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Author Topic: Nobles when playing as a non dwarven Civ?  (Read 1007 times)

ydirbut

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Nobles when playing as a non dwarven Civ?
« on: May 03, 2010, 05:47:53 pm »

So I changed Humans to be [Civ_Controlable] instead of dwarves. However when I started a game, I noticed that once I started a game, The only noble I have is a warlord and I cannot appoint other nobles. I tried copying the parts of the raws that seemed to deal with nobles, but that didn't do anything. What should I do to add nobles to humans?
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King_of_the_weasels

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Re: Nobles when playing as a non dwarven Civ?
« Reply #1 on: May 03, 2010, 06:17:41 pm »

I suggest you take away warlord and warrior, I've done that and gotten expedition leader before so it should probably work.
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Deon

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Re: Nobles when playing as a non dwarven Civ?
« Reply #2 on: May 03, 2010, 06:30:38 pm »

You should copy dwarven nobles in entity_default.txt. Do not forget to generate a new world.
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derigo

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Re: Nobles when playing as a non dwarven Civ?
« Reply #3 on: May 03, 2010, 06:31:58 pm »

Yea modding custom nobles is very tricky if you're inexperienced.  Definitely easiest to just copy the dwarf nobles.
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SethCreiyd

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Re: Nobles when playing as a non dwarven Civ?
« Reply #4 on: May 03, 2010, 07:21:12 pm »

At the very least, you need to make sure that all the [RESPONSIBILITY] tags are accounted for.  Copying the Dwarf Nobles will work for this (remember to rename positions like "Chief Medical Dwarf," though).

Note that this will drastically change the nature of human society as it is in the unmodded game.  If you don't want to compromise this, you can still play a functional game with them in fortress mode, by copying/pasting the responsibilities from the various dwarf nobles into the one authoritative human noble position.

Like this:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

And add [APPOINTED_BY:WARLORD] to the Warrior position.

Now you have a Warlord who rules everything with an iron fist, and all the Warriors you need to enforce said rule.  You'll still have to add a doctor-type noble with [RESPONSIBILITY:HEALTH_MANAGEMENT] or you won't have a Health 'z' screen.  For Dungeon Masters behavior, use [RESPONSIBILITY:TAME_EXOTICS].

Chances are, this warlord would always be busy doing something.  Question remains if you'll get a replacement Warlord when yours dies (if there is an heir present at the settlement you're playing, you may end up with a child in charge!).  This is rather uncharted territory, so if you decide to do it, let us know the results.  For SCIENCE!
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DalGren

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Re: Nobles when playing as a non dwarven Civ?
« Reply #5 on: May 03, 2010, 07:53:44 pm »

I noticed that while custom positions are honored in worldgen, unless they are exactly like the original Dwarven nobles, they might fail hard in DF mode.
For example positions with [GENDER:FEMALE] being taken automagically by males, or positions requiring a specific character class (which seems to work in worldgen) getting filled by the rest.
I was also unable to get classes with [MENIAL_WORK_EXEMPTION] to respect the token, and had nobility working as regular peons (or even harder!) even if being a practical copy of dwarven equivalents.
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ydirbut

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Re: Nobles when playing as a non dwarven Civ?
« Reply #6 on: May 05, 2010, 09:09:30 pm »

At the very least, you need to make sure that all the [RESPONSIBILITY] tags are accounted for.  Copying the Dwarf Nobles will work for this (remember to rename positions like "Chief Medical Dwarf," though).

Note that this will drastically change the nature of human society as it is in the unmodded game.  If you don't want to compromise this, you can still play a functional game with them in fortress mode, by copying/pasting the responsibilities from the various dwarf nobles into the one authoritative human noble position.

Like this:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

And add [APPOINTED_BY:WARLORD] to the Warrior position.

Now you have a Warlord who rules everything with an iron fist, and all the Warriors you need to enforce said rule.  You'll still have to add a doctor-type noble with [RESPONSIBILITY:HEALTH_MANAGEMENT] or you won't have a Health 'z' screen.  For Dungeon Masters behavior, use [RESPONSIBILITY:TAME_EXOTICS].

Chances are, this warlord would always be busy doing something.  Question remains if you'll get a replacement Warlord when yours dies (if there is an heir present at the settlement you're playing, you may end up with a child in charge!).  This is rather uncharted territory, so if you decide to do it, let us know the results.  For SCIENCE!

I tried this, and everything works fine except for the military. When I try to create a squad on the military screen, the game locks up. I've been trying to tinker with the raws, to see if that helps at all. I removed the [RESPONSIBILITY:Military Strategy] and the Menial Work exemption from the Warlord, and that doesn't help at all.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Does anybody know what could be causing this or how to fix it?
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SethCreiyd

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Re: Nobles when playing as a non dwarven Civ?
« Reply #7 on: May 06, 2010, 12:02:44 am »

Hmm.  I remember there being some issue with the 'expedition leader' and 'militia commander' roles not working well together.  Maybe it has something to do with that.  In any case, I have a couple suggestions -- can't guarantee they will work (this is all conjecture), but whether or not they do, we'll learn if they do or not.

  • Add [SQUAD:10:soldier:soldiers] and [RESPONSIBILITY:MILITARY_STRATEGY] to the Warlord, making him involved in the actual military with the ability to maintain squads.  As mentioned above, this might not work properly.
  • Remove [RESPONSIBILITY:MILITARY_STRATEGY] from the Warriors.  In unmodded DF only positions with [NUMBER:1] have it.  I would also suggest taking off [RESPONSIBILITY:ATTACK_ENEMIES] and [RESPONSIBILITY:PATROL_TERRITORY], too (does anyone know what these actually do?  They're on the Warrior and the Ranger positions but they're not on any of those of the dwarves).
  • Add [MILITARY_SCREEN_ONLY] to the Warriors.

Basically making the human military setup like the dwarves'.  Sorry I can't offer more help than hypotheses, but I'm typing you through what I'd try doing myself to troubleshoot it, so...  :D

If none of this works, remove [COMMANDER:WARRIOR:ALL], [SQUAD:10:soldier:soldiers] and [RESPONSIBILITY:MILITARY_STRATEGY] from the Warlord and try making a new position for 'militia commander' type duty, a warrior of warriors.  Give this new position these tags and make them appointed by the Warlord.  The 'leader' type nobles may just be incompatible with military duty, and that would be a slight shame.

Also, any problems with your Chief Doctor?   Are you able to appoint one without [APPOINTED_BY:WARLORD]?

edit: for cleanliness
« Last Edit: May 06, 2010, 12:10:50 am by SethCreiyd »
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