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Author Topic: Mount and Blade  (Read 664970 times)

Paul

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #2625 on: November 23, 2012, 11:26:46 am »

The realistic casualties code in Brytenwalda is funny. It does things so strange.

Effectively what it does is this:

IF $g_realistic_casualties is 1 (OFF) it takes 1/3 of the enemy troops killed and sets them as wounded in the total enemy casualties instead so you get them as prisoners if you win the fight. If you lose the fight the enemies are still dead, since it only healed them in the casualty list that's used for prisoners.

IF $g_realistic_casualties is 0 (ON) it takes 1/3 of ALL troops killed, including your own, and tries to heal equivalent troops in the enemy casualties. So if I have 75 aillts killed in my own party and the enemy has 25 killed aillts in their party, their 25 aillts will be miraculously revived as a prisoner just because my guys died. I guess my surgeons are taking body parts from my guys to patch up the enemy troops and keep them as prisoners. ;D

I was wondering why I got so many prisoners when fighting other Britons with my Briton troops, and so much less when fighting other factions.


Stuff like this is why I like digging into other people's code. Coding mistakes can be so entertaining.
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Catastrophic lolcats

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #2626 on: November 23, 2012, 11:31:18 am »

Might not be a mistake. The Brytenwalda devs have a very strange understanding of the concept of balance. It's a great mod don't get me wrong but it's just so punishing, unforgiving and most importantly not bloody fair.
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Robsoie

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #2627 on: November 23, 2012, 11:57:30 am »

If M&B was anything realistic regarding the populations, the game would be rather short lived.

Looking at how small each cities are and how villages have so few people living there, if it was realistic you couldn't recruit much soldiers from those locations in your army, and neither the various lords could considering the population is so small on the whole game world.

So after a few battles in those regular wars, the weapon wielding-able population would be seriously depleted, leading you to wait lot of ingame years so babies (assuming there are still women alive) can grow up and be recruited into someone's army (lucky that lords and player are immortals or there would be none to recruit them considering how much time everyone can die in battle :D ).
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Paul

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #2628 on: November 23, 2012, 12:03:22 pm »

I'm making my own little submod of Brytenwalda, thinking I'll release it once I have things changed around to how I like them.

Mostly fixing errors and changing some aspects I didn't like. Thinking I might try troop and equipment balancing a bit too maybe.

What I've done so far (since I started day before yesterday):

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

I love the mod and the setting, it's just a bit frustrating sometimes as is, like you said heh heh.
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Catastrophic lolcats

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #2629 on: November 23, 2012, 12:09:27 pm »

I'd be interested in that submod when you've finished it. Love Brytenwalda but it's just such a hassle to get into it.
It's a shame they couldn't integrate the levy system out of Blue Blood, it would have been exactly what they were trying to portray instead of all the crazy work-arounds they had to use for the vanilla system.
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Rakonas

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #2630 on: November 23, 2012, 03:56:38 pm »

I would absolutely love to see improvements on brytenwalda, especially in terms of fairness.
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Paul

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #2631 on: November 24, 2012, 12:51:58 am »

Here's what I have so far.

Lots of little changes.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Haven't had a chance to really dig into it yet to see if I want to change more things, so I might make a new version of it later. Everything works, and in my minimal testing the sword wielding troops do a bit better against the axe wielding troops. But it's hard to really determine balance with the way their equipment is so random - one axe wielding guy might drop in one sword slash to the head because he's wearing a cloak instead of a helmet, while another shrugs it off because he has a helmet and kills the sword guy.

It's not fully save compatible (definitely not save compatible with the "unofficial patch" heh, that thing is rather buggy for a patch - it has a duplicate troop that throws things off and at least some of the fixes it says it fixed aren't actually fixed, never could find any issue with land income that it claims to fix). Might be mostly compatible with the base version though, I *think* warband actually updates regular troops straight from the files every launch - so you'd probably only miss out on the hero and lord changes.

Download here: https://docs.google.com/uc?export=download&id=0Bw4jSI5meNgsTTIzeFpwSjhqQnM

If anyone had suggestions of something they wanted to see changed in Brytenwalda feel free to say so, I might agree with you and do it  ;D
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Micro102

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #2632 on: November 24, 2012, 01:10:45 am »

I want something changed in M&B in general. In the arena, people can gang up on you. They will target you, run next to everyone else and focus only on you. And they don't stop until you are dead. If they swing their weapon, they don't hurt other enemies even if it collides with them.

Also, in Brytenwalda, why the hell can some troops back peddle faster uphill then some can run forward downhill?!?!?!?! Completely unrealistic.
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Catastrophic lolcats

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #2633 on: November 24, 2012, 01:18:52 am »

From the top of my head.
  • I'd like to see the troop levels reduced across the board. In the standard mod it was near impossible to train them since you have to be a higher level for the "trainer" skill to kick in. Made companions with the training skill useless as well.
  • The Salt Mine needs work (might be outside your scope of the micromod) but right now it's completely useless and only serves to demoralise your troops.
  • Heavy armour penalty might need a nerf. Using heavy armour would completely gimp your offensive capabilities. More medium armours?
  • Spears might need a buff across the board. It's mainly a native issue with units "hugging" you that causes spears to be useless however if they have an attack buff so a good stab could take down units quickly they might be much more useful. Napoleonic Wars did this really well with the bayonets. Remove swinging with pointed spears and just allow them to stab.
  • Throwing weapons might need their ammunition buffed, some of the throwing spears only spawned in stacks of 1 which were useless in battle (decent for a troop volley). More bows and improved archery is something I'd like to see, strange Briton Bowmen are completely useless.
« Last Edit: November 24, 2012, 01:28:22 am by Catastrophic lolcats »
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Paul

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #2634 on: November 24, 2012, 07:56:38 pm »

Not sure about the troop levels. That would be a pretty major change and would affect a lot of things - I kind of like them being high level anyway, that way the player needs more experience before he can train troops. And trainer skill isn't useless on companions, you just have to level them way up first. In my game that I stopped playing when I started modding it I had my guys up to level 20 so that they could train tier 1 and 2 troops.

The salt mine definitely needed work. That thing was a mess. I rewrote the code for it and changed the menu so that you only lose morale if you go to the transfer troops menu to drop guards off there (the same way you lose honor if you go to drop off prisoners). It should actually be profitable to set up an operation there now.

I made some of the heavy armors medium (the frankish armor). I kind of like the heavy armor penalty too - all the troops are affected by it, so it's not just a player penalty. Fatigue system might need to be a bit more forgiving for heavy stuff though, trying to walk in a full kit of heavy armor doesn't work out so well - you might make it half way across the battle map before you drop. I've never actually looked at the fatigue system, but it only affects the player - and then only really if you're running around on foot. I just turned it off in my last game, since I felt encouraging players to use horses even more than M&B normally does was bad. If it affected npcs too it might be cool, although watching the enemy troops fall over and stand there unable to swing after chasing you around for a bit would be silly (and provide an even bigger advantage to mounted troops, lol).

Spears seem to do OK, their longer reach helps troops fighting in groups since they can often stab around the guy in front of them. And the pierce goes right through armor. Most of them do more damage on a thrust than the axes now, and they get a special bonus for attacking horses that makes them ideal at taking down mounted units.

As far as ranged units, I think the lack of large stacks of throwing weapons or highly effective bows is one of the features of Brytenwalda - it's more focused on hand to hand combat. The bowmen aren't completely useless, they just require micromanagement to really be effective. I've noticed the AI swinging archers around my flanks and shooting my guys in the sides and backs while they were focused on enemy infantry - that works well when a player does it too. In one battle with a Briton lord I lost more troops to his two dozen or so archers than I did to all melee troops combined because they managed to get around and shoot my guys in the back. The value of distraction can't be ignored either, when I gave a charge order to get my men to attack their infantry and ran in to fight myself, the next thing I knew a bunch of my men were running off trying to chase the archers (who kept moving away) and that split my forces.
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Micro102

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #2635 on: November 24, 2012, 11:24:13 pm »

Whyyyyyyyyyyyyyy!!!! Why does heavy armor lower your ability to shoot arrows! My bow/swordsmen/cavalryman is gone!
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Ozyton

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #2636 on: November 25, 2012, 12:07:29 am »

I just wanna point out a\that every M&B title is on sale on Steam at the moment, sale will end in 10 hours. Grab Warband for 5 dwarfbucks while you still can.

Hanslanda

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #2637 on: November 25, 2012, 01:38:42 pm »

I just did, but my computer has some... Resolution issues that makes them somewhat unplayable. I'm still trying to fix this. It says I need to put the resolution at 1600 x 1200 but it can only go up to 1280 x 1040.
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Paul

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #2638 on: November 25, 2012, 04:10:59 pm »

I made a new version of my Brytenwalda submod if anyone's interested. Going to be posting it over here from now on.

Salt mine works a lot better now. Dishonorable lords could make a tidy profit setting up an operation there, as long as you keep it stocked with prisoners.
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Robsoie

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Re: Mount and Blade
« Reply #2639 on: November 25, 2012, 07:47:15 pm »

Thank you very much for that submod, downloaded but not tried yet.
After reading what it does, it sounds like a very good upgrade for Bryntenwalda, now that i completed the amazing Light&Darkness campaign my next Warband run will use Brytenwalda and your submod.
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