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[Deon]

Hmm, it will require me to add reactions for every metal, but being able to smelt more ore at once with it sounds reasonable.

[Elu]

Good evening gentlemen.
First of all, thank you for keeping up the good work!
Genesis is by far my preferred mod, but only for dedicating your free time to modding and tweaking, you deserve a big thanks...
secondly, i have noticed that DF tend to freeze on embark, although not always, is there any known "lethal" conditions?
i've uploaded(at least i hope so) a save for reference(http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=4450), where an embark in the noted area will lead to a freeze, everywhere else will instead be fine...

[TomiTapio]

Thanks for digging the Genesis worlds!
How long have you let it run when it appears to freeze? Hopefully several minutes.
There might be a cave-in deep in the caves, or ice-ponds melting right away, which might cause lag at first.

(downloads, tries to embark there) Yep, most odd, nothing happens after press "e" from embark items screen. No disk activity. 4x4 embark on same area, also freeze. 3x3 lower right corner of marked 5x5 area, instant crash (good for Toady to see). Should try to get that crash again with next DF version (he'll be interested in crashes)


7pm edit: bored, starting new ascii fort. Want to balance stuff, leave gobs flayers weres out of the world, gonna meet demons and serpentfolk and the rare secretive scavengers. Zero cavern layers for higher fps and different digging. Later.... skeletal cows and cougars (some of them "110" gigantic...) killed everybody!

Hey guys, which caste should be 10-25% better at carpentry/coopering? Or does that specialty too fall to the supersmart Jaders?

[Valience]

Thanks for digging the Genesis worlds!
How long have you let it run when it appears to freeze? Hopefully several minutes.
There might be a cave-in deep in the caves, or ice-ponds melting right away, which might cause lag at first.

(downloads, tries to embark there) Yep, most odd, nothing happens after press "e" from embark items screen. No disk activity. 4x4 embark on same area, also freeze. 3x3 lower right corner of marked 5x5 area, instant crash (good for Toady to see). Should try to get that crash again with next DF version (he'll be interested in crashes)


7pm edit: bored, starting new ascii fort. Want to balance stuff, leave gobs flayers weres out of the world, gonna meet demons and serpentfolk and the rare secretive scavengers. Zero cavern layers for higher fps and different digging. Later.... skeletal cows and cougars (some of them "110" gigantic...) killed everybody!

Hey guys, which caste should be 10-25% better at carpentry/coopering? Or does that specialty too fall to the supersmart Jaders?

Would you be adding it to an existing or a new caste? I'd almost like to see a new caste that's good at working with their hands, and gets slight bonuses to carpentry, masonry, and the x-crafting skills.

Jade dwarves could be better at gem cutting/setting? Since jade is a gem and all that...

[TomiTapio]

The jaders are fast learners at everything. (my tuning: except martial skills and cooking and boring milk/potash skills.)
They have 180% learning rate and almost everyone else has 115%. (Vanilla's 100% is better suited for forts that survive 7-20 years, because there are only gobboes.)

I was thinking if drop jaders' 180 masonry and 180 carpentry down some, maybe to 140, and give some other caste 190 carpentry. But which caste?
Obsidians work with fire, metals, hammers (boost to military hammer skill I gave). Aspids got Flattery and Persuasion (toadying). Mossers got medicine. Shroomers, slighty stupid, good at farming stuff. Gloomers got nothing but worries.

Yeah might be logical to have a "crafter" caste of carpentry, masonry, woodcrafting, bone- and stonecarving, engraving. But... probably way too much high-quality items would result, ultimate expensive items without anyone getting a mood. Yup, should nerf jade-smarties' 180% crafting somewhat. to 140. And are the smartypants supposed to learn social skills exceptionally quickly?

I shall give gloomers carpentry and masonry 150, 10 better than jaders. "Gloomers feel they can trust stone and wood and bones."

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

      [SKILL_RATES:100:60:12:120] 100, not 115% xp, they don't work as hard as other castes.
      [SKILL_LEARN_RATE:CARPENTRY:150] better than jaders' 140
      [SKILL_LEARN_RATE:MASONRY:150]
      [SKILL_LEARN_RATE:BONECARVE:150]

And my current for jaders:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

      [SKILL_RATES:180:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:COOK:70:60:12:120] --dwarves aren't good cooks. They should be exporting metal items, not chef salads.
      [SKILL_LEARN_RATE:CARPENTRY:140] better than average dorf's 115
      [SKILL_LEARN_RATE:MASONRY:140]
      [SKILL_LEARN_RATE:DETAILSTONE:140]
      [SKILL_LEARN_RATE:WOODCRAFT:140]
      [SKILL_LEARN_RATE:STONECRAFT:140]
      [SKILL_LEARN_RATE:BONECARVE:130]
      -- leatherwork, looming, spinning, tailoring, base rate of 180 is okay, they do the work smarter and better.
      [SKILL_LEARN_RATE:SMELT:130] --boring labor, they get distracted
      
      --jades should not have spent teen years as cheeser/potasher/othercrap, they're smarter than that      
      [SKILL_LEARN_RATE:ANIMALCARE:90]
      [SKILL_LEARN_RATE:MILK:90]
      [SKILL_LEARN_RATE:CHEESEMAKING:90]
      [SKILL_LEARN_RATE:EXTRACT_STRAND:120] patience-oriented task
      [SKILL_LEARN_RATE:LYE_MAKING:80]
      [SKILL_LEARN_RATE:POTASH_MAKING:80]
      [SKILL_LEARN_RATE:WOOD_BURNING:90]  --boring labor, they get distracted
      [SKILL_LEARN_RATE:FISH:140] --fishing requires smarts and patience
      [SKILL_LEARN_RATE:PROCESSFISH:80] --boring labor, they get distracted
      
      --not superior social talents
      [SKILL_RATE:PERSUASION:120:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:NEGOTIATION:140:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:JUDGING_INTENT:190:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:LYING:130:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:INTIMIDATION:80:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:CONVERSATION:130:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:COMEDY:80:60:12:120] -low-brow humor works better at other castes
      [SKILL_RATE:CONSOLE:120:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:PACIFY:100:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:LEADERSHIP:100:60:12:120] --Steelers are leaders, not jaders
      
      --jades should not be kung-fu masters and elite platemail-wearers.
      [SKILL_RATE:DODGING:90:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:MELEE_COMBAT:110:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:SNEAK:150:60:12:120] --for hunters
      [SKILL_RATE:CRUTCH_WALK:220:60:12:120]
      
      [SKILL_RATE:ARMOR:80:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:SHIELD:110:60:12:120]
   
      [SKILL_RATE:DAGGER:145:60:12:120] --the smarties' choice
      [SKILL_RATE:CROSSBOW:125:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:BOW:125:60:12:120]
      
      [SKILL_RATE:AXE:90:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:BITE:90:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:BLOWGUN:90:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:GRASP_STRIKE:80:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:HAMMER:90:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:MACE:90:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:MILITARY_TACTICS:170:60:12:120] plans
      [SKILL_RATE:MISC_WEAPON:90:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:PIKE:90:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:RANGED_COMBAT:90:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:SIEGEOPERATE:120:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:SITUATIONAL_AWARENESS:90:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:SPEAR:90:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:STANCE_STRIKE:80:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:SWORD:90:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:THROW:90:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:WHIP:90:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:WRESTLING:90:60:12:120]

And now I give social talents boost to steelers. Intimidation & charisma
and as a further result, gloomers become much worse at partying and consoling!

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

      --awful social talents
      [SKILL_RATE:LEADERSHIP:10:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:PERSUASION:20:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:PACIFY:10:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:NEGOTIATION:10:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:JUDGING_INTENT:160:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:INTIMIDATION:100:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:CONVERSATION:130:60:12:120] --Gloomers have bizarre but fascinating topics
      [SKILL_RATE:COMEDY:10:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:CONSOLE:10:60:12:120]
      [SKILL_RATE:LYING:80:60:12:120]

[Tiruin]

Played through my fifth genesis fort.

And I can say, the Genesis Mod brings life to it all. I could say that you creators just made a sequel to DF or something.

The caste system works beautifully here along with the new monsters and challenges although I'm noticing a bug with the Obsidian caste not using their fire against the enemy as stated before.

And could I suggest a "Noble" caste? For those who would be elected to nobility who would at least give useful mandates and such and have more patience and not order everyone to be jailed/beaten to death because they exported something useless?

[Sirdrake]

Played through my fifth genesis fort.

And I can say, the Genesis Mod brings life to it all. I could say that you creators just made a sequel to DF or something.

The caste system works beautifully here along with the new monsters and challenges although I'm noticing a bug with the Obsidian caste not using their fire against the enemy as stated before.

And could I suggest a "Noble" caste? For those who would be elected to nobility who would at least give useful mandates and such and have more patience and not order everyone to be jailed/beaten to death because they exported something useless?

i think that can not be done with the nobles

and Deon is the only creator he just gets help because he is got his diploma to do

[TomiTapio]

The caste system works beautifully here along with the new monsters and challenges although I'm noticing a bug with the Obsidian caste not using their fire against the enemy as stated before.
And could I suggest a "Noble" caste? For those who would be elected to nobility who would at least give useful mandates and such and have more patience and not order everyone to be jailed/beaten to death because they exported something useless?

Yeah it's Deon's mod, and it was once called "Dwarf Fortress Complete" mod (back in DF 40d, May 2009 and earlier. http://dffd.wimbli.com/file.php?id=1021 ) I just add a few shrooms and creatures and try to balance things. My cutting-edge sub-version has mucho new minerals and trees; because on some days the metagame is more fun than the game.

The steel caste are the natural-born leaders (they have the lobes for it), and I don't think mandates can be ever made useful since the dwarves' preferences are very random.
It'll be worse with my new minerals and trees! Does patience really prevent them from issuing a punishment?
Obsidians' firebreath was removed, it wasn't fun after Nth time the fires killed a pile of people (and early aspid's area effect paralyzing 15 war dogs to death in melee). Now you got random fire mephit pet to cause trouble. That first-post documentation is really old but cool.

[dpara]

I have a Discworld feature request. Is it possible to mod in stone layers of bone and fat? And more uses for fat than uh rancid fat statues.

Well, it would have to be a mineral (IS_STONE) or soil for it to be diggable. It would be a mineral with the properties copied from fat (or bone). A "bone conglomerate layer" is semi-reasonable. And please don't harvest the world-supporting elephants.

Also, can't control that TurtleFat would be the bottommost, unless give it the bottomness tag [DEEP_SURFACE] from Slade. So can't dictate "bottom two layers are TurtleShell and WorldTurtleFat". Also, no magma veins. Fat is cookable after it's rendered in the kitchen into tallow. You want some fat magic workshop reactions for Bombs and Gnus? Nah. Nah, I say. No "poisonous blade coating" either.

I think the idea for Genesis is "the same fantasy world as vanilla DF, but more variety in everything". And fixes like.. whips not being "goes through any armor because it's blunt" lightsabers.
This week I had a goblin siege last over a season and.. Another Goblin Siege came to support them!
ps. updated http://df-genesis.wikidot.com/dwarf a little

Oh no I was more thinking, of finding the bones/corpses of (gigantic) creatures trapped in stone.

Things like layers of fossilized giant cave slugs, giant earthworm cartilage,.. crystallized dragon eye.

Or a workshop that allows bones to be pressed into bone blocks?

My fortress entrace, grave chambers, noble rooms and pyramid of doom kinda demand bones as building material ^^

[Valience]

And now I give social talents boost to steelers. Intimidation & charisma
and as a further result, gloomers become much worse at partying and consoling!

Hmm. Is there any particular reason gloomers have such a low ability to lie? I'd think that someone who was ridiculed all their life and treated as an outcast would be very good at telling lies and hiding their true thoughts and intentions.

[TomiTapio]

In my opinion..
Gloomers are paranoid, nervous wrecks. Sometimes depressed and suicidal. Sometimes plotting the death and shaving of others. Their brains aren't built right. Very anti-social, probably autistic, total outcasts.
Aspids are more scheming and kiss-beard. They flatter and lie and persuade.
Steelers are great leaders, inspire others, and bytheway olympic medal winners and war heroes. In crafting, writing and trading, totally average, except "refined tastes".
Jaders are the opposite of steelers, but they learn damn fast and craft exceptional items.

ps. check out Creeper World, the different tower defense. http://knucklecracker.com/

[Cave Man]

Good idea with nobles cast I think. I have many asocial dwarves and they are very slow rising social talents. Maybe it will be interesting. They must be a weak, bad workers, good social workers and very rare. They will be good psychiatrist, Teachers (will whiting books for library), traders, politics and etc.

We also don`t need crafters cast I think. Now we have very good Jaders. They are very talented guys. And we have a many very professional migrants. I think migrants are needed to set less professionalism. Let them learning in our fortress.

If we want more variety of settlers, let`s take underground humanoids to tame for haul work. My migrants so good and professional and I have trouble with bad workers for haul goods.  Our underground humanoids will have not so much our control, because they are stupid. They can`t create something beautiful.  Maybe they will can to do simple work like Small animal dissection, pressing, fishing, fish cleaning, cleaning and hauling. They are stupid and so we can`t to choose task for them. They are doing choice randomly.
Some of they like troglodyte are sleeping on floor, eating normal food and body parts.  They love bones and body parts, so they take them from garbage dump and drop it everywhere.   Other is more civilized.

1 Can we take it only for simple works, not for crafts and etc.? 

2 And another question.
Now I have a very bad breeding in fortress. We having 102 women and only 24 men and 3 children. This is very strange situation. What`s wrong?

3 Ok, if we can`t to destruct walls, can we set risen bridge to wall grate, not wall.
I hate wall-bridges because it can stop any mighty army of hell or gods. This is not right.

Oh no I was more thinking, of finding the bones/corpses of (gigantic) creatures trapped in stone.

It`s not so much useful and just decorative, but interesting idea.

[Valience]

Ah. Gotcha about the gloomers. I had them pictured as outcasts who were at least trying to fit in a little and so they would just lie about liking/thinking about stuff normal dwarves would frown upon.

[FluidDynamite]

*snip*
3 Ok, if we can`t to destruct walls, can we set risen bridge to wall grate, not wall.
I hate wall-bridges because it can stop any mighty army of hell or gods. This is not right.
*snip*

Raised bridges being invincible to building destroyers is only temporary. They used to be breakable, but trolls often killed themselves by destroying the bridge they're standing on and plummet 20-something-z levels to their splattery deaths. So Toady changed it that building destroyers don't target bridges, at least until their AI gets fixed.

[TomiTapio]

If we want more variety of settlers, let`s take underground humanoids to tame for haul work. My migrants so good and professional and I have trouble with bad workers for haul goods.  Our underground humanoids will have not so much our control, because they are stupid. They can`t create something beautiful. 

You can rename my Domple Dwarf moron caste to Trogs and make them have a higher popratio than stone dwarves.
Aspid and Steel are the very social in my current plan. Maybe even make moss caste very good at some social skill, like pacifying.

2 And another question. Now I have a very bad breeding in fortress. We having 102 women and only 24 men and 3 children. This is very strange situation. What`s wrong?

3 Ok, if we can`t to destruct walls, can we set risen bridge to wall grate, not wall. I hate wall-bridges because it can stop any mighty army of hell or gods. This is not right.

2) they need to party and socialise to get married. You get babies only from married female dwarves. In d_init.txt I have [BABY_CHILD_CAP:3:4] , 3 kids max, or 4%. Set your preferences there.
3) I too hate stopping an invading army with bridge or build-a-wall. So I don't do it. Also, having entrace corridor 40 cage traps or 12 elite weapon traps (120 wooden spikes) seems too easy also. So I don't put that many traps, unless previous siege almost killed everybody. I wish Toady would program "TrapAvoid: X% chance" instead of 0% / 100%.

Gloomers are so messed up in the head that others detect their lies easily.. or do they? Anyways, lying is a skill that can be practised, and gloomers have no talent for social skills.

Edit: my cavernless (= high-FPS) world... dorfs go extinct as they can't do cave farming. Fix: allow outdoor farming.