questions, then how about deal with straight-up findings that I perceive and you can debate their accuracy as we're currently doing. Or is that too scummy of me?

At the time, you hadn't asked any questions. That's what I'm saying, and you can't debate that your first response was "You sure are acting scummy" and nothing else, which is passive as all fuck. Afterwards, you were all like "Oh, you're scum", but your FIRST response was no questions, no accusations, passive statement only.

Afterwards, I have indeed been debating with you, unless you think we're just having a pleasant chat.

You're then trying to justify my scumminess using meta, which is an okay justification if it weren't about two months old.

So you're trying to say that you COMPLETELY change how you play every two months? No trace of your old style? Not even a hint of how you used to play? Excuse me while I laugh at your retarded lie.

BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Oh man, Webadict, that's a good joke. Ok, so what's your SERIOUS defense?

It's also fallacious in that it assumes Correlation Implies Causation. You're assuming that my freak-out there is caused SOLELY by calling me a Jester, as opposed to having built-up anger over being not listened to and being ganged-up on by several people for it. It's the same thing for Cheeetar's post where I did that huge anger post as scum: I needed people to swear at me there.

So, it works if most of your argument weren't built upon it.

So you were being listened to here, where you were this close to being lynched? Oh wait, no, you were being ganged up on in here, too, and at the time, almost nobody wanted to lynch the players you wanted lynched.

And I do call you scum. Several times. So much that I switch to you being my chainlynch target. Why didn't you bother quoting that?

I was answering Cheeetar's question about why I thought you were scum. And remember, all that stuff before was about your FIRST RESPONSE, not your later ones.

[Mr.Person]

The Anonymous Spoiler was Anonymous. And even if we knew who he was, lynching him wouldn't prove anything, because the only person he PMed was Solifuge.

You're not decoupling Solifuge from the person who PM'd it. Let's assume that ToonyMan is the one who knew this and told Solifuge. Solifuge, town or scum, would relay the information over exactly as he got it IF he chose to relay it. If he relayed a false PM, ToonyMan would just counterclaim, scum for a townie (or possibly we'd just pick the scum on the first try!) and then Webadict's clear, as well. (This is assuming Solifuge isn't making the whole message up)

In any event, Solifuge's alignments doesn't matter, the only ones that matter are the guy who sent the message and how he/she got the information. If they're mod-given, that's good. We just wait and continue to tell people this information. No claims. If the information was pre-known, however, then obviously whoever sent Solifuge that message is scum since there's no way for a townie to know that kind of information.

Webadict didn't tell Org to lynch Webadict, Webadict told Org to lynch sensibly.

This is like a bank telling people to "save wisely". They may or may not care about the people who save or their money, but the end result is that people go to the bank.

That's a very bad response. He was justifying lynching himself. Nobody with a brain tries to justify themselves getting lynched. If YOU think it's a good idea, your enemies will certainly think it's also a good idea. And with EVERYBODY ELSE thinking it's a good idea, watch as people join your bandwagon.

This was also very passive. He was saying nothing useful, so I dug deeper. PotC statement here.

Where does he think himself getting lynched is a good idea? He said it was bad except for the me (Cheeetar) getting lynched part.

I didn't say that he thought it was a good idea, I said he was justifying himself being lynched. It sends the message that you're ok with being lynched.

WIFOM, to my very limited understanding that Webadict will soon start shouting at and saying I'm wrong, is causing confusion in the town with hypotheticals. 'so and so could happen/be true. Think about it'
You were saying Webadict could be a PotC, but why? There was no reason to speculating on his role, and it would only make people doubt if they should go ahead with trusting Webadict's words after he was lynched. Seeing as people are more likely not PotC than they are, making people doubt his alignment even after lynch had no purpose other than to cause confusion over his real alignment after death.

Believe me, I would of been among the first to laugh at anyone who distrusts a flipped Webadict because of a PotC.

So we should just ignore role situations with unlikely roles and focus only on the common ones? You're the exact idiot I was just talking about with Occam's Razor. I threw it out since I determined Webadict is just scum, not scum getting bussed really badly. You're just throwing it out since it's unlikely.

In any event, I just wanted Webadict's reaction. Figuring out if he was a PotC or not wasn't even on the radar, but hey, I've made an informed decision.

No, not really. Meta only works if a person reacts a specific way to events in the game. (For example, this guy always lurks when he's scum, and he's lurking now when he's active on other parts of the forum)

A single specific response to something on a different game doesn't mean he'll always react that way.

He will always react with a similar mindset in a similar way. Webadict's reaction here was completely different. Instead of getting angry that anybody was even suggesting Jester (since it implies that the person is playing so poorly that they have to be sucking on purpose), Webadict didn't give a shit he was being called a Jester.

So, Cheeetar, why are you defending Webadict?

[Jim Groovester]

Double post walls o' text?

Sheesh, dude, calm down.

You're not decoupling Solifuge from the person who PM'd it. Let's assume that ToonyMan is the one who knew this and told Solifuge. Solifuge, town or scum, would relay the information over exactly as he got it IF he chose to relay it. If he relayed a false PM, ToonyMan would just counterclaim, scum for a townie (or possibly we'd just pick the scum on the first try!) and then Webadict's clear, as well. (This is assuming Solifuge isn't making the whole message up)

In any event, Solifuge's alignments doesn't matter, the only ones that matter are the guy who sent the message and how he/she got the information. If they're mod-given, that's good. We just wait and continue to tell people this information. No claims. If the information was pre-known, however, then obviously whoever sent Solifuge that message is scum since there's no way for a townie to know that kind of information.

This actually does have some merit to it. Solifuge, where did you get that information from?

[webadict]

Solifuge, don't answer that. At all. It's blatant rolefishing and a last ditch attempt for Mr.Person to do something before he's lynched.

Like saying he doesn't trust his powers and then says he'll protect me with them in the same post. He's just trying to push it as far as he can.

I'm not having it. he's not even trying to hide his scumminess anymore.

[Mr.Person]

Solifuge, don't answer that. At all. It's blatant rolefishing and a last ditch attempt for Mr.Person to do something before he's lynched.

Like saying he doesn't trust his powers and then says he'll protect me with them in the same post. He's just trying to push it as far as he can.

I'm not having it. he's not even trying to hide his scumminess anymore.

I never asked Solifuge to do anything.

[Mr.Person]

Oh, you're talking about Jim Groovester's question, aren't you? You see, I got a little confused when you somehow blamed me for a question somebody else asked.

Lemme go make an Advice Webadict, it'll be really easy.

Bitch about lurkers

ADVICE WEBADICT PENGUIN HEAD

Drill people with the most votes

[Solifuge]

Solifuge, don't answer that. At all. It's blatant rolefishing and a last ditch attempt for Mr.Person to do something before he's lynched.

Like saying he doesn't trust his powers and then says he'll protect me with them in the same post. He's just trying to push it as far as he can.

I'm not having it. he's not even trying to hide his scumminess anymore.

I never asked Solifuge to do anything.

Suddenly, I feel as though you guys are vying for my trust. You're all gone nutters!

Also, I don't intend to reveal the circumstances behind the information. Treat it however you will... I mostly wanted to get reactions from folks, and figured I'd share the info lest I take it to the grave.

[Cheeetar]

So, Cheeetar, why are you defending Webadict?

Town Webadict is credit to team.

[Mr.Person]

And what, specifically, makes you think that?

[Cheeetar]

*webadict explaining himself for once*

This makes me think he's town.
Webadict is a skilled mafia player.
A skilled mafia player that is town aligned is a good thing.

[webadict]

Mr.Person, you were totally asking for Solifuge to claim his source. You know, the part where you TOLD HIM TO CLAIM HIS SOURCE AND LYNCH HIM? Yeah. That's where.