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[The Architect]

Ok, an oldie but a goodie here, one of 2008's best, Dead Space!

Any fans out there? If you haven't played this game, you need to go out right now and rent it or buy it. It's something you can have in your library just to goof off on or for the sake of showing your good taste, like the original Bioshock. However, you can get everything out of it in a few days of rental.

This thread is going to be chock-full of spoilers, and if you haven't played the game then I recommend you leave now and play it while knowing nothing. Even knowing the basic game mechanics will ruin half the fun for you. I'm playing this for the 3rd time, and only now did I realize the absolute depth of detail in this game! I want to brag on it, and to analyse it in detail.

So, my second time through (Impossible, Plasma Cutter / Line Gun / Force Gun / Contact Beam) I noticed that while things are surprising and so detailed and varied that some events seem randomized, every single event in the game is actually scripted. The only exceptions are a few spawns that only occur when you visit certain areas (mainly stores) at very specific points in the timeline.

Everything from the monsters' appearances, entry points and times, and even relative value of their drops is scripted. Some variance will occur with some of these due to the game's AI. I actually find this level of detailed attention, with every factor from the exact movements and noises down to the timing and triggers preset, to be beautiful. They literally experimentally fine-tuned every single moment in the game to be as unsettling and frightening as humanly possible. They used every cliche'd trick in the horror book, and they did it so perfectly that it's possibly the scariest game ever made and no one seems to find fault with it on any level.

Next, the physics. The physics are excellent. They made only two sacrifices to realism, and both are interrelated and necessary for smooth game play. 1, everything movable except certain scripted objects gives way to Isaac Clark as if it's made of styrofoam. 2, monsters grip surfaces like they have superglue-strong bonds until they die, at which point they become much like any other movable object. The fact that everything weighs almost nothing means you won't be doing much damage by slinging large objects at creatures, sadly. You CAN pull yourself off into freefall in zero-g environments by goofing up your Stasis/Kinesis and overloading the safety measures built into the overly-realistic physics engine, though.

More physics: The weapons. Ok, there's one goofy thing where limbs that could take huge damage during life are severed instantly and easily after death. Otherwise, the weapons' interactions with the environment are stellar in every way. The Force Gun, which is difficult to use and often considered buggy, is actually a triumph of vision and detailed realism. It actually creates a concussive blast by compressing air about a foot away from the gun and releasing it (mostly forward). If the monsters are on your side of it, they get bumped into you (resulting in the OMGWTF!? moments often suffered while using the Force Gun). If they're a little off to the side of the compression, they take small damage and are flung away from it sideways. If slightly on the far side (taking the full blast), they're blown to itsy bitsies, if too far away or dead center, only knocked down with less damage. Contact Beam should have been modified to be just as deadly against center-of-mass as against limbs; it seems silly that blasting something in the chest with a gigantic laser cutter does less damage than shooting off one of its legs with it (2 chest shots in Impossible, 1 leg shot).

The Flamethrower is included for all those who insist on it with every zombie (erm, Necromorph) video game release, but its damage is realistically portrayed and it's near-useless. That's the way to be completionists and stick it to everyone who wants to burn scorchproof aliens!

Ripper: wow, another beautiful original addition from the same people who rewrote the book on the futuristic shotgun and slung a grenade launcher on it (orgasming over the Force Gun again). A kinesis- or magnetism-projected rotating saw blade... they may have shown the Flamethrower for the weak piece of nothing it really was, but at the same time they introduced a new weapon to take over the flamer slot and outshine it in every way!

The Line Gun and Plasma Cutter... don't you want these in every zombie game you play? Can you imagine storming through L4D with a Plasma Cutter or abusing the Line Gun's mines and dismemberment?

Pulse Rifle / Contact Beam, well-done reincarnations of classic weapon functions with futuristic twists and secondary fire modes to make them unique, interesting and more useful.

More to come if people are as interested in the game as I am. I'd love to hear what other people think of the weapons and features, and I've figured out all kinds of things about the plot. The origins of the whispers, chanting and singing, the meaning of all of the acronymns, the true nature of Nichole...

[Sir Pseudonymous]

Terrible. Terrible premise, terrible controls, terribly inefficient graphics, just all around terrible. Bioshock was horrible well, not horrible, but mediocre at best, and overrated too, though it didn't suffer from bad controls or absurdly inefficient graphics like dead space.

[Choose username]

Terrible. Terrible premise, terrible controls, terribly inefficient graphics, just all around terrible. Bioshock was horrible well, not horrible, but mediocre at best, and overrated too, though it didn't suffer from bad controls or absurdly inefficient graphics like dead space.

I bet you play a lot of fun games.

[Cthulhu]

Man, I want to know what games you play, Pseudonymous.  If you think Bioshock and Dead Space are terrible you must be playing some mindblowingly awesome games.

And don't say Dwarf Fortress.  That's a cop-out.

[buckets]

Truly an awesome game, scary as all hell.

Plus, spinning blade cannon.

[Micro102]

Weapons were fun(Good), atmosphere was spooky(Good), battle sucked(Bad).

You died too easily, it was too hard to heal, Controls were a little bulky, became very uncomfortable at close range. I quit around half way.

[Charmander]

I got this for my dad for Christmas. He sucked at it, but he certainly enjoyed it. I picked it up for him given how much he liked Resident Evil 5.

I might have to give it a try, as well.

Even if I have to sit close to the TV because my eyes are that bad at detail.

[The Architect]

Terrible. Terrible premise, terrible controls, terribly inefficient graphics, just all around terrible. Bioshock was horrible well, not horrible, but mediocre at best, and overrated too, though it didn't suffer from bad controls or absurdly inefficient graphics like dead space.

"Inefficient graphics"? Really, what are you even trying to say? Your unqualified forum-ninja superior-minded bullshit is shameful. You're the same kind of person who gives DF players a bad name for being elitist, going to other forums and downing good games because to your mind if it's popular, that can't be because it has merit. The game's an easy 10/10 in everything you described.

Weapons were fun(Good), atmosphere was spooky(Good), battle sucked(Bad).

You died too easily, it was too hard to heal, Controls were a little bulky, became very uncomfortable at close range. I quit around half way.

Really, if you complain that it's too difficult or that the controls are poor, I pity you because you didn't understand the game.

The controls are some of the best. They're not designed for a run-and-gun, because that's not what this game is. You are supposed to take your time, enjoy the great graphics and atmosphere, and see all of the minute detail put into every room and hallway in the game. The controls only become "clunky" if you try to play it like Halo. If you're dying, it's because you are charging around corners and into piles of spawn, spraying ammo all over the place and spamming the heal button like you have unlimited resources and missing half of the game and resources because you blow through to the objectives like it's a race to the finish. A big part of the game is creeping around that corner while the music mounts and the creepy-ass shadows flicker, then trying to knock down the charging necromorph in front of you without wasting all of your ammo before the one behind you can slice you in half.

The game rewards the curious, and is designed at every step to force you to slow down and play it for itself, not like all you want to do is get it over before the rental runs out. If you pay for a game, you ought to stop trying to charge through and enjoy it. The only people who complained about this game are the same people who were too jaded to get a scare out of it, and went through the whole game with their fingers on the Run button in 6 hours.

An experienced player on Impossible takes about 10 hours to go through, using the most powerful weapons and techniques like stasis+mines. You have to stop, look around, admire the gory (or sometimes beautiful) scenery, and the gorgeous detail. This game was as lovingly crafted or more so than DF.

I got this for my dad for Christmas. He sucked at it, but he certainly enjoyed it. I picked it up for him given how much he liked Resident Evil 5.

I might have to give it a try, as well.

Even if I have to sit close to the TV because my eyes are that bad at detail.

I suggest you don't read my spoilers; most of the fun in the game is not knowing ANYTHING about it. I seriously doubt I will enjoy Dead Space 2 half as much unless they totally revamp all of the mechanics and weapons.

[Micro102]

O trust me i took my time because I expected things to come from all directions and the ceiling at all times. I tried avoiding close combat at all costs. And maybe it was because i was on the Xbox version but it was hard to run away from those things. Maybe i should of turned up the turn speed.

[The Architect]

You can't change the controls. By all reports, they worked hard to save people from themselves. A lot of people just try to run through games that are designed to be an experience of mental, visual, and auditory stimulation, and they wanted to prevent people from missing the experience of being Isaac by playing it like some kind of FPS. What difficulty did you try? Hard can be rough, especially at the beginning before upgrading your weapons. If you take another shot I recommend either Easy with only the Plasma Cutter (it's a great weapon, and there's an achievement for beating the game with it) or a higher difficulty while abusing Stasis (free, frequent recharges early on) and Line Gun mines to save ammo so you can afford to upgrade.

Up mines, then stasis, and finally other weapons/rig. You have to be very smart with your resources in this game; for instance you don't want to waste nodes upgrading the Line Gun's primary fire attributes because the ammo is just too expensive to waste that way. It's also much cheaper on Impossible to use a little extra ammo for a quick kill than to take a hit and have to buy/use health packs. This game forces you to be smart or die, unless you're on Easy or Normal.

The turn speed is realistic; it's all timed and carefully trimmed to make things edgy and prevent you from acting like Master Chief. Not that I don't love Halo, but it bothers me that so many people play games like Call of Duty and complain that they don't have the mechanics of their other favorite shooter. You're quite a badass, but you're still human in this game, wearing a heavy armored EVA-capable rig with a ton of storage, and it gives you credit for practically being a professional athlete/body builder as it is.

[Sir Pseudonymous]

Man, I want to know what games you play, Pseudonymous.  If you think Bioshock and Dead Space are terrible you must be playing some mindblowingly awesome games.

And don't say Dwarf Fortress.  That's a cop-out.

Bioshock wasn't terrible. It was just mediocre and extremely overrated. Still moderately enjoyable, but mediocre nonetheless.

Dead Space, on the other hand, was mindblowingly horrible. This was a game I played after hearing endless sycophantic praise of how awesome it was, expecting it to be good, and trying to enjoy it. Several times, in fact, even going so far as reinstalling it and trying it again several months after I first played it.

Terrible. Terrible premise, terrible controls, terribly inefficient graphics, just all around terrible. Bioshock was horrible well, not horrible, but mediocre at best, and overrated too, though it didn't suffer from bad controls or absurdly inefficient graphics like dead space.

"Inefficient graphics"? Really, what are you even trying to say? Your unqualified forum-ninja superior-minded bullshit is shameful. You're the same kind of person who gives DF players a bad name for being elitist, going to other forums and downing good games because to your mind if it's popular, that can't be because it has merit. The game's an easy 10/10 in everything you described.

Alright, so the premise isn't "terrible", but that was required to get the repetition there. The premise was bland and unimaginative, but the same can be said for many games, some of which happen to be fairly good. It's just not a plus for the game, though not bad enough to be a real negative. Actually, not a single exception to that comes to mind, even games that are quite good...

The controls are horrible. There's no getting around that. Dismembering undead aliens sounds great and all, but the jerky, awkward controls kind of fuck that all to hell.

I say "inefficient graphics", because running on a machine that handles other games, which have much better graphics, on mid-to-high settings, dead space barely chugs along at a playable rate on the lowest graphic settings (which leave it looking like claymation, by the way...). Now, is that highly machine dependent? Of course, but it's still a rather glaring black mark against them, that they cannot even get it to where it's playable on the lowest settings on something that can handle, say, ME2 without problems (that may not be the best example, because ME2 happened to be very good in that regard, but still).

So... yeah.

[Cthulhu]

That's weird because my computer is pretty low-middle end, and I could run the game on maximum settings with nary a hiccup.

[Ivefan]

Dead space started out good but turned into an action slaughterfest fps, with music announcing the appearances of any foes, which was for me the least appealing aspect of the game.
The plot/story was stolen from System shock 2, given a paintjob and a new licence plate so they wont get hit by plagiarism. But i guess that's what made it good because SS2 was great.

...the experience of being Isaac

You mean the mute character we're playing that does not feel like it's an individual? The parts with his lover that was there to make us feel something for isaac was rather predictable and felt rather forced, thus having a counter effect on me atleast.
Have a look at yatzee's review on Dead space. He brings up some good points though i still think the game is good.

All in all, the game is better than most other games released nowadays, but the quality of those games varies from 'dungpile divers' to 'waste some time then forget'.

On bioshock 1&2; A bad FPS with a plot interessting enough to play it through once.
And why does everyone leave tape recorders everywhere. >_<

[The Architect]

You played it on a computer that couldn't handle it? No wonder you're complaining. It wasn't designed for a computer, it was designed for the 360. The computer port was a nod to people who didn't have the system but still wanted to play the game.

You don't have the right to complain about the game just because you didn't have the system to play and appreciate it. The controls are not bad, honestly. In all honesty, it's the truth. The only limitation is what I said: You can't pretend to be superman in this; you have to take your time. And you will be overwhelmed at times by enemies; that is part of the game.

I didn't think the premise was very good at all, actually. I agree with you there; it was a little unconvincing. However, the plot development and attention to detail at every single point in the game and in every single aspect is just mind-boggling. The hand-drawn wallpaper that is in a translatable alien alphabet (there's a key to it in the game), the lack of repeating textures that show up in every other game I've ever seen (They even designed a whole new environment look for the ship that crash-lands, which is only used for one level!), the way there isn't a single flaw in the plot or characters (Kendra even says "we can contact the USM Valor" before you know there's a military ship out there)...

The list goes on. If you were playing a game intended for consoles with a mouse and keyboard, of course it was clunky. It probably also just sucked because you didn't have a TV screen and surround sound to enjoy it on. The game absolutely demands a surround sound system, and the HD includes things like flies and lettering that you would never be able to see on a normal-sized computer screen.

To brag on the plot even more, it covers every single aspect from why the infection could overpower technologically advanced humans and how it began to why you are repairing nearly everything in the ship, if you care to pay attention. The premise is a poor cookie-cutter scifi take on government alien coverups, but the thrills and frights all use the biggest cliches in horror history. They don't miss a one. The reason this game is considered one of the greatest masterpieces ever made is that it does everything perfectly, from the flawless plot development to the exact implementation of every scare tactic and the fantastic visuals (ever actually stop in the external zero-g and view the correctly-modeled debris fields and the gorgeous view of the cracked planet?)

There's no fault to be found with this game. The fault is with how you played it, and were unable to enjoy it properly. If you find yourself disliking something that is universally considered unimpeachible, it's time to do a double-take. Bioshock was an experience, and a graphical masterpiece. Its controls were less than optimal and its gameplay was somewhat repetitive and static. Its plot was well-carried by the borrowed gimic of logs and the sheer spectacle of its environment and certain plot elements/twists; if Dead Space was a 10 then Bioshock was a 7.5 to an 8.

Having someone talk something up to you can sometimes ruin the experience. But it's important to take a careful look at something for what it actually is before you charge into it. Dead Space deserves to be played in complete ignorance and in the dark with a couple of friends or even alone. Knowing even a little will ruin the atmosphere for you, which is why the publishers advertised it the way it is. It's a survival thriller with horror elements; you have to play it as one. If you don't get kicks from that kind of experience then you won't enjoy it, you'll just be scared (or bored if you are completely jaded).

Isaac doesn't have a personality, that's intentional. It's much deeper than that. Isaac is you, which is why he doesn't speak. The parts with the chick were to tell you what motivates him, not to force you to feel empathy. I'm sorry, but you missed the point. Yes, music often announced the enemies but that is because it was part of the buildup. Didn't you read where I said they used every horror cliche? What sets it apart is that it was flawlessly implemented.

Then there's the thriller part. You are supposed to die periodically, and there's nil penalty for it. You get to enjoy his gory, creative and often horrifying death scenes, and then whether you've saved or not you are back at the last doorway.

[Micro102]

Well that's your opinion, but i found other games (like Bioshock) to be better. That "heavy armor" slowed you down way to much for the protection it gave.

And if i recall correctly, you could not grind so whatever you bought with the limited money you could get you were stuck with unless you wanted to sell stuff back at a discount to buy worse stuff then you had before.