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[Grakelin]

Im a troll because i think the game designers prefer to put in graphics rather than gameplay?How does that make me a troll?I still play doom,pacman etc so i don't care about graphics.[edit]Oops my last post DID sound like a troll post.

Don't apologize, lots of people here in the thread are saying the exact same thing about consumers.

I actually just go with vanilla DF. I find it really amusing when people barrel through here complaining about how designers only care about graphics at the same time they're discussing how great their tileset makes DF.

[Shades]

Im a troll because i think the game designers prefer to put in graphics rather than gameplay?How does that make me a troll?I still play doom,pacman etc so i don't care about graphics.[edit]Oops my last post DID sound like a troll post.

I wouldn't have said pacman's graphical level actually detracts from the game so I'd count that as good graphics, simple but enjoyable. Doom I have trouble playing now, although I don't find that with Quake.

[The butcher]

I wasn't insulting pacman for graphics...

[Shades]

I wasn't insulting pacman for graphics...

No but you implied that you played it despite a non-focus on graphics. I was just mentioning that it was a game I didn't consider to have bad graphics (referring back to my comment that I can't enjoy games with bad graphics). It's a good example of how graphics can age well when the simplicity of the game means it doesn't look cluttered or hard to decipher.

[alway]

Im a troll because i think the game designers prefer to put in graphics rather than gameplay?How does that make me a troll?I still play doom,pacman etc so i don't care about graphics.[edit]Oops my last post DID sound like a troll post.

Don't apologize, lots of people here in the thread are saying the exact same thing about consumers.

I actually just go with vanilla DF. I find it really amusing when people barrel through here complaining about how designers only care about graphics at the same time they're discussing how great their tileset makes DF.

I have yet to use a tileset, after playing DF for about 1.5 years now. Dunno why people think they are neccessary...
As for me, I don't mind bad graphics as long as the controls aren't unresponsive/slow. Hence my inability to play anything on Dosbox.

[LeoLeonardoIII]

I used to read Game Revolution. Dunno about their quality now.

I like Yahtzee (Zero Punctuation) even though he brings up the same points for every single game. It's because the games he reviews are bad. And mainly I like to see someone else who also noticed the crappy parts that I noticed.

Really though imagine a game like that one truck racer. That should still be a 2 or so because it does launch and you can drive around a little. A game that's not very buggy but is just horrible otherwise could be a 3 or 4. Based on that, 5 could be "you won't hate the manufacturer, but you won't really enjoy yourself".

[Shades]

Really though imagine a game like that one truck racer. That should still be a 2 or so because it does launch and you can drive around a little. A game that's not very buggy but is just horrible otherwise could be a 3 or 4. Based on that, 5 could be "you won't hate the manufacturer, but you won't really enjoy yourself".

I don't know. It might be preferable, and so worth rating higher, if the big rig game didn't start ....

[Sowelu]

Im a troll because i think the game designers prefer to put in graphics rather than gameplay?How does that make me a troll?I still play doom,pacman etc so i don't care about graphics.[edit]Oops my last post DID sound like a troll post.

To be honest, I said it sounded like a troll because this is the single biggest complaint among indie/retro gamers, to the point where everyone just kind of silently beats their head against the wall whenever it comes up.  People have been complaining about this for the last ten years or more...and yet, people are always happy to jump on the [argument | preaching to the choir].  It's the worst topic ever, and yet it's still usually enough to derail a conversation completely.

But maybe that's just my opinion.

[Grakelin]

I like Yahtzee (Zero Punctuation) even though he brings up the same points for every single game. It's because the games he reviews are bad. And mainly I like to see someone else who also noticed the crappy parts that I noticed.

I don't know, Yahtzee seems to have a mega crush on Valve (The Orange Box review was so lollerous, and it got him a free trip to the behind the scenes. Integrity!), and I don't always agree with what he's saying. For instance, I first heard about 'The Witcher' from Yahtzee's review, and assumed he was telling the truth about it being terrible until I actually played it. My lord, how far off he was!

Though, he also dislikes entire genres, which doesn't help.

[darkflagrance]

The point is that complexity is something that is not being added to the former base model. It's just a steady gain of unnecessary features. Another example would be the Pokémon games, which gained - in the latest one - the ability to make bread and that was about it. Oh, and a bunch of other Pokémon.

Pokemon is actually an interesting case when it comes to relative standards between games.

First of all, Nintendo is not counting on the same demographic playing all of the games in the pokemon series. They therefore have little incentive to make significant improvements or changes, and are instead biased towards repackaging a shinier version of their product for the next generation. Features like poffins (pokemon breadmaking) add a minigame but don't change the core gameplay that is still novel to their desired demographic.

In addition, as a competitive pokemon gamer, I would say that the evolution of the portions I care about has not been an unsubstantial or unnecessary one. Certainly complexity of pokemon battling has increased over time. However, I think that most competitive pokemon players would agree that the changes to the battle mechanics of the game (gen 2: held items, special defense; gen 3: better held items, abilities, vastly increased customizability of pokemon through EVs; gen 4: physical/special split, rounding out of held items introduced in gen 3) have increased the entertainment value and deepened the battle system.

[Grakelin]

I agree. I love pokemanz.

[nenjin]

I think Yahtzee gets hung up on trying to be fun and snide too often. Sometimes he says things and I'm like "that's funny, but it doesn't really tell me anything other than you don't like it."

Which doesn't exactly narrow it down considering how much he doesn't like, and for what reasons. I can rely on ZP to tell me what's bad, usually (I thought the Witcher was clunky and cheesy.) As for what's good....I don't think I've ever used his reviews to inform me on that.

[returntonull]

I think Yahtzee gets hung up on trying to be fun and snide too often. Sometimes he says things and I'm like "that's funny, but it doesn't really tell me anything other than you don't like it."

Which doesn't exactly narrow it down considering how much he doesn't like, and for what reasons. I can rely on ZP to tell me what's bad, usually (I thought the Witcher was clunky and cheesy.) As for what's good....I don't think I've ever used his reviews to inform me on that.

Well ZP is a lot like a Let's Play. You aren't really watching it for the game. You're watching it cause you like hearing someone talk and say amusing things about the game.

[nenjin]

Well, clearly he and others see it differently. Which kind of goes to the "WTF" state of gaming journalism.

[MrWiggles]

Anybody else watches Sessler Soapbox?

Its tangetically related.