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[therealmarauder]

That was a good idea, and it was my first thought, too, but, oddly, the jobs are there. Kobolds who embark with those skills have those jobs activated, but the jobs themselves are not listed. I even watched kobolds doing things I couldn't tell them to do or not to do using v-p-l.

Now I've presented a more puzzling conundrum. Kobolds CAN do the jobs, but the only menu items are mining, woodworking, healthcare, hauling, and other. I can't activate or deactivate any other jobs.

[Fayrik]

That was a good idea, and it was my first thought, too, but, oddly, the jobs are there. Kobolds who embark with those skills have those jobs activated, but the jobs themselves are not listed. I even watched kobolds doing things I couldn't tell them to do or not to do using v-p-l.

Now I've presented a more puzzling conundrum. Kobolds CAN do the jobs, but the only menu items are mining, woodworking, healthcare, hauling, and other. I can't activate or deactivate any other jobs.

Now that is odd.
I remember there was one bug that meant rather than having the labours list, you had the option to slaughter them.
But, it sounds like you can access the labours list so it's probably not that.

[darkflagrance]

Kobolds don't have the armorer job in their entity file, but dwarves do. This is causing the error.

The strange thing about how Dwarf Fortress processes the raws is that the lack of one job will disable all related jobs. So I'd guess that the lack of a [PERMITTED_JOB:ARMORER] tag is causing this.

However, note that if you removed any job of a group of labors, such as STRAND_EXTRACTOR, which is considered a crafting job, this will also cause every other related job to disappear. Also, I think you have to regenerate a world to make jobs you re-enable for an entity available after you change their entity file.


Edit: I decided to test this myself, using the Separate raws. Interestingly, while all metalsmithing labors are disabled, as they should be due to the lack of armorer, I can assign all my kobolds to carry out crafting labors. You should try adding the armorer job anyway, but I think the problem is likely with your file rather than with the actual mod. It might be worth uploading it so we can take a look.

[Lagotrope]

Kobolds don't have the armorer job in their entity file, but dwarves do. This is causing the error.

The strange thing about how Dwarf Fortress processes the raws is that the lack of one job will disable all related jobs. So I'd guess that the lack of a [PERMITTED_JOB:ARMORER] tag is causing this.

However, note that if you removed any job of a group of labors, such as STRAND_EXTRACTOR, which is considered a crafting job, this will also cause every other related job to disappear. Also, I think you have to regenerate a world to make jobs you re-enable for an entity available after you change their entity file.


Edit: I decided to test this myself, using the Separate raws. Interestingly, while all metalsmithing labors are disabled, as they should be due to the lack of armorer, I can assign all my kobolds to carry out crafting labors. You should try adding the armorer job anyway, but I think the problem is likely with your file rather than with the actual mod. It might be worth uploading it so we can take a look.

Right, ARMORER was removed to purposefully disable the whole tree, namely weaponsmith, blacksmith, metalcrafting and furnace_operator. I should've simply (and will) remove the other 4 for cleanliness' sake. Metal-usage was meant to be very limited. And while the limited mining would take care of this, a survived goblin siege would allow all sorts of crazy steel items if that tree was enabled. Thus, I disabled the family and made a buncha custom reactions as a workaround. Other than that the jobs are the exact same as vanilla dwarves, so I'm not sure what snafu'd the rest. Up to this point armorer hasn't been in for ages (if ever) and the skills have worked as expected.

Linux was always odd and never worked for me. Some of this may be because of rough, untested ports hopping from one version to the next; not surprised if some issues cropped up that I didn't notice. I'll work on a port to 31.16 soon and include the updated raws, with any luck that'll help. But I don't like linux and linux doesn't like me, so I can't promise much for marauder.

I'm very tired and I re wrote this post like 3 times. I'm not sure if it makes any sense.

[Lagotrope]

Alright then. Version 1.11 is up for 31.16.
Also the raws-only.

I noticed I had no trouble making a world with the default world_gen file, so it seems that you no longer need to double the amount of caves to be able to have a kobold civilization to play.

However, somewhere along the line, all stone became mineable again. I do not know why, and when I think about it, the last few versions have been built on aquifers during testing and I simply assumed it worked. Now that I think about it, this may have been a problem for awhile, I don't know. I changed the impact_fracture to 50 million instead of the usual 5 mil but it didn't change anything. Help on that would be lovely, as I felt that was one of the biggest things df2010 did for KC.

Otherwise the changes are pretty superficial (still in the readme changelog), and just done for sake of being a newer version. Hopefully it helps with that linux issue though.

[NecroRebel]

However, somewhere along the line, all stone became mineable again. I do not know why, and when I think about it, the last few versions have been built on aquifers during testing and I simply assumed it worked. Now that I think about it, this may have been a problem for awhile, I don't know. I changed the impact_fracture to 50 million instead of the usual 5 mil but it didn't change anything. Help on that would be lovely, as I felt that was one of the biggest things df2010 did for KC.

There's now an [UNDIGGABLE] tag that (surprisingly) makes the stone it is applied to undiggable. IIRC, Toady added it after the version where raw adamantine was undiggable, and issues with the straight-up fix to that made him just add that tag to HFStone. Something like that. Regardless, now, stones that are [UNDIGGABLE] are undiggable, and stones without it aren't.

[Lagotrope]

Thanks, NecroRebel. Quickly tested and it works as it should. I even noticed that tag. And I thought "huh." and kept fidgeting with impact fractures.

I find that bit of hindsight to be moderately depressing.

New files are updated, like nothing ever happened.

[Fayrik]

I've just read through all previous Kobold Camp stuff, and have noticed there's a horrible lack of artwork recently...Oh, how I wish I was an artist.

But, the development here is second to none. I've not done any detailed tests, but everything checks out okay. Fortress mode is certainly playable... Double aquifer keeping me well away from the bed rock though, so I figured it best to save the landscape butchering to my mega wooden building projects. *tee hee*

[therealmarauder]

Why would armorer disabled cause crafting to be disabled?

Nevertheless, adding back all the crafting jobs, or ensuring they're all there, should be doable; I wonder if Toady will change that. It seems like a limitation that removing one job removes the whole process tree. Maybe jobs should have their own files, and job trees should get files, as well, making this sort of issue vanish.

Meanwhile, I'll add stonecrafting, etc until I get crafting, and other such jobs until I have what I want. Thanks!

[Lagotrope]

Why would armorer disabled cause crafting to be disabled?

Nevertheless, adding back all the crafting jobs, or ensuring they're all there, should be doable; I wonder if Toady will change that. It seems like a limitation that removing one job removes the whole process tree. Maybe jobs should have their own files, and job trees should get files, as well, making this sort of issue vanish.

Meanwhile, I'll add stonecrafting, etc until I get crafting, and other such jobs until I have what I want. Thanks!

http://df.magmawiki.com/index.php/Skills

If you look in the skill section, you'll see what consitutes as a family; all within each box. So if you disable something in the Woodworker department (like bowyer) the other 2 skills (carpenter and woodcutter) will be disabled. What I'm getting at here is that disabling armorer will only disable the metalsmithing jobs (furnace operator, metal crafter, blacksmith and weapon smith). The Crafting family should be unaffected, as every job in that family is disabled. And testing shows that they're there.

In other words, I'm not sure why your skills aren't working as they should, but I can confidently say it's not because armorer is disabled (and in the recent version, all 5 skills in the metalsmithing jobs are removed, but all jobs everyone else are in place.)

I've just read through all previous Kobold Camp stuff, and have noticed there's a horrible lack of artwork recently...Oh, how I wish I was an artist.

But, the development here is second to none. I've not done any detailed tests, but everything checks out okay. Fortress mode is certainly playable... Double aquifer keeping me well away from the bed rock though, so I figured it best to save the landscape butchering to my mega wooden building projects. *tee hee*

Those aquifers have been real common in 2010.. last couple versions though haven't been as big of a problem (though very small island still seems to be 80% aquifer.) The bedrocks generally supposed to be unmineable anyhow though so I haven't paid it much mind; it's only a pain if you would otherwise get lucky with a chert/shale ground, or a gold vein or such precious mineral that's left mineable.

This does remind me that I kinda wish there was a way to make trees grow back faster; as your little land zone tends to run out quite quickly when you build with wood. It'll probably be a long time before Toady implements such things as sending out lumber parties. I'm toying with the idea of making a reaction for processed wood; essentially giving you 2 logs for one. I don't know/remember how I'd make it so that processed wood can't be used for the reaction though, otherwise it'd be infinite wood.

Speaking of ideas I'm unsure about, not sure if I care to have kobolds have an actual language. Feels kinda weird. Doesn't help that the names tend to be -really- long, even longer than the utterances tended to be. Although I liked the idea of them being able to actually have a language, the way it plays out seems to make it feel a bit more distant from its roots than I hoped, so I may take it out next version (still leaving in the kobold.txt file though to make it easy to add back in if people please.) Maybe I've just been feeling nostalgia over the simpler days of 40d, when KC was a barely-operational project. Back when neither the kobolds OR myself knew what we were doing.



I can't believe I lost the actual save to this fort, I could've gotten a much better screenshot than the aftermath.

This was, if you couldn't figure, back in the 40d days, and I tended to have rather advanced kobolds back then.

[Fayrik]

But, the development here is second to none.

I think I might have worded that wrong. Urgh, my [UTTERANCES] are coming though.
I meant to say I love what you've done with it, and how well you're keeping it up to date. And I apologize for my failure of communication there.

This does remind me that I kinda wish there was a way to make trees grow back faster; as your little land zone tends to run out quite quickly when you build with wood. It'll probably be a long time before Toady implements such things as sending out lumber parties. I'm toying with the idea of making a reaction for processed wood; essentially giving you 2 logs for one. I don't know/remember how I'd make it so that processed wood can't be used for the reaction though, otherwise it'd be infinite wood.

I did think perhaps you could make *gulp* yet another custom workshop!
One that deals with carpentary jobs for things like sawdust and half-logs, things like that. That way at least you can turn standard logs into items that do tasks, but aren't the same.

Speaking of ideas I'm unsure about, not sure if I care to have kobolds have an actual language. Feels kinda weird.

I quite agree with you there, but the trouble is that some functionality is lost without it.
I like the idea of Kobolds without second names, but on the other hand, you don't have Fortress Names without languages..
I don't really mind either way though. Having it optional would be quite good I guess!

And, that comic was great. Made me giggle!

[Lagotrope]

I did think perhaps you could make *gulp* yet another custom workshop!
One that deals with carpentary jobs for things like sawdust and half-logs, things like that. That way at least you can turn standard logs into items that do tasks, but aren't the same.

Right... I think I will need to make another custom workshop, again. Still, worried about how to make the processed wood ineligible to be processed again. Maybe make the product logs act as blocks, that might work. It should be possible though, so I'll look into that in the near future.

Almost definitely will remove the [TRANSLATION:KOBOLD] tag from the kobold entity but leave in kobold.txt for that option. Come to think, wonder what happens if kobolds have utterances, but the entity a language.. have a feeling utterances will supersede it, but I will test this.

EDIT: Utterances indeed supersedes any language. Even if it's just added to a caste, makes no difference. Does make it easy adding/removing a language though, just having to remove/add the [UTTERANCES] tag.

[Fayrik]

Right... I think I will need to make another custom workshop, again. Still, worried about how to make the processed wood ineligible to be processed again. Maybe make the product logs act as blocks, that might work. It should be possible though, so I'll look into that in the near future.

Wooden blocks are a point I didn't think of.
Thinking about it like that, Sawdust isn't really that useful.. But, I think blocks would perhaps work better than half logs at anyrate.

[therealmarauder]

Now I'm getting segfaults on worldgen.
DF just segfaulted on me.


What happened was this: I edited the entity_default.txt file so kobolds would have the complete crafting and farming trees.

I ran df.

I generated a world with default parameters.

DF segfaulted.

(I tried it several times. Now, if the problem continues, I will have no choice but to kill small furry creatures.)

[Fayrik]

Now I'm getting segfaults on worldgen.
DF just segfaulted on me.


What happened was this: I edited the entity_default.txt file so kobolds would have the complete crafting and farming trees.

I ran df.

I generated a world with default parameters.

DF segfaulted.

I've not run into a segfault, or at least, haven't heard of them. I'm hoping you've tried this twice at least though to make sure it's not just a one off.
Next, back up that entity_default and return the active one to default settings and try again.
If the problem persists after that, then I'd redownload it and stick in your backup file.

..And, please let me know if I'm jumping the gun here, I'm not 100% certain you're asking for help, but I'd rather not leave someone stuck for what to do.