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Author Topic: Reveal...  (Read 1491 times)

Percy

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Reveal...
« on: March 25, 2008, 12:11:00 pm »

I find it is really unfortunate to dig and dig and dig and not find resources. Even when using reveal.exe, there is a lot of digging that goes on to mine ore and things in the dirt.

I find the game much more enjoyable when using reveal, and I think it would be awesome to have some sort of reveal-ish ability native to the game. Maybe a spell or some device you could shoot at an area on the map, and that area would be revealed? (Even for a short time? Even if only on one z-level at a time?)

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Puzzlemaker

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Re: Reveal...
« Reply #1 on: March 25, 2008, 12:36:00 pm »

Just something in general that would say what kinds of ores/gems are most likely here without having to go to the wiki and spend ten minutes looking it up.
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Derakon

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Re: Reveal...
« Reply #2 on: March 25, 2008, 12:58:00 pm »

Geologists have been suggested and would presumably cover this kind of ability without needing to be explicitly magical.
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Percy

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Re: Reveal...
« Reply #3 on: March 25, 2008, 02:35:00 pm »

Geologists! That would be great.
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Kogan Loloklam

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Re: Reveal...
« Reply #4 on: March 26, 2008, 02:54:00 am »

Wouldn't it be a Berkutam, and not a Geologist?

After all, a Geologist would be a human, and they are inferior at digging...

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Jazz

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Re: Reveal...
« Reply #5 on: March 26, 2008, 10:13:00 am »

I suppose some kind of "geologist" profession could work well, so long as it wasn't made overpowered. Having a "geologist" wouldn't magically reveal the entire map. The whole point of a game centered around mining is to go drill your way through the mountain yourself rather than cheating and making a bee-line to all the valuable ores and gems.

If this were to be implemented, there should be a Geologist's Lab where a rock sample would be taken for testing. Depending on the level of the Geologist's skill would determine how large of a section of is revealed.

Of course you'd need rock collection designations before this idea could be implemented..

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Othob Rithol

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Re: Reveal...
« Reply #6 on: March 26, 2008, 08:40:00 pm »

Against. Once you know the stone layers well enough, you know roughly what to expect. Until then, there is the wiki.

A real life or in game geologist wouldn't be able to tell you anything more complex than "it's blank kind of rock, so we can expect to find some blank,blank, and maybe blank." All of that can be found out in the wiki.

Anything more specific like "There is a gold vein due north of here" clearly falls under magic, and would be a logical, useful, and welcome addition in that arc.

Draco18s

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Re: Reveal...
« Reply #7 on: March 27, 2008, 11:13:00 am »

quote:
Originally posted by Othob Rithol:
<STRONG>Anything more specific like "There is a gold vein due north of here" clearly falls under magic, and would be a logical, useful, and welcome addition in that arc.</STRONG>

Reminds me of Knotts berry farm where the miners missed a vein of gold by less than 2 feet and ran parallel to it for over 50 before giving up.

And then there's their 5 million dollar pile of silver ore, which'd cost 7 million to refine.

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tp12

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Re: Reveal...
« Reply #8 on: March 29, 2008, 09:49:00 am »

Why not have expert and legendary miners show a little further into the mountain?
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penguinofhonor

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Re: Reveal...
« Reply #9 on: March 29, 2008, 10:23:00 am »

.
« Last Edit: October 26, 2015, 07:17:07 pm by penguinofhonor »
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Hyperturtle

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Re: Reveal...
« Reply #10 on: March 29, 2008, 01:26:00 pm »

Magnets will stick to magnetite, so I don't see why we can't have a small magnet that the miners can use to detect if it's worth digging north or south, and have an accouncement made that Metalic Ore possibly detected! and then zoom to the area like if you found a gem.  That could be before you broke through the granite for example.

of course, in real life, a pocket magnet isn't going to detect much through a walk wall, but a compass might if there was a lot of magnetic ore.

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Hague

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Re: Reveal...
« Reply #11 on: March 29, 2008, 01:49:00 pm »

Well, I can see creatures using dousing or divining as a technique for finding materials.

I'd wager that when magic finally rolls around you'll see a modular system that develops spell and magical effects via research. Divination could be a class of magic that allows for dousing. Say you have a diviner (racial specific name, if you'd prefer) They could research in their library (theological or thaumaturgical) a Detect <stonetype> spell. This would give that dwarf the relative ability to detect that particular mineral within a certain distance of where you designate them to cast it. If the spell works successfully, all tiles that contain that mineral within range are revealed.

This could be used in another way as well. Say you have a rock layer that consists primarily of gneiss. You research a detect gneiss spell that reveals all gneiss tiles within range. Therefore you can locate undiscovered stone-types that aren't gneiss.

Obviously, there should be some cost for using the spell. The simplest way would be to do an endurance check to resist some minor damage or simply increase the Thirst, Hunger, and Exhaustion values of the caster. The more potent the spell, the more it drains your caster. Research and cast a spell that's beyond your caster's abilities and you might find that it drained them to death by starvation, thirst, or exhaustion.

You could expand this further by making any number of spells that simply edit small variables in the game:

* Alteration/Transmutation spells that alter material properties like weight, mass, boiling point, and so on. (Transmute Oak into Ebony, Transmute Lead into Gold, Flesh into Stone, Weightlessness, Evaporate Granite, etc.)

* Evocation spells that create raw matter/energy temporarily (Not just fireballs. Imagine being able to cast a force wall to block off HIDDEN FUN STUFF or summon walls of natural obsidian.) An invoker could invoke ice storms, change weather patterns, throw fireballs, and all that traditional magic jazz.

* Conjuration/Dimensional to summon allies, food supplies, create portals between key locations and so on. The key factors being the MODVALUE and SIZE ratings of whatever is summoned. Higher valued things are more difficult to summon and so on. Longer distance teleportation sustains more energy loss and so on.

* Necromancy for dealing with life/death/undeath. Resurrection, Healing, Animate Dead and manipulating organic materials and so on. Obviously, the deciding factor here is what creature is affected. The more specific the effect, the less energy it uses to cast. Making a zombie dragon is significantly harder than making a zombie cardinal. Reviving a dwarf is harder than reviving a kitten and so on. Critical failures could result in injuries, hostile undead or destruction of a corpse.

* Abjuration magic could create wards to forbid particular things ie. Cat Ward, Goblin Ward, Block Ward, Magic Ward, Arrow Ward, Blood ward, Giant Cave Spider Ward, and so on. Wards could be placed much like furniture and shields could be cast directly on dwarves to protect them from contact with hazards.

* Illusions could be made to perform specific functions. You can make illusory furniture or terrain that give dwarves happy thoughts or fool AI pathfinding (perhaps a [TRUESIGHT] token that allows creatures to ignore illusions like they ignore traps) The quality of the illusionary object is determined by the caster's Illusion skill. The created illusions have no substance and don't contribute to fortress value but will still be admired by citizens.

Artifacts could be tied to a specific spell to channel the energy more efficiently and expand a spell's effect. Take divination for example. You could build an artifact statue that could be linked to a divination spell that detects gold. Whenever the detect gold spell is cast by any allied spellcaster it would greatly expand the range/success rate/overall effect of a spell. Alternately, it could also reduce costs associated with a spell. You could have an artifact sulphur chest that reduces the drain on fireball or acid rain spells. Once an artifact is linked to a researched spell it cannot be unlinked. So choose wisely.

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Kaelem Gaen

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Re: Reveal...
« Reply #12 on: March 30, 2008, 04:50:00 pm »

To be honest, I'm not a big fan of the "Use X, to find Y,Z,A,B,C." Part of the game is exploration.  (Granted you don't have to use said option if you don't want to if you make it a profession or a spell.) But it might make it a bit to easy.

Capntastic

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Re: Reveal...
« Reply #13 on: March 30, 2008, 05:05:00 pm »

quote:
Originally posted by Hyperturtle:
<STRONG>Magnets will stick to magnetite, so I don't see why we can't have a small magnet that the miners can use to detect if it's worth digging north or south, and have an accouncement made that Metalic Ore possibly detected! and then zoom to the area like if you found a gem.</STRONG>

A small magnet wouldn't be able to help you find magnetite ore several meters through solid rock.  At that distance, a miner's pick would be more attractive to it.

All in all, the mining and exploration of your terrain is one of the key aspects of this game, and making it simple to know where the good materials are would be counter to fun.

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jonnym

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Re: Reveal...
« Reply #14 on: March 31, 2008, 09:22:00 am »

your geologists have found microline!


this is why i prefer to build wooden towers.....

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