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Author Topic: Mount and Blade  (Read 655964 times)

Robsoie

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #3465 on: June 30, 2014, 05:52:08 pm »

On Gekokujo, as i'm playing with a female character (usually have it harder than males regarding vassalization) trying to gain some points with the Hojo great lord to accept me, i convinced a lord i had good enough relationship to follow me and i went to besiege a castle of the Satake clan, it had a bit more than 200 defenders, while with my ally we roughly had +/-100 troopers.

We got destroyed, but wow that  Utsunomiya castle siege scene was really awesome, multiple areas to cross with each having defenses to contain the attacker, probably one of the most fun siege i ever had in the game.

So if you play Gekokujo, don't hesitate to go besieging Utsunomiya castle from the Satake clan.
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Cheedows

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #3466 on: June 30, 2014, 06:24:10 pm »

True, you can argue that. But party size can also be increased with renown, which can be easily grinded. Using your companions means that you are missing out on unkillable, monstrous custom killing machines and relying on your companions not getting shot in the face during a battle. If a battle goes awry, you can be potentially crippled for a week and lose your entire army. I can ensure my own welfare far better than that of an AI companion. Eh, different strategies are what make M&B a wonderful game.

How do you grind your renown? Because AFAIK it's mostly fighting armies larger than your own, which... kinda goes against the entire point of the exercise.

Also, double companions per skill.

INT points, for me, are way too often just redundant and useless.

The unkillableness of companions is not much of a factor with my playstyle, because I tend to have absurd-level Surgery, effectively making 90% of my army unkillable, and I really hate micro-managing my companions upgrades and spending a zillion denars on making their gear not hoover anuses.

Plus, the losing your entire army aspect is fairly null and void if you can raise and train the whole army back into shape in a week.

You kinda need a zillion denars to train up and maintain a 120 strong man army, and as you say retrain you still gotta pay for all those. Completely ignoring training renown makes it extremely hard to maintain your own kingdom and get good lords you like.
You might also have forgotten that completely losing a battle makes you lose most if not ALL of your companions, good luck finding the idiots again. I can agree that once you are off your feet and in a relatively stable position with the right companion match ups then it would work, but it requires loads of micromanagement to find, level and keep them. Also, you can tell me that it is null and void when within that week you lose 2-3 castles, which is entirely possible.

I completely disagree with the notion that you lose your killing ability by focusing Int. Str/Agi don't really give that much benefit, since I can easily get 1 hit kills with 8 Str and 10 Agi with a Charger/Lance, or any other quick 1 handed weapon. Sure, you might be a bit faster or have that much more healthpoints, but that can be easily fixed with armour and effective blocking. In a siege, a siege crossbow with steel bolts will slaughter anyone, period. I can negate the loss in skills and attributes with the right weapons and weapon proficiencies.     
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EuchreJack

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #3467 on: June 30, 2014, 07:56:48 pm »

Oh hey, I remember getting like 20 renown a fight when I tried soloing.  Rode circles around Sea Raiders, mostly avoiding their hurled crap, while trying to peg them through their shields with a bow.  That was fun, by which I mean a nightmare.

Doable at a fairly low level with scavenged gear, though!  At least, IIRC.  I think I had my damage at the default 1/4 at that point, however.  (I play at full damage to me and allies now, which is similarly nightmarish)

You can do the same solo-pillaging villages.  Kill those hordes of peasants yourself!  Laugh as they feebly try to catch up with your horsey!

EnigmaticHat

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #3468 on: June 30, 2014, 08:05:13 pm »

You might also have forgotten that completely losing a battle makes you lose most if not ALL of your companions, good luck finding the idiots again.
Travelers will tell you where your companions are for 30 denars, and the companions don't move without player input.
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Cheedows

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #3469 on: June 30, 2014, 08:18:36 pm »

They might be (in my case) always deep into enemy territory. Meaning I might have to fight through several battles without my prime combat medics, constantly losing men and taking casualties. Eh, I just don't like trusting my companions with those vital roles when you can lose them so easily.
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SalmonGod

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #3470 on: June 30, 2014, 08:53:37 pm »

I completely disagree with the notion that you lose your killing ability by focusing Int. Str/Agi don't really give that much benefit, since I can easily get 1 hit kills with 8 Str and 10 Agi with a Charger/Lance, or any other quick 1 handed weapon. Sure, you might be a bit faster or have that much more healthpoints, but that can be easily fixed with armour and effective blocking. In a siege, a siege crossbow with steel bolts will slaughter anyone, period. I can negate the loss in skills and attributes with the right weapons and weapon proficiencies.   

But if you train up an actual bow, you can mow people on the siege ladder down so quickly that the infantry defending it barely need to do any work.
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Micro102

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #3471 on: July 01, 2014, 12:26:09 am »

The important parts of INT can be completely covered by companions. Have a focused healer and a focused tracker and suddenly specializing in INT is useless. If you spec in INT then those 2 companions you had would instead be made into warriors. Horribly inefficient warriors. You'd basically have another knight. Now switch it around. Those 2 companions are now a doctor and tracker/pathfinder/spotter, and you are the fully armored death machine. I don't think anyone here would argue that you aren't 10 times more efficient than those 2 would-be knights.

As for siege crossbows, shields and ammo limits will take you out of the game before you "slaughter" the enemy. I can kill just as well with a great bow and then continue to stand in front of the ladder being a titan and refusing to let the enemy past.

The only benefit to focusing on INT is that you don't need companions. That's it. It's an early game advantage, where you need it the least.
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BFEL

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #3472 on: July 01, 2014, 06:37:19 am »

Considering how long it takes to level companions to a level of decent skill having, I don't think I have ever left the early game ever. Because apparently the early game ends around 40 billion hours.
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SalmonGod

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #3473 on: July 01, 2014, 06:40:31 am »

As for siege crossbows, shields and ammo limits will take you out of the game before you "slaughter" the enemy. I can kill just as well with a great bow and then continue to stand in front of the ladder being a titan and refusing to let the enemy past.

Or just continually pick up arrows stuck to the battlements, or the quivers of other archers fallen right next to you.  Shouldn't run out of arrows until near the end of the battle.
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In the land of twilight, under the moon
We dance for the idiots
As the end will come so soon
In the land of twilight

Maybe people should love for the sake of loving, and not with all of these optimization conditions.

scrdest

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #3474 on: July 01, 2014, 06:44:40 am »

Considering how long it takes to level companions to a level of decent skill having, I don't think I have ever left the early game ever. Because apparently the early game ends around 40 billion hours.

Benchmark: early game ends when you get a fief, midgame ends when you strike out on your own, lategame ends at you being The Glorious Benevolent High Kinglord Overlord of the People's Republic of Every Fucking Where.
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Cheedows

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #3475 on: July 01, 2014, 10:09:07 am »

The important parts of INT can be completely covered by companions. Have a focused healer and a focused tracker and suddenly specializing in INT is useless. If you spec in INT then those 2 companions you had would instead be made into warriors. Horribly inefficient warriors. You'd basically have another knight. Now switch it around. Those 2 companions are now a doctor and tracker/pathfinder/spotter, and you are the fully armored death machine. I don't think anyone here would argue that you aren't 10 times more efficient than those 2 would-be knights.

As for siege crossbows, shields and ammo limits will take you out of the game before you "slaughter" the enemy. I can kill just as well with a great bow and then continue to stand in front of the ladder being a titan and refusing to let the enemy past.

The only benefit to focusing on INT is that you don't need companions. That's it. It's an early game advantage, where you need it the least.

That is assuming that I can train my companions as well as myself, who is soloing entire parties, doing quests, and getting loads of kills. I can probably reach the midgame on the same footing, but this time my army is already fully immortal rather than waiting for 4-8 other idiots who barely do any killing to get to a decent level to make a difference. By midgame, I can probably be from Level 15-20, who has focused on Int from the start and can well cover any of the roles my slow-levelling companions can do, maybe using a few books on the way.  Also, you do know in a siege I can just grab a board/huscarl shield, wait till they run out of ammo, and just grab more bolts from my inventory box? I am not saying I will kill better, but calling someone who specializes in Int useless in combat is an outrageous statement.     
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Sharp

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #3476 on: July 01, 2014, 01:55:00 pm »

I quite like Silverstag, very interesting with it's recruitment which means less grinding on militia to be end-game god units and more on just buying what you can afford and getting a well balanced army although it does make the trainer skill much less useful. I've yet to put a lot of time into it yet but it's looking good so far, looks like it's even possible to live like a bandit, at least more then most other mods/native.
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EnigmaticHat

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #3477 on: July 01, 2014, 04:08:41 pm »

Maybe I just take forever (what time did you guys reach midgame on your first playthrough?) but I got 4 points in training and Jeresmus, my first companion, is like 2 levels behind me.  And I left him with his default gear because I like the look, so I know he hasn't been racking up the kills.
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"T-take this non-euclidean geometry, h-humanity-baka. I m-made it, but not because I l-li-l-like you or anything! I just felt s-sorry for you, b-baka."
You misspelled seance.  Are possessing Draignean?  Are you actually a ghost in the shell? You have to tell us if you are, that's the rule

scrdest

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #3478 on: July 01, 2014, 04:32:09 pm »

Oh yeah, I probably should mention that The Deluge, a really great multiplayer mod has been revived with the latest patch.
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Urist McScoopbeard

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #3479 on: July 01, 2014, 04:44:27 pm »

Oh yeah, I probably should mention that The Deluge, a really great multiplayer mod has been revived with the latest patch.

Really? nice. The teamwork involved in the old deluge was sooooo fun
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This conversation is getting disturbing fast, disturbingly erotic.
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