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[Dabi]

I was thinking about it, what if we had secret societies?

I mean an example could be:
Ukush has begun acting strangely...
Status: Ukush(Busy) - Making Ukush unable to preform his duties.

The results could be say...if a member is the hammerer and he's going to do his duties to another dwarf couldn't he just...not?

This would mean if a secret society had control over some important people. They have power.  They could have a fee to join, rituals etc and would start becoming wealthy...then buying out businesses and taking cuts in profit from stores etc.
Eventually the secret society if caught could be banned "Ukush's society of rich drunk dwarfs" has been outlawed. If anyone caught with symbols, etc in their rooms (I don't know...future patrols to look out for contraband in say bedrooms..) if caught, may be sentenced to jail for sometime.

I tried a search and couldn't find anything similar...or I didn't try hard enough?

[Footkerchief]

Various types of secret societies and other factions figure majorly in the dev notes:

# Core63, SUCCESSION, ASSOCIATED CONFLICTS AND SCHISMS, (Future): First of all, succession for positions needs to occur in play, so that dead liaisons are replaced, as well as dead monarchs. Then the process needs to be made messier all around. Wars over succession, schisms over religious disagreements, etc., starting from world gen and coming into regular play. In dwarf mode, you might be involved on one side or the other, directly or indirectly, relying on more involved diplomacy and army code than we currently have, and adventure mode can also gain a lot from such conflicts.

# Core71, BANDITS AND CULTS, (Future): It's important to have groups acting on their own or generally causing trouble without necessarily belonging to an entirely different civilization. Bandits and cults are good choices to start. Bandits could harass or make demands of an early fortress, cults could spring up in a later one, and the adventurer could end up a member or an adversary.

# Bloat305, GUILDS, (Future): Bring guild back more robustly as local and civ-wide organizations.

# Bloat344, RELIGIONS AND CULTS, (Future): Return of things like the death and weapon nobles via potentially world-wide religions and cults.

# PowerGoal107, ZOMBIE JUICE, (Future): The cultists go to the crossroads at night and collect dried blood from the outlaws that had been lynched. They cook it over a candle until they get addictive zombie juice, which eventually turns them into undead fiends. Once exposed, a cultist must drink the juice regularly or risk death.

Here are some Suggestions threads that have previously explored related topics:
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=34142.0
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=24804.0
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=25977.0
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=4414.msg61158#msg61158
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=36830.msg590931#msg590931
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=43768.msg977152#msg977152
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=3037.0
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=45882.msg904902#msg904902
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=47323.msg951670#msg951670
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=45090.0
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=37013.0
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=35940.0
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=23839.0

[Dabi]

Various types of secret societies and other factions figure majorly in the dev notes:

# Core63, SUCCESSION, ASSOCIATED CONFLICTS AND SCHISMS, (Future): First of all, succession for positions needs to occur in play, so that dead liaisons are replaced, as well as dead monarchs. Then the process needs to be made messier all around. Wars over succession, schisms over religious disagreements, etc., starting from world gen and coming into regular play. In dwarf mode, you might be involved on one side or the other, directly or indirectly, relying on more involved diplomacy and army code than we currently have, and adventure mode can also gain a lot from such conflicts.

# Core71, BANDITS AND CULTS, (Future): It's important to have groups acting on their own or generally causing trouble without necessarily belonging to an entirely different civilization. Bandits and cults are good choices to start. Bandits could harass or make demands of an early fortress, cults could spring up in a later one, and the adventurer could end up a member or an adversary.

# Bloat305, GUILDS, (Future): Bring guild back more robustly as local and civ-wide organizations.

# Bloat344, RELIGIONS AND CULTS, (Future): Return of things like the death and weapon nobles via potentially world-wide religions and cults.

# PowerGoal107, ZOMBIE JUICE, (Future): The cultists go to the crossroads at night and collect dried blood from the outlaws that had been lynched. They cook it over a candle until they get addictive zombie juice, which eventually turns them into undead fiends. Once exposed, a cultist must drink the juice regularly or risk death.

Here are some Suggestions threads that have previously explored related topics:
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=34142.0
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=24804.0
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=25977.0
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=4414.msg61158#msg61158
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=36830.msg590931#msg590931
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=43768.msg977152#msg977152
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=3037.0
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=45882.msg904902#msg904902
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=47323.msg951670#msg951670
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=45090.0
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=37013.0
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=35940.0
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=23839.0

Uhhh.....I guess it had something to do with the fact I was tired..but still I tried search terms and didn't find anything...
Anyway, thanks good to know its planned for..sorry to have to make you search for all that stuff.

[Footkerchief]

Nah don't worry about it.  It's hard to search for topics like this one unless you know the particular terms that people have used, like "cults," "guild," and "factions."  Besides, it gave me a reason to collect all those links in one place.

[wilsonns]

Various types of secret societies and other factions figure majorly in the dev notes:

# Core63, SUCCESSION, ASSOCIATED CONFLICTS AND SCHISMS, (Future): First of all, succession for positions needs to occur in play, so that dead liaisons are replaced, as well as dead monarchs. Then the process needs to be made messier all around. Wars over succession, schisms over religious disagreements, etc., starting from world gen and coming into regular play. In dwarf mode, you might be involved on one side or the other, directly or indirectly, relying on more involved diplomacy and army code than we currently have, and adventure mode can also gain a lot from such conflicts.

# Core71, BANDITS AND CULTS, (Future): It's important to have groups acting on their own or generally causing trouble without necessarily belonging to an entirely different civilization. Bandits and cults are good choices to start. Bandits could harass or make demands of an early fortress, cults could spring up in a later one, and the adventurer could end up a member or an adversary.

# Bloat305, GUILDS, (Future): Bring guild back more robustly as local and civ-wide organizations.

# Bloat344, RELIGIONS AND CULTS, (Future): Return of things like the death and weapon nobles via potentially world-wide religions and cults.

# PowerGoal107, ZOMBIE JUICE, (Future): The cultists go to the crossroads at night and collect dried blood from the outlaws that had been lynched. They cook it over a candle until they get addictive zombie juice, which eventually turns them into undead fiends. Once exposed, a cultist must drink the juice regularly or risk death.

Here are some Suggestions threads that have previously explored related topics:
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=34142.0
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=24804.0
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=25977.0
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=4414.msg61158#msg61158
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=36830.msg590931#msg590931
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=43768.msg977152#msg977152
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=3037.0
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=45882.msg904902#msg904902
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=47323.msg951670#msg951670
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=45090.0
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=37013.0
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=35940.0
http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=23839.0

You really look like the forum moderator...(Or like google)

[ungulateman]

Footkerchief is the forum's search engine given consciousness. He searched for your sins.

[Org]

Footkerchief, you should just really make a thread where you post links to ideas which have been talked about alot, and then let everyone help build it up.


:I

[Mel_Vixen]

better yet make it a wiki page of the df-wiki.

[Darkond2100]

try doing a search for Footkerchief, it's kinda funny sometimes.

[Euld]

More on the topic, a secret society could be a bit different than a guild or cult.  A guild being centered around a trade, a cult being centered around a new/offshoot religion, a secret society could be centered around, say, a political agenda.

[Dabi]

More on the topic, a secret society could be a bit different than a guild or cult.  A guild being centered around a trade, a cult being centered around a new/offshoot religion, a secret society could be centered around, say, a political agenda.

Yeah, i had the idea a secret society is..well more organised I'd say than a cult(Not to say that a cult cant be organised...but i'd say the secret society is more involved)
Where as a cult could be looking towards banning all dwarfs with a odd attribute...A secret society would be gearing towards say, control of the dwarven population...like how I think i mentioned if they had members in power or some sort of non-civilian job then that's more power towards them...eventually leading down the path of ultimate control...(Don't know how that would play out.)

[Mel_Vixen]

But wouldnt guilds cults and sercret societies work under the same framework? Thus the goals and causes might be different but the mechanic should stay the same.

[Darkond2100]

Guilds would be very public and economically based, power for the peons! Cults would do things frowned upon by Dwarven society; things like worshiping trees, hating glass, and throwing up every time they enter a subterranean tile (I don't like the Ku Klux Klan, but I must sat that it WAS a religion, and not a cult). Secret societies just like to keep secrets; they'll make sure that the Legendary Artifact Adamantine Sword that was just created doesn't come to your attention, keeping the death of a Fortress Gaurd quiet.

[The Bismuth]

A specific question that relates to secret societies is just how they are revealed to the player. Something tells me that a line in a dwarves biog saying: "Urist McEvilcultist likes platinum nuggets, shields and ponies for their flowing manes. He is a secret member of the Dark Rebellion of Devils." would not cut it.

What I have in my mind is a fairly Hammer Horror approach. Arcane symbols are found in a forgotten corner of the keep. Someone's pet goes missing, only to turn up later found crucified in a five cornered star. The mayor summons a Witchfinder General to uncover these dark dealings. The dwarves are as frightened of him as they are of the cultusts... I could go on.

Is this subtle enough? Is there another way you could do this which would still give the player enough clues as to what is going on?

[Mel_Vixen]

I think too detecting a cult a secret society should be something that dwarfes itself should do which in turn hint/prompt it to you.