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[Mephansteras]

If it does say anything at all why were so bothered about being 'accused of being scum'?

It's day two. We have limited information at this point, especially considering that this is vote mafia and there aren't any cops or reporters or other information gathering roles. So, all we have to go off of is who did what day one. You, Jim, and Org voted for ToonyMan, who we now know is scum. That makes you suspicious.

As to why I think only one scum jumped on the bandwagon? Because I've seen a lot of scum chats (I've run almost 20 games now, plus those games where I played and been scum or read the scum-chat afterwards). This is a very, very common day 1 tactic. One scum either starts or jumps on a bandwagon and the other specifically doesn't so that they can't be tied together. So I assume that one scum is part of the voting group and one in the non-voting group until I get information that indicates otherwise. It's right far more often than it is wrong.

It's not in-depth scum hunting, but it makes for a good start for day 2. Especially since I get to see people's reactions to the groupings. Like yours, where your first instinct seems to have been 'Oh, god, he thinks I'm scum! Attack him! Get him off me!'. Why? You didn't attack my strategy at first, you didn't have some other objection. Your reaction was 'He's saying I'm scum!'. Your defensiveness is a scum-tell, leaf, so I'd say my lists were pretty useful after all.

[Eduren]

Agreeing with town?
I guess that if you are scum you know they are town.

How dumb can you get?

[Jokerman-EXE]

You, Jim, and Org voted for ToonyMan, who we now know is scum. That makes you suspicious.

Uh, Toony was Town dude.

Toony? More like TOWNY. AMIRITEGAIZ?

Just sayin'.

[Mephansteras]

Eh, yeah, typo.

[ToonyMan]

Even confirmed I am called scum.

Also, dead chat please.

[Leafsnail]

Why would I feek even vaguely pressured by an "accusation" that seems to cover everyone?

Now, the reason I originally phrased my accusation as involving me was because I didn't feel any kind of pressure from you.  Again, there's no point in making a scumlist if those on the list are not at least asked questions.  Heck, you haven't even asked, say, "Why did you vote ToonyMan?".

You also seem to think that one off/ one on a wagon means they can't be tied together.  Well yes, they can - if distancing is too obvious, it will be picked up on.  And a decent scumplayer knows to switch between different tactics every few game.

[Mephansteras]

Why would I feek even vaguely pressured by an "accusation" that seems to cover everyone?

Now, the reason I originally phrased my accusation as involving me was because I didn't feel any kind of pressure from you.  Again, there's no point in making a scumlist if those on the list are not at least asked questions.  Heck, you haven't even asked, say, "Why did you vote ToonyMan?".

You also seem to think that one off/ one on a wagon means they can't be tied together.  Well yes, they can - if distancing is too obvious, it will be picked up on.  And a decent scumplayer knows to switch between different tactics every few game.

You keep misrepresenting what I'm saying. I never said that they can't be tied together, I said that the only information we have to go off of is what people have done in the thread. As in, no cop to figure out who's scum for us. And, yes, they could have switched tactics and both been on the bandwagon or both NOT voted for Toonyman. I just said that it's a very common tactic and a good place to start looking.

As for why I hadn't asked you any questions yet...I hadn't asked anyone anything except for Jim and that was because he'd been gone for most of day 1. You weren't high on my list of suspicions and I already stated that I had a busy weekend and hadn't had time to do much with this game. Hence a quick post with some initial suspicions.

You seem almost offended that I wasn't digging into you and asking you a bunch of questions. The only reason I can think that you'd feel so singled out is that you're scum and therefore know that you're special. You can't complain that I make a general post that includes everyone and object to me not asking you specifically questions at the same time. I wasn't treating you special, and the fact that you're doing your best to make me pay attention to you is really odd.

[Leafsnail]

Ok, it's a good place to start looking.  So why not, y'know, START LOOKING?

When I say "ask questions", I mean to ANYONE.  The question I said above could be to me/ Org/ Jim, and I'm sure you could find SOMETHING to ask someone.  As it is, you're admitting that your list has

no cop to figure out who's scum for us.

Which means you were just posting it for... what?  Decoration?  An attempt at active lurking?

[Mephansteras]

It was a place to start conversation, which it has done. As for actually looking, I'm going through the thread right now. I'll have stuff up soon.

[Mephansteras]

All right, managed to scrape up enough time during the work day to get a few things.

People I'm most suspicious of so far: Mr.Person, Jokerman-EXE, Leafsnail.

Mr.Person has been very careless this game with his votes. He admitted as much with his 3rd vote on Pandarsenic day one and today he's voting Leafsnail more because Toony was then because of any specific suspicions on Leafsnail. Moderate suspicion, since this kind of blase attitude is unusual for him regardless of alignment.

Jokerman-EXE - Very much a sideliner this game. He's only poked and prodded at people a little bit, has not once voted anyone due to actual suspicion. So far he has only voted to get people to talk or in today's case to test Eduren's Twin claim. Which is really odd, since he was already voting the Twin in the claim (Org) so the claim would already have been tested if a vote count could have shown it. He had no votes at all end of day 1, and is still on Eduren now (close to the end of the day). A very cautious scum trying to keep from drawing attention to himself, perhaps?

Leafsnail - Has been overly belligerent this game and seems quite willing to twist what people say in order to justify a vote against them. Your whole accusation for me so far has been based on a lack of time and part of post that was fairly general in scope. You seem to be happily glossing over the fact that the main thrust of that post was a response to Jim regarding my vote on him, not the division of the town for my scum theory. You also threatened to get Toony lynched yesterday, apparently in response to him [ulr=http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=51010.msg1119873#msg1119873]claiming that you're scum[/url]. You've been similarly defensive and reactionary with me this day, and even though you back-pedaled to say that you mean 'accusing anyone' instead of just you, it's pretty apparent that you're really unhappy with the idea of anyone voting you.

So, I'm going to keep my vote on Leafsnail and guess that Jokerman-EXE is the other scum. He's been more suspicious than Mr.Person so far, and highly unwilling to commit to lynching anyone. It's a fairly common problem for new scum, since they can't think of good reasons to vote people they know are town. Leafsnail goes for the kills and Joker tries to lurk his way to the end game.

[Eduren]

I don't know about Leafsnail. If I may devolve to meta for a moment, his scum meta usually includes more sidelining. He doesn't seem like scum right now but that is just a gut feeling, don't take it too seriously. If I end up needing to analyze him more, I will.

For now, I will vote Eduren(Org), because he is acting different. Usually, he doesn't make excuses for his lurking. Add in the weak accusations with no followup(which, I admit, is more like him) and I am getting suspicious.

[Jim Groovester]

You know what, this will be fun.

Unvote JTF.

Mr. Person.

[Org]

I don't know about Leafsnail. If I may devolve to meta for a moment, his scum meta usually includes more sidelining. He doesn't seem like scum right now but that is just a gut feeling, don't take it too seriously. If I end up needing to analyze him more, I will.

For now, I will vote Eduren(Org), because he is acting different. Usually, he doesn't make excuses for his lurking. Add in the weak accusations with no followup(which, I admit, is more like him) and I am getting suspicious.

I usually dont have rl problems either.
Weak accusation?
I admit, not heavy evidence, yours is pretty weak as well.

[Mr.Person]

@Eduren: So you're ok with Org lurking in one manner but not another?

@Meph: Oh no, I'm certain Leafsnail is scum. You are partially right, however. I'm totally clueless who the other scum is. I'm not too interested since I care more about Leafsnail. I can always reread tomorrow, but I am not letting Leafsnail get through my grasp.

FAKEDIT: Well, Jim's just trying to piss me off. Jim, what exactly have I done that's scummy? Interacted with Janus? I honestly have no clue why you're voting me.

[Eduren]

@Eduren: So you're ok with Org lurking in one manner but not another?

Never said what I was okay with, just that his behavior is out of the norm.

I don't know about Leafsnail. If I may devolve to meta for a moment, his scum meta usually includes more sidelining. He doesn't seem like scum right now but that is just a gut feeling, don't take it too seriously. If I end up needing to analyze him more, I will.

For now, I will vote Eduren(Org), because he is acting different. Usually, he doesn't make excuses for his lurking. Add in the weak accusations with no followup(which, I admit, is more like him) and I am getting suspicious.

I usually dont have rl problems either.
Weak accusation?
I admit, not heavy evidence, yours is pretty weak as well.

The "No followup" part is what strikes me. Since you are unwilling to pursue your suspicions, I'll help.
Is Mr.Person still scum? Why? If he is, then what are you doing sitting there and only defending yourself?