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[Mikehpoo]

Not sure if this is the right place to ask really, but is there a way to mod water into an already existing fortress? Dwarves dropping left and right from injuries because I have no water supply is kinda demoralising. On the latest version btw.

Thanks in advance.

[Upright Path]

Modding? No. Hacking, maybe.

If you -really- need a drink. You could always change one of the custom reactions to something like....


[REACTION:MAKE_PLASTER_POWDER]
[NAME:provide some brews!]
[REAGENT:A:1:BARREL:NONE:NONE:NONE]
[PRODUCT:100:20:DRINK:NONE:PLANT_MAT:MUSHROOM_HELMET_PLUMP:DRINK]
[SKILL:BREWING]

[Mikehpoo]

Modding? No. Hacking, maybe.

If you -really- need a drink. You could always change one of the custom reactions to something like....


[REACTION:MAKE_PLASTER_POWDER]
[NAME:provide some brews!]
[REAGENT:A:1:BARREL:NONE:NONE:NONE]
[PRODUCT:100:20:DRINK:NONE:PLANT_MAT:MUSHROOM_HELMET_PLUMP:DRINK]
[SKILL:BREWING]

And that'd work in the place of water? also just so I know, whats the difference between modding and hacking?

[Hugo_The_Dwarf]

Hacking is by way of forcing something to happen right then and there, say you dig a pit in basalt, then you hack it to turn the basalt floor and walls of the pit into sand, then you hack the sand walls to be aqua-fiers thus giving you a unlimited source of water while leaveing the game elemets unchanged

Modding is where you alter the game elemets to suit your needs. Say you don't like that rocks melt at room temp. (just an example) so you alter them in the raws (the meat and potatos) to melt only in lava

long story short

Hacking involves forcing current elements into exsitance like the decription above, or forcing life-points to always be at 9999

Modding changes or adds new elements such as making every dwarf breath fire, or have 25 to 100 kids at once (not recommended due to FPS killing)
 
If anyone can correct me please due because this is my view of hacking vs. modding
 
NOTE: Darius's program Spellcraft for the 40d# versions (mainly 40d16) allowed you to use spells (runes engraved into objects) that would create water/magma make people happy/sad, full/hungry and so on by hacking the game. The program looked for items encrusted with his 'runes' then applied or forced game elements to appear or happen at these encrusted objects

EDIT: @ Upright Path
Patients don't drink booze they need water that is given by bucket. He would need a reaction that needs a bucket with [PRESERVE_REGENT] and the product going into the bucket which would be water this:
modding this in (note it will not work I have limited Exp with new reactions its just an example)
[REACTION:MAKE_PLASTER_POWDER]
[NAME:put water in bucket]
[REAGENT:A:1:BUCKET:NONE:NONE:NONE][PRESERVE_REAGENT]
[PRODUCT:100:3:LIQUID:NONE:?:WATER:LIQUID]
[SKILL:BREWING]
 
but yes Upright Path your orginal reaction would work
[REACTION:MAKE_PLASTER_POWDER]
[NAME:provide some brews!]
[REAGENT:A:1:BARREL:NONE:NONE:NONE]
[PRODUCT:100:20:DRINK:NONE:PLANT_MAT:MUSHROOM_HELMET_PLUMP:DRINK]
[SKILL:BREWING]
 
but not for his need (unless this new version allows booze instead of just water)
 
EDIT#2: this is hope works

[REACTION:MAKE_PLASTER_POWDER]
[NAME:put water in bucket]
[REAGENT:A:1:BUCKET:NONE:NONE:NONE][EMPTY][CAN_USE_ARTIFACT][PRESERVE_REAGENT]
[PRODUCT:100:3:LIQUID:NONE:WATER:LIQUID][PRODUCT_TO_CONTAINER:A]
[SKILL:BREWING]
 
This should work for you if not then I need to do more research

[Mikehpoo]

Hacking is by way of forcing something to happen right then and there, say you dig a pit in basalt, then you hack it to turn the basalt floor and walls of the pit into sand, then you hack the sand walls to be aqua-fiers thus giving you a unlimited source of water while leaveing the game elemets unchanged

Modding is where you alter the game elemets to suit your needs. Say you don't like that rocks melt at room temp. (just an example) so you alter them in the raws (the meat and potatos) to melt only in lava

long story short

Hacking involves forcing current elements into exsitance like the decription above, or forcing life-points to always be at 9999

Modding changes or adds new elements such as making every dwarf breath fire, or have 25 to 100 kids at once (not recommended due to FPS killing)
 
If anyone can correct me please due because this is my view of hacking vs. modding
 
NOTE: Darius's program Spellcraft for the 40d# versions (mainly 40d16) allowed you to use spells (runes engraved into objects) that would create water/magma make people happy/sad, full/hungry and so on by hacking the game. The program looked for items encrusted with his 'runes' then applied or forced game elements to appear or happen at these encrusted objects

EDIT: @ Upright Path
Patients don't drink booze they need water that is given by bucket. He would need a reaction that needs a bucket with [PRESERVE_REGENT] and the product going into the bucket which would be water this:
modding this in (note it will not work I have limited Exp with new reactions its just an example)
[REACTION:MAKE_PLASTER_POWDER]
[NAME:put water in bucket]
[REAGENT:A:1:BUCKET:NONE:NONE:NONE][PRESERVE_REAGENT]
[PRODUCT:100:3:LIQUID:NONE:?:WATER:LIQUID]
[SKILL:BREWING]
 
but yes Upright Path your orginal reaction would work
[REACTION:MAKE_PLASTER_POWDER]
[NAME:provide some brews!]
[REAGENT:A:1:BARREL:NONE:NONE:NONE]
[PRODUCT:100:20:DRINK:NONE:PLANT_MAT:MUSHROOM_HELMET_PLUMP:DRINK]
[SKILL:BREWING]
 
but not for his need (unless this new version allows booze instead of just water)

Thanks for the detailed explanation, I guess I am looking for more a hack than anything else. I'd just like to be able to spawn water somehow.

[Hugo_The_Dwarf]

EDIT#2: this is hope works

[REACTION:MAKE_PLASTER_POWDER]
[NAME:put water in bucket]
[REAGENT:A:1:BUCKET:NONE:NONE:NONE][EMPTY][CAN_USE_ARTIFACT][PRESERVE_REAGENT]
[PRODUCT:100:3:LIQUID:NONE:WATER:LIQUID][PRODUCT_TO_CONTAINER:A]
[SKILL:BREWING]
 
This should work for you if not then I need to do more research

Modding is in a way like hacking, cheating the reason why we are altering Plaster making is cause that reaction is already in the world-gen, and we are modifing this reaction to produce water, now if you tinker with my above reaction which should work you will get water for your people, there are several more talented modders that can help you with this too, and atm there are no hacking untilites out yet for the new version, onless you go pro and use a memory editor or hex editor (like t-search) to change a amount (or if your good enough use the hacking decripion of changing soild ground)

EDIT:

Code: [Select]

[REACTION:MAKE_WATER]
    [NAME:fill bucket with water]
    [BUILDING:SOAP_MAKER:CUSTOM_SHIFT_M]
    [REAGENT:A:1:BUCKET:NONE:NONE:NONE][EMPTY][PRESERVE_REAGENT]
    [PRODUCT:100:1:GLOB:NONE:WATER:NONE][PRODUCT_TO_CONTAINER:A]
    [SKILL:BREWING]

[i2amroy]

Just a note, at this point you no longer need to modify an existing reaction in DF 2010 in order to add a new one, but instead can just add the new one. Just make sure that you add the reaction to the dwarven entity as well.

[Hugo_The_Dwarf]

Just a note, at this point you no longer need to modify an existing reaction in DF 2010 in order to add a new one, but instead can just add the new one. Just make sure that you add the reaction to the dwarven entity as well.

ahh that makes everything easier, so no more world gens? just add the new reaction in and add in the respective lines into the dwarf entity file?

[ArPharazon]

Posting because I'm a pedantic jerk.

I think modding is when you basically make an different game. When you mod in a feature something, you intend to always have that. Hacking is when you fiddle with the game just to make it work in that instance.

Assuming you will later change the reactions back to normal, you are not modding because now that you know better, you won't embark in waterless areas unless you want a challenge, and you will not make waterless areas impossible in case you DO at some point want a challenge. You would also be hacking it if you used a program (currently there are none I think) to create a block of water somewhere.

If you intend to keep playing with this reaction afterwards, even if you settle in non waterless areas (perhaps so you don't need to go outside for water) then I'd say that's a mod.

Technically though, most of the mods are hacks in the sense that they use existing infrastructure (raws) intended for a specific purpose (adding different new races, monsters, etc.) to make the program (dorffort) behave in an unintended or unexpected manner (Toady did not implement a solution to the stone problem, and probably did not intend raw modding to provide it, but meltable stone mods and the like do exactly that)

[Mikehpoo]

Code: [Select]

[REACTION:MAKE_WATER]
    [NAME:fill bucket with water]
    [BUILDING:SOAP_MAKER:CUSTOM_SHIFT_M]
    [REAGENT:A:1:BUCKET:NONE:NONE:NONE][EMPTY][PRESERVE_REAGENT]
    [PRODUCT:100:1:GLOB:NONE:WATER:NONE][PRODUCT_TO_CONTAINER:A]
    [SKILL:BREWING]

So I'm using this reaction, I copy pasted it into reaction_other.txt inside the raw folder saved and booted up DF. Created a Soap worlshop but when I try to give it the task the add new task option takes me to a blank page and there is nothing to select?

Edit: manager won't assign the task either, doesn't exist.

[Sorcerer]

Pedantics assemble!
Actually, the difference between a hack and a mod is as follows, a mod changes the available game files to produce a desired effect. The game would still operate within the standard rules, you just changed the rules a bit.
Whereas hacking involves changing stuff the game generally WONT let you do within the framework of the rules, and is usually slightly more advanced.. Say for instance using a memory editing tool to turn a piece of stone into fertile soil or magma or what have you.

TL;DR
Modding modifies the rules, hacking hacks them to pieces with an *Adamantium War Axe*

[Redgaia]

So I'm using this reaction, I copy pasted it into reaction_other.txt inside the raw folder saved and booted up DF. Created a Soap worlshop but when I try to give it the task the add new task option takes me to a blank page and there is nothing to select?

Edit: manager won't assign the task either, doesn't exist.

This is because you now need to add the reaction to the [ENTITY:MOUNTAIN] entry of your entities file, in order for dwarves to recognise that the reaction exists. I'm not a big time modder, but I think that might be your problem.

[Master]

Code: [Select]

[REACTION:MAKE_WATER]
    [NAME:fill bucket with water]
    [BUILDING:SOAP_MAKER:CUSTOM_SHIFT_M]
    [REAGENT:A:1:BUCKET:NONE:NONE:NONE][EMPTY][PRESERVE_REAGENT]
    [PRODUCT:100:1:GLOB:NONE:WATER:NONE][PRODUCT_TO_CONTAINER:A]
    [SKILL:BREWING]

So I'm using this reaction, I copy pasted it into reaction_other.txt inside the raw folder saved and booted up DF. Created a Soap worlshop but when I try to give it the task the add new task option takes me to a blank page and there is nothing to select?

Edit: manager won't assign the task either, doesn't exist.

I think you need to add the reaction to the dwarf race in the entity file so that they are allowed to use that reaction.

[Phoebus]

Talking about adding reactions and buildings to [ENTITY:MOUNTAIN].
I can't make the changes stick would generating a new world, only changes to already existing reactions and buildings ever work without regening.

[Mikehpoo]

Talking about adding reactions and buildings to [ENTITY:MOUNTAIN].
I can't make the changes stick would generating a new world, only changes to already existing reactions and buildings ever work without regening.

So if I make a new reaction I have to regen my world? Also, what exactly do I add to the entity file to make it work?

Edit: Would it be [PERMITTED_REACTION:MAKE_WATER] ?