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[Andir]

I just lost a fortress of 72 to 12 goblins... of course, I didn't have any military planning or trained, so they all went gung-ho wrestlers on the goblins, and I lost every single one.  It didn't help that I have two invasions at once, but I had a caravan at my depot so I burrowed my dwarfs inside the gate and waited.  The goblins took out all the trader guards and proceeded to wipe the floor with me.

[thvaz]

They made the same to me, but then I let the SPOILER have fun with them. If you have to go, go with style.

[monk12]

A squad of crossbows and lashers mopped the floor with my fledgeling military last game, including an immigrated Mace Lord equipped with iron armor and maces. Although they had several strategic benefits (half the military distracted by a babysnatcher running the wrong direction, for one thing), its still not a loss I would have suffered in 40d. So yeah, I'd say they're tougher.

[Sensei]

It's a lot harder to recruit dwarves that are close to the attack. The new damage system plays a huge roll as well.

[Nagassh]

Certainly seem harder, but the same could be said for dwarves.

I had a siege of well over 60 goblins attack. 1 axe lord who wanted to fill his flask in full iron armour kept a great deal of bowmen and crossbowmen (well, gobs) and a master swords goblin stuck in combat unable to kill him until they had ran out of ammo and the rest of the siege caught up. He only died after suffering full red wounds, having both eyes shot out, both ears shot off, his lower legs cut off and most of his fingers removed. He'd also just punched a forgotten beast spider hard enough to kill it while pathfinding to an axe.

Also had an axe lord take on 12 hammer goblins and only suffer a broken toe.

Armour plays a much larger role in the new release but tbh, the combat system seems a bit buggy at the moment.

[opsneakie]

Combat is fine imo. The issue is that it's now much harder to go 'gung-ho wrestlers' as you say. Armor and weapons, and training especially can make a huge difference as to how the combats play out. If you have a trained, armed, and armored force, you can basically bottleneck an incredible, if not infinite, number of goblins at your fortress gates and paint the place with their blood.

This is from my experience with nothing better than iron armor and a few steel weapons. Goblins and trolls have been little to no threat once I'm armed, and almost nonexistent threat once I'm armored.

[rdwulfe]

I still find their groups of bowgobs to be deadly. Firing steel or silver arrows at my guys, I've had a partially trained squad cut down in seconds by a group of gobs with bows, backed up by maces. Just slaughtered them.

I'd say the new system favors the prepared. IF your ready for an attack, you can probably handle it. If you're not ready for it.... Well, you had Fun, right?

   Wulfe

[Enzo]

I had a siege of well over 60 goblins attack. 1 axe lord who wanted to fill his flask in full iron armour kept a great deal of bowmen and crossbowmen (well, gobs) and a master swords goblin stuck in combat unable to kill him until they had ran out of ammo and the rest of the siege caught up. He only died after suffering full red wounds, having both eyes shot out, both ears shot off, his lower legs cut off and most of his fingers removed. He'd also just punched a forgotten beast spider hard enough to kill it while pathfinding to an axe.

That dwarf had better have a heroes tomb.

[Murphy]

It's not goblins that are harder, it's dwarves who are softer now; you're no longer able to turn a dwarf into a superdwarf via some simple training.

[Thief^]

Two goblins got into my fort, shortly after an encounter between five goblins and my militia got them all bedridden.
After some unsuccessful attacks by random civilians (miners and woodcutters mostly, as they were already armed), I built some cage traps in the area they were running around in and caught them both.

There are now 10 caged goblins outside.

Idea: sentients should really let allies out of cages. It would make the traps much less uber-win.

[Andir]

Well, you had Fun, right?

It was fun right up to the point where the game crashed when my last dwarf died and I faced the prospect of having to re-do all the careful planning I had gone through since my last yearly save.  I guess I should put it back to seasonal...

The sad part is that it was quite a fortress layout I was working out and there was a nice long singular entranceway that could easily have been a marksdwarf haven if I had prepared (and been able to get them to train.)

[Jake]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't marksdwarves still fire their weapons in combat even though archery targets are currently iffy? Stationing a squad behind fortifications and letting them take potshots until they hit something is as good a way of practicing as any.

I think the increased complexity of building a successful military is a more than reasonable trade-off for the extra versatility and control, but it does take a greater -and more realistic- period of time before you can handle more than the odd thief or snatcher. Your best bet is to have everyone leg it inside, lock the gates and wait for them to go away until you have enough pairs of hands to spare the time for proper training. The trigger for sieges and ambushes could probably do with raising a bit, mind you.

[dreiche2]

Idea: sentients should really let allies out of cages. It would make the traps much less uber-win.

That is actually an interesting suggestion. Maybe put it up on the suggestions forum?

[Raz]

I think cages in general will be handled once Toady gets around to defining the dimensions a bit more.

[thvaz]

Finally got a proper military in this new version. I'm holding well ambushes against twice my numbers with only one casualty so far, and few wounds per fight.