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[Xenos]

It is exactly the same?  I remember reading that adding the bismuth bumps it up a bit...:/

[Dr. Hieronymous Alloy]

It is exactly the same?  I remember reading that adding the bismuth bumps it up a bit...:/

Currently, to the best of my knowledge, it's *exactly* the same as normal bronze in terms of metal properties in the raws. However, it's still worth making, because you essentially get to trade each bar of bismuth for a free bar of tin, and bismuthinite ore is half the cost of cassiterite ore at embark, plus it's a pretty, unique color (a slightly shinier gold).

[Xenos]

Hmmmmmm...Bismuth bronze is more resistant to corrosion... (IRL) forgotten beast ichor containment suits anyone?

And I would love it if the metallurgy were expanded...Imagine getting a Blast furnace which requires massive amounts of coal (or be submerged in magma.  Think magma forge, but dwarfier) to fire and processes obscene amounts of ore at a time (ie, 100 ore required to fire.  you must have the actual percentage (number at 100) of ores to forge specific alloys...that would be so overly complicated and require so much micromanagement...)

[zagibu]

I'm currently re-running the tests, and it does indeed seem things have changed quite a bit. It's too early yet to say anything definitive, but hammer rounds are a lot shorter now, and bronze seems to be worse than iron again, at least as armor material.

[Osmosis Jones]

If you're in the process of redoing it, would you be willing to throw in platinum and aluminium for tthis round of tests? It would be interesting to see how they go.

[zagibu]

I'm sorry, but this would almost double the test cases. Maybe if I can automate it better, but currently, there is quite a lot of manual labor involved with publishing the results, and 320 test cases with 10 test rounds is simply too much work.

Also, last time I checked, platinum and aluminum were not forgeable into weapons. Sure it might be interesting for artifacts or mods, but I don't feel the amount of work is currently worth the result.

If I can't reduce the manual labor, I will at least publish the standard testreports, so that interested players can put those into their df_test folder and let the script automatically skip the recalculation of the standard cases.

[CinnibarMan]

So my (now) Legendary Armor-smith made me an artifact gold shield. How good is this thing?

[Dr. Hieronymous Alloy]

I'm sorry, but this would almost double the test cases. Maybe if I can automate it better, but currently, there is quite a lot of manual labor involved with publishing the results, and 320 test cases with 10 test rounds is simply too much work.

Also, last time I checked, platinum and aluminum were not forgeable into weapons. Sure it might be interesting for artifacts or mods, but I don't feel the amount of work is currently worth the result.

If I can't reduce the manual labor, I will at least publish the standard testreports, so that interested players can put those into their df_test folder and let the script automatically skip the recalculation of the standard cases.

Thanks for running these so I don't have to

Another thing I'd really like to know is whether or not the material of a given *shield* makes a damn bit of difference, or if it's immaterial. Seems to be a decent chance given the logs that blocking with a shield is just dependent on skill, not shield material -- I've never seen a "penetrating the sheild" message.

[zagibu]

So my (now) Legendary Armor-smith made me an artifact gold shield. How good is this thing?

It's a f*cking wall of gold, how bad can it be? No, seriously, artifact weapons/armor tend to be pretty badass, no matter what material they are made of. An artifact gold shield is certainly awesome.

BTW: Adamantine hammers still suck so much that a dwarf fully clad in ada armor and wielding an ada hammer loses quite often against a fellow dwarf clad in silver armor and wielding a wooden sword.

[Dr. Hieronymous Alloy]

Not to be all "hey, test this too!" and stuff, but are you testing bolt materials as well? My guess is that the different mass values for silver, bronze, etc., could give some very wonky and counterintuitive results there.

Once you're done with this round, it might be worth making a new thread if the values are sufficiently different, and updating the wiki.

[zagibu]

I really can't promise anything besides the standard metal close combat weapons, as I'm not only quite lazy, but also working on my bachelor thesis at the moment. What I might do at some point is extend the script a bit and write a detailed step by step instruction for people wanting to run their own tests.

It might be quite difficult to define "round over" conditions for ranged tests, because well-armored dwarfs might actually survive 99 bolts.

[zagibu]

It has indeed changed A LOT. Silver hammers are awesome now, they penetrate all armor up to steel with 100% efficiency, steel armor with 93% efficiency and adamantine with 87%. Similar results for steel hammers (100% up to bronze, steel at 97%, adamantine at 82%). Even adamantine hammers have gotten a bit better, with chances to penetrate silver armor at 48%, copper armor at 21%, then getting worse and worse up to adamantine at 9%.

I still need help classifying the wounds into light, medium and heavy. If you want to help, please simulate some arena rounds with standard weapons (hammers, maces, axes, swords, spears), read the combat log and try to classify the combat messages into the three wound severity classes.

[Laiska]

1: bruising
2: fracturing
3: chipping
4: shattering
5: tearing
6: tearing apart

(sometimes it says "bruising the muscle and the bone and and and")
1,2,3,4 the skin, the bone
1,5,6 the muscle, the fat, the heart, the guts, the brains(death here yey), etc...
the severed part sails off in an arc!
An artery has been opened by the strike
A tendon in the *** has been torn!
a ligament has been torn
a tendon has been torn
a major artery ***(in the heart, may happen elsewhere.. maybe) has been opened by the strike
in the *** with his/her *** shattering it!
jamming the *** through the ***


any hit in brains kills, critical hits to legs or arms may result to enemy dropping the weapons, tearing guts makes the guy sick and vomitting, tearing lungs makes the lad to have a trouble to breath

[zagibu]

And what belongs to what wound severity class?

BTW: I have posted the new hammer data in the OP.

[Rask]

And what belongs to what wound severity class?

BTW: I have posted the new hammer data in the OP.

It looks as if the material of the hammer has become irrelevant, as long as it isn't adamantine: all are deadly.