Bay 12 Games Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  
Pages: 1 ... 131 132 [133] 134 135 ... 357

Author Topic: 0.31. MODDERS WORKSHOP (NEWCOMERS WELCOME!)  (Read 427206 times)

Jordan~

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: 0.31. MODDERS WORKSHOP (NEWCOMERS WELCOME!)
« Reply #1980 on: February 18, 2011, 02:07:21 pm »

Okay, most of that seems to work. The castes are fixed, and they're now dropping 2 steel horns when butchered, but still no claws. The horns only weight 22 Urists, which seems pretty light for steel - 14 units of the wool weigh 238 Urists (17 each) so again, I'm not convinced that's actually steel. If I change [TISSUE_MATERIAL:LOCAL_CREATURE_MAT:HORN] to [TISSUE_MATERIAL:INORGANIC:STEEL], Skaparn 1 will drop a stack of 1 Skaparn 1's steel, weighing 21 Urists, instead of a stack of 2 Skaparn 1's steel horn (which weighs 22). plus I can't really tell if woolen garments made of the wool are actually offering protection beyond what a normal wool garment offers. Here are the relevant raws again:

Spoiler: Creature Raws (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: Material Template Raws (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: Tissue Template Raws (click to show/hide)
Logged

3

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: 0.31. MODDERS WORKSHOP (NEWCOMERS WELCOME!)
« Reply #1981 on: February 18, 2011, 02:09:39 pm »

Does an animal lay eggs regardless of the opposite gender being present? Do these eggs have to be fertilized by a member of the opposite gender? I'm wondering if eggs can allow you to make a monogendered species still capable of reproduction, which as far as i know is impossible at the moment.

Yes, yes, no.
Logged

silverskull39

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: 0.31. MODDERS WORKSHOP (NEWCOMERS WELCOME!)
« Reply #1982 on: February 18, 2011, 09:46:55 pm »

I'm doing some modding in the new version to (among other things) make my dwarves have faeries as a hive type thing, and make them dip their weapons in blood. before they can dip their weapons in blood, however, they need a reliable way to get barrels of blood besides from caravans. Would the following reaction work to have blood "pressed" from any form of meat?

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Edit: that didn't work....

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

and that ^ crashed the game when I tried to use it in game...
« Last Edit: February 18, 2011, 10:23:35 pm by silverskull39 »
Logged
Quote
Quote
Quote
Dwarf fortress threads can sound so.... unethical
it would be unethical if this wasn't the bay12 forums
Bay12: A short, sturdy forum fond of !!science!! and derailment.
Quote
Now back to your regularly scheduled thread derailment.

Flaede

  • Bay Watcher
  • Beware the Moon Creatures.
    • View Profile
Re: 0.31. MODDERS WORKSHOP (NEWCOMERS WELCOME!)
« Reply #1983 on: February 20, 2011, 03:37:05 am »

Can anyone point me to anywhere someone's toyed around with milk products? I'm sure it's been done, but I can't find it. The wiki doesn't even recognise a search for LIQUID_MISC_CREATURE and suchlike.

One reason is shellac from lac bugs for candy... and possibly item glazing if I ever get what people have been talking about with this.
The other reason is I want to mod in skeksis and pod people and gelflings... who can have their "essence" extracted*. Mua. Ha. Ha. (it is to learn, before going on to bigger and better things)

But I don't want "essence cheese". I'd like it to be the elusive ALCOHOL_CREATURE.

« Last Edit: February 20, 2011, 03:53:01 am by Flaede »
Logged
Toady typically doesn't do things by half measures.  As evidenced by turning "make hauling work better" into "implement mine carts with physics".
There are many issues with this statement.
[/quote]

3

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: 0.31. MODDERS WORKSHOP (NEWCOMERS WELCOME!)
« Reply #1984 on: February 20, 2011, 04:19:20 am »

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

You've created a mat template for the creature... so why are you modifying it within the creature? Just change the template. It's not necessary to refer to the "milk" as "MILK" if you don't want to, by the way (identifiers are mostly arbitary values).

As to the template, obvious issues are REACTION_CLASS:MILK and the subsequent line. I'm not sure what you're trying to do with LIQUID_MISC_CREATURE - if I remember correctly that tag enables the item's use in various reactions, most of which won't be appropriate for a mat that's supposed to be solid in the first place (well, solid enough).
« Last Edit: February 20, 2011, 04:23:10 am by 3 »
Logged

Flaede

  • Bay Watcher
  • Beware the Moon Creatures.
    • View Profile
Re: 0.31. MODDERS WORKSHOP (NEWCOMERS WELCOME!)
« Reply #1985 on: February 20, 2011, 04:22:55 am »

I don't understand why REACTION_CLASS:MILK is bad if that is how I want it to be produced. Can only one thing be a MILK reaction class?

I was editing it within the creature because I didn't know how to just leave everything to the mat template. I was copying milk, and it is defined in both places (for the maggot milk, at any rate). The MILK was in caps, and so I didn't know what trouble I'd get into, since I still don't quite know what that particular MILK meant.

Like I said, instead of reinventing the wheel, I'd love to go check somewhere this was all hashed out previously. People seem to know this stuff, so it must be up somewhere, right?
Logged
Toady typically doesn't do things by half measures.  As evidenced by turning "make hauling work better" into "implement mine carts with physics".
There are many issues with this statement.
[/quote]

3

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: 0.31. MODDERS WORKSHOP (NEWCOMERS WELCOME!)
« Reply #1986 on: February 20, 2011, 04:25:03 am »

I don't understand why REACTION_CLASS:MILK is bad if that is how I want it to be produced. Can only one thing be a MILK reaction class?

Oh, I see what you mean. Seems rather counterintuitive to me. Why not just make a new reaction?
Logged

Flaede

  • Bay Watcher
  • Beware the Moon Creatures.
    • View Profile
Re: 0.31. MODDERS WORKSHOP (NEWCOMERS WELCOME!)
« Reply #1987 on: February 20, 2011, 04:45:35 am »

I don't understand why REACTION_CLASS:MILK is bad if that is how I want it to be produced. Can only one thing be a MILK reaction class?

Oh, I see what you mean. Seems rather counterintuitive to me. Why not just make a new reaction?

Because I want to learn how to have things be creature-branded (vial of gelfling-essence, vial of podling-essence, vial of skeksis-essence, clotted-newt-blood glob, clotted-dog-blood glob, clotted-cow-blood glob). Also, I want to have them be dependant on the creature they came from. Also, I want the creature to remain alive, if possible. I'm moving on to the possibilities of "shearing" reactions next. (does it have to make thread? or can we have "clippings" - I call this "Fun With Ents")

I would also like to explore the template mat stuff so that i understand it better for when I create multiple types of blood/venom/tissue/extract/etc (for example: cold blood, WARM blood, literal cold blood that freezes things...) that are NOT defined within the creature.  Some things are not able to be defined for just one caste - even "in caste" it will define things for the entire creature. From what I gather we don't know exactly which tags work this way, and it may be hard to test. After Deon's accident with temperature values making ALL dwarves magma-resistant - I figured that understanding template mat stuff and all its applications seems the key to better more reliable creature caste variation. Esp. with regards to temperature.

Besides, it's "cleaner", in my books. For starters I want to mod in a 12 caste geni civ with radically diffferent properties in the different castes.If I then want to have other creatures with similar "affinities", it's actually easier to have a material template to refer to than re-inputting numbers for all of them each time I tweak things.  Same goes for extracts, and I also want to create a very robust system of extracts and uses for them. Same goes for skintypes. Or bonetypes. None of which I understand how to do quite yet.

EDIT: wow. WoT. Sorry 'bout that.
« Last Edit: February 20, 2011, 04:47:54 am by Flaede »
Logged
Toady typically doesn't do things by half measures.  As evidenced by turning "make hauling work better" into "implement mine carts with physics".
There are many issues with this statement.
[/quote]

3

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: 0.31. MODDERS WORKSHOP (NEWCOMERS WELCOME!)
« Reply #1988 on: February 20, 2011, 05:16:19 am »

Because I want to learn how to have things be creature-branded (vial of gelfling-essence, vial of podling-essence, vial of skeksis-essence, clotted-newt-blood glob, clotted-dog-blood glob, clotted-cow-blood glob).

That's not a case for reaction classes; it's what the GET_MATERIAL_FROM_REAGENT token's for. Whether or not a specific material is attributed to the creature it came from is determined by the PREFIX token (PREFIX:NONE removes said attribution; I don't know what else can be done with it).

I figured that understanding template mat stuff and all its applications seems the key to better more reliable creature caste variation. Esp. with regards to temperature.

I've never had any problems that I can remember with defining temp values for caste-specific materials/tissues. If one does find an issue, there's nothing stopping one from just defining an identical material from the same template and changing that instead.

Besides, it's "cleaner", in my books.

If you're now referring to milk again: Making sure that I get shellac when I actually want edible milk is "clean" in the same way that not being able to specify if I want something made out of rock or wood is "clean", or not being able to specify chests or cabinets, only either.
Logged

Flaede

  • Bay Watcher
  • Beware the Moon Creatures.
    • View Profile
Re: 0.31. MODDERS WORKSHOP (NEWCOMERS WELCOME!)
« Reply #1989 on: February 20, 2011, 06:01:07 am »

Because I want to learn how to have things be creature-branded (vial of gelfling-essence, vial of podling-essence, vial of skeksis-essence, clotted-newt-blood glob, clotted-dog-blood glob, clotted-cow-blood glob).

That's not a case for reaction classes; it's what the GET_MATERIAL_FROM_REAGENT token's for. Whether or not a specific material is attributed to the creature it came from is determined by the PREFIX token (PREFIX:NONE removes said attribution; I don't know what else can be done with it).

Is there a way to use this when there is no reagent, just a live animal being mauled by a handler? I vaguely knew of that token's existence, I need to explore its uses, too. You're right, at least some of what I want to do would be best achieved through this.

I figured that understanding template mat stuff and all its applications seems the key to better more reliable creature caste variation. Esp. with regards to temperature.

I've never had any problems that I can remember with defining temp values for caste-specific materials/tissues. If one does find an issue, there's nothing stopping one from just defining an identical material from the same template and changing that instead.

Alls I know is that Deon told one caste to be magma resistant through a homeotherm tag, and then people were melting when a completely different caste bit them and injected (apparently molten hot) venom. That one was easy to notice. Other foul-ups wouldn't be, and I'd rather not have to second guess things to test. From what I understood, the suggestion in the genesis thread was that things could be kept separate through "annoying" defining of extra mats and using those in the specific caste. Maybe that didn't work, but if it was tried, I missed it.

Besides, it's "cleaner", in my books.

If you're now referring to milk again: Making sure that I get shellac when I actually want edible milk is "clean" in the same way that not being able to specify if I want something made out of rock or wood is "clean", or not being able to specify chests or cabinets, only either.

What? No.  The milk thing was because I want to make shellac out of beetles. Live beetles. The only in game mechanic I've seen do something like this is creating milk from having purring maggots. If there's another way, I've missed it. Can I not have shellac and milk? getting the shellac from milking beetles, and milk from milking maggots? I wasn't suggesting removing the milk template, I wanted to know if the output of milking could be something other than the standard Milk Template.

With the "cleaner" comment I was being more general. I'm was still going on about using the material templates in place of in-creature changes (including milk). That seems more elegant, and less prone to mis-interpretation by the game. I am trying to grasp the ins and out of this, but still don't quite get it. That's more because I don't fully understand how to get them "picked up" and used in things. It's not so much the "what are templates and how do I define one" part, though I know there are still holes in my knowledge there too.

If you have five critters using a material template, isn't that better than inputting the same overriding changes in each of those five creatures' raws? I'm thinking for obvious reasons like it's easier to make sure you've changed all of them when you want to tweak the properties of their explosive livers or whathaveyou.
Logged
Toady typically doesn't do things by half measures.  As evidenced by turning "make hauling work better" into "implement mine carts with physics".
There are many issues with this statement.
[/quote]

Max White

  • Bay Watcher
  • Still not hollowed!
    • View Profile
Re: 0.31. MODDERS WORKSHOP (NEWCOMERS WELCOME!)
« Reply #1990 on: February 20, 2011, 06:03:58 am »

So I figured I would take advantage of the current metal shortage, but can anybody tell me what my reaction is doing wrong? I'm no good with reactions, never played with them enough...

Code: [Select]
[NAME:make a bone spear]
[BUILDING:BONE_CARVER:CUSTOM_S]
[REAGENT:bone:1:BONE:NONE:NONE:NONE]
[PRODUCT:100:1:ITEM_WEAPON_SPEAR:NONE:GET_MATERIAL_FROM_REAGENT:spear:NONE]
[SKILL:BONECARVE]

3

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: 0.31. MODDERS WORKSHOP (NEWCOMERS WELCOME!)
« Reply #1991 on: February 20, 2011, 07:12:06 am »

What? No.  The milk thing was because I want to make shellac out of beetles. Live beetles. The only in game mechanic I've seen do something like this is creating milk from having purring maggots. If there's another way, I've missed it.

VERMIN (PET for tame) is an item token. That + PRESERVE_REAGENT may well work.

Edit: That said, there might not be a great deal of point in keeping them alive anyway. Captive/tame vermin have been witnessed spawning in massive numbers in .19.

Can I not have shellac and milk? getting the shellac from milking beetles, and milk from milking maggots?

Not without leaving the decision of whether you get milk or shellec up to the game. There's no way of specifying which creature is "milked", and that's a problem if there are radically different types of "milk", used for entirely different purposes.

If you have five critters using a material template, isn't that better than inputting the same overriding changes in each of those five creatures' raws? I'm thinking for obvious reasons like it's easier to make sure you've changed all of them when you want to tweak the properties of their explosive livers or whathaveyou.

This is precisely what I'm suggesting.
« Last Edit: February 20, 2011, 07:22:08 am by 3 »
Logged

Flaede

  • Bay Watcher
  • Beware the Moon Creatures.
    • View Profile
Re: 0.31. MODDERS WORKSHOP (NEWCOMERS WELCOME!)
« Reply #1992 on: February 20, 2011, 07:39:36 am »

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

first: you've omitted a [REACTION:IDENTIFIER] like [REACTION:MAKE_BONE_SPEAR].  And don't forget to include MAKE_BONE_SPEAR as a permitted reaction in your entity raw.
Then, reagents. for reference: [REAGENT:<name>:<quantity>:<item token>:<item subtype>:<material token>:<material subtype>][...modifiers...]

There is no BONE item token, nor BONES (in .40d there was something like that. not now). A way to use bones is add the [USE_BODY_COMPONENT][ANY_BONE_MATERIAL] modifiers. Also, "GET_MATERIAL_FROM_REAGENT:spear" should instead list whatever name you gave to the reagent. Often it just uses  A or B, (you used "bone").

Then product. Again, for reference: [PRODUCT:<quantity>:<item token>:<item subtype>:<material token>:<material subtype>]
The product item token would be WEAPON, the item subtype is the specific thing like ITEM_WEAPON_SPEAR

I think that's all you need. That begets this:
Code: [Select]
   [REACTION:MAKE_BONE_SPEAR]
   [NAME:make a bone spear]
   [BUILDING:BONE_CARVER:CUSTOM_S]
   [REAGENT:bone:1:NONE:NONE:NONE:NONE][USE_BODY_COMPONENT][ANY_BONE_MATERIAL]
   [PRODUCT:100:1:WEAPON:ITEM_WEAPON_SPEAR:GET_MATERIAL_FROM_REAGENT:bone:NONE]
   [SKILL:BONECARVE]



What? No.  The milk thing was because I want to make shellac out of beetles. Live beetles. The only in game mechanic I've seen do something like this is creating milk from having purring maggots. If there's another way, I've missed it.

VERMIN (PET for tame) is an item token. That + PRESERVE_REAGENT may well work.
That should be tested. Sounds almost too good to be true. I remember all the weird "almost but not quite" vermin reactions in 40d.

There's no way of specifying which creature is "milked", and that's a problem if there are radically different types of "milk", used for entirely different purposes.
Well crud. Hope the vermin reaction works.

This is precisely what I'm suggesting.

Oh. miscommunication then. Sorry. I thought you thought I should skip extra templates and just make the changes directly in the creature's raws. That was bad reading on my part. Time for bed.
Logged
Toady typically doesn't do things by half measures.  As evidenced by turning "make hauling work better" into "implement mine carts with physics".
There are many issues with this statement.
[/quote]

MaximumZero

  • Bay Watcher
  • Stare into the abyss.
    • View Profile
Re: 0.31. MODDERS WORKSHOP (NEWCOMERS WELCOME!)
« Reply #1993 on: February 20, 2011, 11:41:11 am »

Waitwaitwaitwait....

If I set up reactions for turning whatever into weapons, I can use whatever?

Code: [Select]
   [REACTION:MAKE_BONE_SPEAR]
   [NAME:make a bone spear]
   [BUILDING:BONE_CARVER:CUSTOM_S]
   [REAGENT:bone:1:NONE:NONE:NONE:NONE][USE_BODY_COMPONENT][ANY_BONE_MATERIAL]
   [PRODUCT:100:1:WEAPON:ITEM_WEAPON_SPEAR:GET_MATERIAL_FROM_REAGENT:bone:NONE]
   [SKILL:BONECARVE]

I can change this to glass, or gems, or whatever? (I know about the max edge thing, and I'm not really worried about it.)
Logged
  
Holy crap, why did I not start watching One Punch Man earlier? This is the best thing.
probably figured an autobiography wouldn't be interesting

Askot Bokbondeler

  • Bay Watcher
  • please line up orderly
    • View Profile
Re: 0.31. MODDERS WORKSHOP (NEWCOMERS WELCOME!)
« Reply #1994 on: February 20, 2011, 11:56:49 am »

in previous versions i couldn't make bread cuz dwarves wouldn't take flour out of bags
has anybody tested this for the new version?
Pages: 1 ... 131 132 [133] 134 135 ... 357