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[Max White]

Well I'm all for it! Farming without water seemed a little strange, especially is a desert.

And then my mind ticked over like a drawbridge attacked to a lever. UNDERGROUND RIVER AT FREEZING CLIMATES WOULD BE AWESOME! ICE TUNNELS FOR THE WIN!!!!!!!!

I'm going to have to make a mod for creatures found exclusively in caves in freezing bioms.

No underground ice.
IIRC IRL you got geothermal heat in real life. Not the vulcanic kind, well that too, but even if you
dig down in central Australia, you will find the surrounding rock getting hotter.
Not sure how/if Toady modelled has taken this into account.

Yea, I embarked at a glacier, and found no underground ice, just water and big mushrooms of various types, along with shrubs that made a great brew and some critters, but no ice.

Although I now strongly believe that it is possible to have a great fortress on a glacier, you just need to dig about 100 Z levels down.

[Nexii Malthus]

I hope Toady keeps this behaviour, it's a lot more fun, it takes work instead of being free lunch.

[PsyberianHusky]

I hope Toady keeps this behaviour, it's a lot more fun, it takes work instead of being free lunch.

I think this has been suggested before aswell,
i AM a fan of this

[Max White]

I hope it stays this way.

And after all, if your having trouble watching your crops, then I know a bunch of tree hugging hippies elves that might enjoy your company.

BE A MAN DWARF AND WATER YOUR ARMOK CONDEMNED CROPS!

[Alehkhs]

For me, it's a move back towards the farming system of the 2D version.

So: awesome!

[Areyar]

I'd like to propose a middleway:
Have farmer-dwarves water their plots/crops:
* using buckets of water,
* taken from the closest freshwater source (or well/designated watersource),
* plots need to either get [water] switch/settings like the [fertilize] one,
* or have crops automatically generate water-jobs for farmerdwarves.

[Misterstone]

Anyone who's played this game more than two years knows that having to irrigate the ground in order to grow crops on it is not a "new feature", it's a bug fix from the horrible situation that has persisted since the first z-level version was released: being able to grow food on dry sand with zero effort.

Real old-skool players know how to irrigate.

 

[Alehkhs]

Anyone who's played this game more than two years knows that having to irrigate the ground in order to grow crops on it is not a "new feature", it's a bug fix from the horrible situation that has persisted since the first z-level version was released: being able to grow food on dry sand with zero effort.

Real old-skool players know how to irrigate.

 

I remember following directions on farming in my very first fort, and being absolutely terrified that I'd end up flooding my whole fort...

[Interus]

Anyone who's played this game more than two years knows that having to irrigate the ground in order to grow crops on it is not a "new feature", it's a bug fix from the horrible situation that has persisted since the first z-level version was released: being able to grow food on dry sand with zero effort.

Real old-skool players know how to irrigate.

 

I remember following directions on farming in my very first fort, and being absolutely terrified that I'd end up flooding my whole fort...

I've only been playing since mid 2009 and I started freaking out as soon as I saw "No mud for underground farm" because I realized I was going to have to get water into my fortress.  I've built a flooding chamber for my farms now though, so I feel safe.  Just gotta get it opened up and get the windmills hooked up to the drying pumps.  Hopefully that happens before I run out of booze.

[StealthArcher]

Meh, *I* can take to it this way, but because I'm not a masochistic egotistical "ol-skuul" player, I can say it should go back to the way it was, if only for the fact we *do* still want new players coming, I'll just mod it back.



Also, say one word, one DAMN ****ING word about "intelligent" players and this BS, and you can go to hell, not everyone thinks having to restart 55 times to get something working is fun.

[Areyar]

farming is too easy even with the single-use megaprojects required to irrigate.

Maybe dwarves with buckets can only wet a single tile per trip, requiring numerous trips to water a small plot...but that seems too easy compared to true irrigation though.
I'd love to see farming require water continuously, or at least seasonally ...when it is not raining....so depending on dry/wetness of climate... local plants would grow best still, in dry locations those requiring more wetness would need extra.

The single irrigate/dry/build cycle is just not satisfactory, it needs Moah Complexifiering!  

Oooh!
Also 'rice paddies' of muckybulbs, growing only in a layer of 1/7 water all year round!

More also: mushrooms use a different type of fertilizer than plants (certain salts): manure and plant detritus, mushrooms actually create the nutrients plants need from this stuff.
If plants create detritus, dwarves could buy this from humans, turn it into humus in mushroom farms and sell it again to humans who use it to fertilize their surface crops and make prickleberries+detritus(vegitable).
I'd guess that evil mushrooms need detritus(animal) or even [blood]!

But this is all suggestion material, not actual farming experience.
I'm fed up with studying for today, I'm installing this artefact code.

[PsyberianHusky]

farming is too easy even with the single-use megaprojects required to irrigate.

Maybe dwarves with buckets can only wet a single tile per trip, requiring numerous trips to water a small plot...but that seems too easy compared to true irrigation though.
I'd love to see farming require water continuously, or at least seasonally ...when it is not raining....so depending on dry/wetness of climate... local plants would grow best still, in dry locations those requiring more wetness would need extra.

The single irrigate/dry/build cycle is just not satisfactory, it needs Moah Complexifiering!  

Oooh!
Also 'rice paddies' of muckybulbs, growing only in a layer of 1/7 water all year round!

More also: mushrooms use a different type of fertilizer than plants (certain salts): manure and plant detritus, mushrooms actually create the nutrients plants need from this stuff.
If plants create detritus, dwarves could buy this from humans, turn it into humus in mushroom farms and sell it again to humans who use it to fertilize their surface crops and make prickleberries+detritus(vegitable).
I'd guess that evil mushrooms need detritus(animal) or even [blood]!

But this is all suggestion material, not actual farming experience.
I'm fed up with studying for today, I'm installing this artefact code.

Well Dimple cups and the like are all fictional so some imagination could be used about the conditions needed to grow crops. I personally would like to see crops only grow-able by the light of magma.

[Alehkhs]

I can say it should go back to the way it was, if only for the fact we *do* still want new players coming

Yes... because the farming is the main barrier for new players... -_-

:P

[StealthArcher]

I can say it should go back to the way it was, if only for the fact we *do* still want new players coming

Yes... because the farming is the main barrier for new players... -_-

You cannot with any honesty say that this would *not* be, given your choices without murky pools are:

-Hey KIDS!  Dig into caverns and get bum rushed by 133 troglodytes! O_O

or

-Hey KIDS!  Flood your fortress and DIE!


Plus, mechanisms, are not a first for most people, given their complexity and taking time away from food and booze production.

[sluissa]

A small bucket irrigated farm is not a big deal to start with. I found out about this "bug" and was just "oh, okay." So, I dug a new set of farms one level deeper, right under the old farms, channeled a hole in the floor of the old farms and set it as a pond to fill. Watched it a bit to make sure they didnt' fill it too much and then stopped them when it was all muddy. Waited a bit for it to dry, then, viola, mud ready for the farming. With absolutely no chance of critically flooding your fort. (Unless you walked away for half an hour and didn't have doors on your farm rooms.

Really, I like this new system better than the old. I'm not opposed to making it optional, but I'd prefer not to have it taken away. (I would actually prefer something even a bit more complicated though, like someone suggested, maybe require seasonal irrigation, or maybe even more complicated. But I suppose that will come with time.)