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[Blargityblarg]

I think we have one perpetual motion device; It's called the Universe

[Pathos]

I think we have one perpetual motion device; It's called the Universe

What? That doesn't work!

We DO have one, though. He's called Superman and he's real.

Also, Dwarf Fortress pump systems.

[Pillow_Killer]

I think we have one perpetual motion device; It's called the Universe

Hahahahahahah what.

[Pathos]

I think we have one perpetual motion device; It's called the Universe

Hahahahahahah what.

Then again, his theory is just as good as Zombie's. As is mine.

[DJ]

I already stated my fusion/fission comment was a misinterpreted bit of sarcasm brought on by the mention of fusion as a hyper-efficient form of power. Fusion seems to only prevail in that hydrogen is far more abundant than various radioactive isotopes. As it is, we can't even fuse things properly

Never heard of the H-bomb?

[kuro_suna]

I feel that photovoltaics do have a lot of potential since their durable solid state devices with no moving parts or complex equipment. Unlike most other energy solutions they don't really need dedicated power generating stations, you can just glue some panels to roofs or the sides of buildings. If you could lower their manufacturing costs a bit most city's could probably generate half their energy needs without having to do anything except allow people to sell excess power back to the grid.

[Pwnzerfaust]

I think we have one perpetual motion device; It's called the Universe

Not really, no. Eventually everything will run out of potential energy and nothing more will happen. So it's not perpetual.

[Virex]

I think we have one perpetual motion device; It's called the Universe

Not really, no. Eventually everything will run out of potential energy and nothing more will happen. So it's not perpetual.

The universe stops "working" when everything is in equilibrium, or in other words the entropy of the system is maximised. I *think* the system aproaches that sutiation asympoticaly so it never completely runs out. but at some point it'll be so close to equilibrium/maximum entropy that it just doesn't matter anymore.

[sneakey pete]

I never mentioned anything about magical gas creation. I didn't mention anything of the kind, except in jest. I already stated my fusion/fission comment was a misinterpreted bit of sarcasm brought on by the mention of fusion as a hyper-efficient form of power. Fusion seems to only prevail in that hydrogen is far more abundant than various radioactive isotopes. As it is, we can't even fuse things properly and 'cold' fusion seems to be going the way of the flying car. Being doubtful of accepted scientific theory is how we learn new things. If someone didn't think to argue against all black holes functioning as gravitational anomalies that crush everything into an infinitely dense core, then why would we research them? Science is one big discussion where everyone is trying to find out the coolest stuff ever. Previous research and accepted theories make good starting points for advancement.

Perhaps, but one does not go about it with generalized statemetns such as "thermodynamics might be wrong!"

[Lord Dakoth]

Back to the *ahem* discussion...

I was wondering if this method of power would be more efficient if the physical size of the reactor was altered. Thoughts?

[sneakey pete]

Without knowing the exact specifics of what they are actually using for power generation wise, its a little hard to say, however, odds are that yes, it could be. If you increased the area, salt volume, storage size etc by a factor of 10, the odds are things that increase the effeciency of power generation (like a multi stage turbine, or reheat, or whatever) are going to be more cost effective.

However, we're only talking improvements of effeciency of a few %. (eg, 10 times bigger might net 520MW instead of 50MW.)

[G-Flex]

I think we have one perpetual motion device; It's called the Universe

Not really, no. Eventually everything will run out of potential energy and nothing more will happen. So it's not perpetual.

To put it in other words: The Universe is still a closed system. In fact, if you want to get ridiculously technical, it's the only system that's actually 100% closed.

[Pwnzerfaust]

I think we have one perpetual motion device; It's called the Universe

Not really, no. Eventually everything will run out of potential energy and nothing more will happen. So it's not perpetual.

To put it in other words: The Universe is still a closed system. In fact, if you want to get ridiculously technical, it's the only system that's actually 100% closed.

Yeah, I know it's a closed system. But the fact remains that it will eventually run out of potential energy (the ability to do work).

[G-Flex]

That's exactly my point. It's a closed system, therefore entropy in it will necessarily increase, on the whole. Not disagreeing with you at all there.

[Lord Dakoth]

The energy level in the universe stays the same. It's just converted into forms we can't use, like dark energy.

Excuse me for being somewhat of a zealot.