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[Chrissi]

My dwarves have a nasty habit of falling into water/magma when fighting off creatures and being unable to get out and drowning.

They don't do it normally, they just fall a lot when they are fighting.  On one map, a couple trogdolytes pushed two entire 10-dwarf squads into the magma that they were fighting near.  On my current map, my first kobold thief drowned my 2-dwarf squad in the pools on the surface.

Why do they fall in SO MUCH?  It didn't bother me so much with the magma and the trogdolytes, but on my new map I've finally gotten the hang of squads and my fighters were legendary before they "fell".  And how do I prevent it, short of walling off said pits of liquid?  It's the worst bummer when you know you have an awesome army and they aren't able to fight because they just keep drowning themselves.

Is it a bug? Is it new? Should I report it? Or deal with it?   

Hey could I use burrows for this? Or will they just chase after the enemy no matter what burrow it's in?

[marcbyrne]

I don't know if its a bug.  I think they are just dodging or being hit and flying in unfortunate directions.

As far as water pools are concerned, go around to each a channel a square out by then.  It will create a ramp which may help them escape. (some swimming skill on top of that wouldn't hurt either)

Concerning magma pools....um, my only advice there is to not fight next to them.  Seems like just about the most dangerous location possible for a fight.

[Chrissi]

Well it's hard to tell them not to fight near the magma when they're fighting off underground invaders next to magma to try to stop them from coming up into the rest of the fortress.

The ramps will probably help a little for the surface pools, thanks.  But I still get the feeling that falling into pools shouldn't be the massive killer that it is.  I've rarely had a dwarf die from anything OTHER than falling into pools of liquid.  I've had at least 30 die from it. :/ You can't really control where invaders come from and where they hang out.

[PencilinHand]

Well it's hard to tell them not to fight near the magma when they're fighting off underground invaders next to magma to try to stop them from coming up into the rest of the fortress.

The ramps will probably help a little for the surface pools, thanks.  But I still get the feeling that falling into pools shouldn't be the massive killer that it is.  I've rarely had a dwarf die from anything OTHER than falling into pools of liquid.  I've had at least 30 die from it. :/ You can't really control where invaders come from and where they hang out.

If the terrain is dangerous then change the terrain.  Either by not fighting where your dwarfs are likely to fall to their squishy doom or by shaping the terrain to satisfy your sense of dwarf preservation...(I have the strangest feeling that those last two words were never meant to be put together in a serious sentence)....

Effective use of walls, fortifications, channeling, flooring, digging and magma can solve all your problems.

[amade]

Basically what everyone is saying is the oft repeated "Choose your battleground wisely".

It does seem rather silly to force your dwarfs to hold off the enemy at a site where you are at a severe disadvantage.

[Hydra]

If the terrain is dangerous then change the terrain.

Or maybe it's just a bug that should be fixed? Dwarves might be stupid but I cannot imagine Urist McSwordmaster to go "Hah! Just dodged your attack fiend! Say, why are me feet meltin'?" on every troglodyte he meets.

Besides: lava flows should be an integral part of any fortress

[amade]

Or maybe it's just a bug that should be fixed? Dwarves might be stupid but I cannot imagine Urist McSwordmaster to go "Hah! Just dodged your attack fiend! Say, why are me feet meltin'?" on every troglodyte he meets.

It's either get slaughtered or dodge the attack I suppose. Not his fault Urist McCommander had sent him to fight troggos at the edge of a boiling lava pool.

[random51]

Why assume it was because of dodging when it could have been a simple push? If you fight around open water/magma, you deserve what you get.

[gtmattz]

In a fight things happen fast, I am sure that the dwarves would avoid jumping into the magma if they were paying attention to that, but instead they are focused on the fight and occasionally will dodge the wrong direction.  This is nothing new, it has been in every version of DF I have played actually.  This is actually one of the main causes of dwarves dying to carp, in that they dodge into the water with the cap and proceed to drown.  The best resolution is to choose your battlefield carefully.  If you have a troglodyte infestation, station your dwarves at a choke-point access to your fort proper and let the troglodytes come to them for example.

[Richard]

not a bug but a feature.

Would df really be as fun if the dwarfs did exactly what you wanted without buggering it up.  I had an embark skill maxed axedwarf trip and fall in the water while fighting something during a deep-dwarf attempt.  I thought it was all over until a simple woodcutter stepped in and became a hero.

[Chrissi]

Why assume it was because of dodging when it could have been a simple push? If you fight around open water/magma, you deserve what you get.

So my dwarves should back it up and fight in the stockpiles? I don't get it.  Sure, it's safer in terms of falling into magma, but there are civilians around...

Like I said, I've rarely had a dwarf die from anything OTHER than that.  It's either fight near magma or fight inside the fort.  It's either fight near water or fight in the farm fields.  I don't really get this "move your battle" thing.  How easy is it to control where the enemy comes from?

If it's just a part of battle, why do my enemies never fall into the magma? It's always the dwarves that can't control their feet.. 

[Deathworks]

Hi!

As for the logic of the high falling rate of your dwarves - it is either dwarves (civilized) vs. animalistic enemies or dwarves (earth bound) against magical/demonics. In either case, if you think about it, it makes sense that the dwarves are less agile/lucky.

As for the place the battle occurs - it is a problem of fortress design. It seems that you made your important stockpiles too close to the magma from what you are describing.

Dig new stockpiles far away from any danger and move as much as possible there. Unless there is a very good reason (like heavy material for magma forges), you should not store anything next to such a dangerous environment.

You can also dig out new, twisted tunnels and construct walls to shut off the old tunnels to add distance between the danger and your dwarves, but you can't be sure that there is not some nasty that can break the constructions.

In general, you should always try to place as much activity by civilians as possible into the safe core of your fortress so that emergencies do not interfere unnecessarily with your fortress. And given the high number of z-levels at your disposal, that is not a very difficult design task - so I recommend that you look again at your fortress and check where the safest areas are and what you wish to move there (food production/storage and health care would be high on my list).

Deathworks

[amade]

Why assume it was because of dodging when it could have been a simple push? If you fight around open water/magma, you deserve what you get.

So my dwarves should back it up and fight in the stockpiles? I don't get it.  Sure, it's safer in terms of falling into magma, but there are civilians around...

Like I said, I've rarely had a dwarf die from anything OTHER than that.  It's either fight near magma or fight inside the fort.  It's either fight near water or fight in the farm fields.  I don't really get this "move your battle" thing.  How easy is it to control where the enemy comes from?

Sounds like you've got bad foresight/planning like Deathworks pointed out. It really is easy to control where the enemy comes from, and use it to your advantage. In real life you'd not want to fight near a lava pool either, it's a major hazard for god's sake! You might slip, get pushed or simply took a wrong step. It happens to enemies too, I've seen it happen several times before in my fortresses when they're wrestling with my troops on ramparts.

[Nexii Malthus]

Get hammerdwarfs and watch enemies go flying, preferably directly into said magma pool.

[Chrissi]

No, I don't really have any control over it, because, for example, I just had some raccoons start bothering my dwarves near the entrance.  There isn't water around my entrance, I have it fenced off.  So I tell my army to kill the raccoons, and they chase the raccoons to the pool where they slip and drown.  The raccoons run away.  BUT THEY NEVER DROWN.

My stockpiles are not near the magma, they are on a separate layer.... I don't think you get the picture. I designed my fort just fine but if I were to "back it up"... well there is no space to back it up.  Regardless of where the fight starts, my dwarves will go wherever the enemy goes.  The enemy goes back near the magma or the pools.  Even if I cancel their kill order when they run near the magma or pool, they keep attacking and ultimately drown.

It's the most irritating thing when you've got strong dwarves but simply going near water kills them because they totally ignore the fact that there's any water there.  I don't even think they're usually getting pushed in.  It really seems like they IGNORE the fact that there is water or magma once they are fighting.