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[mikefictiti0us]

Slaves could also be used when (and if) magic is implemented. I can imagine certain powerful spells, that require a large amount of time and preparation before they can be cast, being hurried along by human/elven/dwarven/goblin sacrifices.

Or perhaps you could have certain "evil" spells that can only be cast during a sacrificial ritual. An example would be a "Summon Demon" spell, and you'd need a large amount of slaves to sacrifice, plus several Master+ Spellcasters who can attempt (sometimes unsuccessfully) to control the demon.

If that were the case, the amount of sacrifices required for each "evil" sacrificial spell could be determined by the race and age of the slaves you sacrifice. For example, a human child would give the magical energy equivalent of 10 full grown goblins. Elves, being the most in tune with nature (and thus completely and utterly opposed to "evil" brands of magic) would give far more energy than humans. An elven child would be an energy goldmine.

Another idea is that you could, upon finding an adamantium vein or demon pit, sacrifice slaves (by throwing them into the pits) in order to appease the demons for certain lengths of time, thus allowing you to travel past their pits and mine adamantium without fear of rousing them into battle. Perhaps you could even convince, with enough sacrifices, a large demon to share with you a spell or two, or even become allied with Demon civilizations (which would in turn make most of the other civs hate you)
Imagine an large fortress populated by evil dwarves allying themselves with the demons, and bringing unholy wars against neighboring civilizations. The world would run red with blood!

Anyway, negative aspects of sacrifices could be tied to Jaiya's negative suggestions, in which the civ whose slaves are sacrificed become enraged, far more so than the act of merely keeping slaves.
You could also have some of your own dwarves who might despise the act, thinking it evil, and, if you sacrifice too many non-goblin entities, they might try and lead a revolt and attempt to kill your spellcasters/priests.

[ August 20, 2007: Message edited by: mikefictiti0us ]

[Kyselina]

We MUST have this!

[Retales]

Absolutely awesome idea  

I love the idea of dwarves being able to have their own personal slaves. Assigning a slave to for example a metalsmith would cause him/her/it to haul the ore/charcoal to the workshop and then haul the finished item to the stockpile. Bwahaha

[BDR]

My individual take will most likely be along the lines of: if at the end of battle I happen to find some enemies are unconscious and not dead, I'll take them back with me and either let them free with a finger/toe missing, execute them all, or torture them all to death depending on how well the battle went.  Of course if I feel I could use the extra labor, I *may* also just enslave them.    I'll probably treat 'em well as long as they follow the rules, though.

[Lostsoul]

What a great idea cant wait it.
I got 1 too : If your slaves get enough at your ´´evil´´ peoples who dont give any food and so one, first they start steal weapons and food then 1 time they surprise guard who is alone and kill him, steal all armor and weapons then slaves try escape\try force your food stokpile or some other important place or any room and defent it at bloody end\ or kill some of your nobles or then they just get crasy and they just run around your fortress killing all waht they see waht you say?

[Reign on your Parade]

If you were to say, seperate that into multiple coherent sentances instead of a big run-on one, We would be much more likey to pay attention to it. We think everyone else would too. Typing it up in word, spell-checking, and then pasting it in would also be a plus.

[ August 24, 2007: Message edited by: Reign on your Parade ]

[Tamren]

Great idea! Slavery already exists to some extent in your fortress. You can capture creatures in cages and use them for pit fights but it does not get much better than that.

There are a lot of things we need to work out beforehand but once the foundations are in place, this idea could fit and fit well.

[Shingo]

I'm going to disagree with your automatic assumption that friendly nations that "value freedom" would immediately be soured in their relationships with you, because you enslaved those nasty goblins, or other evil race. Doesn't it make more sense for their own relationship and/or dealings with the species in question come into play? On the other hand, if slavery is a cultural Taboo, that would obviously over-ride most other concerns that might normally be factored into this. On the whole, I like where you're heading with this, but I don't think you've realistically judged or added in the influence of all the necessary variables, here. A good start, though.

[Lightning4]

Yeah, there's the question of ethics. Enslaving Goblins and Kobolds should not affect relations unless they are freedom extremists.

Goblins, well, come on, they'll probably be at war with everybody when Civ interactions are fully implemented. I can imagine the extremists might look down on you, or the pure civs because you're keeping such filthy, vile creatures around.

And kobolds, well, nobody gives a damn about them anyway.

[mickel]

I dunno, I'm not an extremist but I'd be pretty cold toward an entity that used slavery. Because, frankly, it's kobolds and goblins today, but what will it be tomorrow?

[Tamren]

quote:Originally posted by mickel:
<STRONG>I dunno, I'm not an extremist but I'd be pretty cold toward an entity that used slavery. Because, frankly, it's kobolds and goblins today, but what will it be tomorrow?</STRONG>

Well thats the thing, if you add it to the game it affects everyone. We could enslave kobolds and goblins, but the reverse could happen just as easily.

[Aquillion]

My feeling is that Dwarves would probably trap and enslave a few brute creatures like trolls for use as heavy labor in the depths.  I doubt they'd bother to enslave humans or elves, though...  trolls would just make better slaves overall, being both stupider and stronger.  Plus, since thery're less "civilized", the dwarves could (like many slaveowners in the real world) tell themselves that they were doing the savage trolls a favor.  They might not call them slaves, calling them captured laborers or something like that (which might help squeamish players), but the end result is the same.

I don't think kobolds or goblins would make good slaves.  They're scrawny, sneaky, clever, and quick to backstab.  They're probably good at things like picking locks, too...  as slaves, they'd just be more trouble then they're worth.  Most things could be done better by a minimum-wage Dwarf, and the things that couldn't be are things you probably don't want a slave doing.

I don't think Dwarves would enslave other dwarves.  They seem better than humans that way.

Most other races are no good at surviving in the caves, making them useless as slaves.  Kinda pointless to enslave a human or an elf when they'll just die from the underground air, poor nutrition, and so forth anyway.  Plus, the humans, at least, can't see very well in the dark.

Regarding the other races keeping slaves...  I'd imagine some of the monstrous humanoids would keep other nasty humanoids as slaves (maybe goblins have some kobold slaves, or vice-versa).  Everyone would probably want a few trolls and other big stupid nasties if they could manage to keep them.  Elves would probably not want to even interact with the savage (ie non-elven) races that frequently...  they might keep a few creatures to try and 'reform' them, though.  Dwarves are probably too stubborn to make good slaves for anyone else, at least when other options are available.  Probably Elves are the same way.

Humans...  well, we already know about humans.  Humans are horrible.  They're really the nastiest monster race in fantasy, when you think about it.  Humans enslave other humans.  How horrible is that?  Goblins probably tell each other horror stories about the monstrous inhumanity of humans to scare themselves to sleep.

[ August 25, 2007: Message edited by: Aquillion ]

[Reign on your Parade]

quote:Originally posted by Aquillion:
<STRONG>Goblins probably tell each other horror stories about the monstrous inhumanity of humans to scare themselves to sleep.</STRONG>

Glad We've been giving the message out to them.

[MindSnap]

I was recently thinking about this and figured I would resurrect this old thread rather than starting a new one.

Chains: once multi-tile restraints are implemented (they will be, right?) slaves could be kept on chains by slave-drivers to further control them/make it harder to escape.

Also, with multi-tile chains and Z-levels, what happens if an entity chained to the edge of a cliff it kicked off of it? will they hang? any limbs that were attached to chains should be unusable and take some light damage, as well as choking if a chain was attached to the neck. This could be used for mass hangings with the new trapdoors, or for some live target practice. Maybe chain damage would be related to the effective falling damage for a given height.

Slavery also needs the skill "slave driver" - the skill would use a whip and armour (up to chain). Slave driver skill affects how many, and how efficiently the slaves work, as well as keeping them from revolting. Slave drivers could also constantly try to inflict light wounds upon the slaves to further control them. this might work like sparring, with inexperienced slave drivers accidentally killing slaves. Slave drivers would be payed some for fraction of the work that the slaves do. Not all dwarves would be suitable to be slave drivers - morals

Slave caravans/traders could be in too, with healthy slaves fetching quite high prices

[Leonidas]

All my dwarves are already slaves.  My slaves.

But seriously, slavery sounds too dark to be much fun.  And it's unrealistic: You wouldn't want slaves in a border fortress that's subject to invasion every year or so.  If you're going to have slaves, you put them back in the heartland, where they're so far from home that there's no point in trying to escape.