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[Solifuge]

Hai gais.

Pandarsenic ran away, as per a severe Spooking. I'm rather surprised to still be around, but it does present a nice dilemma for the Masons. Nevertheless, from my vantage this is straightforward. RedWarrior0. I've never cared too much for Steven King, anyway.

Out of curiosity, what are we looking at in my initial claim? If you refer to the Barney thing, it was a fabrication, so I'm curious what you'd be concerned about. If you're concerned about the method of Pandar's departure, as I mentioned, my role-power scares a player away. I might hint that the lack of any other night targets being "scared away" is a reasonable indicator that this was the One-Shot Spooking, as described. Also, I wouldn't be able to night-kill AND scare a player away in the same night, without being overpowered.

Given this, what exactly is the hang-up, gents?

[webadict]

Hai gais.

Pandarsenic ran away, as per a severe Spooking. I'm rather surprised to still be around, but it does present a nice dilemma for the Masons. Nevertheless, from my vantage this is straightforward. RedWarrior0. I've never cared too much for Steven King, anyway.

Out of curiosity, what are we looking at in my initial claim? If you refer to the Barney thing, it was a fabrication, so I'm curious what you'd be concerned about. If you're concerned about the method of Pandar's departure, as I mentioned, my role-power scares a player away. I might hint that the lack of any other night targets being "scared away" is a reasonable indicator that this was the One-Shot Spooking, as described. Also, I wouldn't be able to night-kill AND scare a player away in the same night, without being overpowered.

Given this, what exactly is the hang-up, gents?

You claimed that your power was used DURING the Day, and scared them away at Night with your initial claim. That means it is possible for you to have killed and nightkilled. That means you're lying still about your role. Well, you may not have been lying about it before, but whether what you do is what you do... Well, I'm just not going to believe it.

It also makes a lot of sense, seeing as who died. RedWarrior0 being the bad guy? He basically connected himself to two people: you and Leafsnail, who proved his role for him.

Now, that's where it gets tricky. Personally, if I were scum and claiming LAST, I'd have only said I knew one role. Or that I knew OF Leafsnail's role. Because, honestly, Leafsnail was only lynched once we got more information.

You basically admitted you misclaimed. And when were you going to alleviate that? Never? Why did your ability change? Why did you lie in the first pace? See, none of these things make sense.

So, that's where our dilemma stands.

[Solifuge]

A Brief History of Stupidity, or
It Seemed Like A Good Idea At The Time:
-by Solifuge

Why are people being pushed to claim right now?

Because I'm forcing a Mass Claim one person at a time. It'll become apparent soon enough.

If you want, I'd appreciate it if you claimed.

Notes: I commonly find myself wanting inherintly to trust Webadict, and am consciously trying to avoid this habit. As such, I amplify my suspicions of this, until Web gives some reason to suspect him of non-scumminess.

Webadict, I'd like it if you claimed before everyone else, as a gesture of good faith. You're garnering a niggling of honest suspicion for bouncing too and fro, and demanding info out of people.

I'm afraid I can only claim once there are two people left to claim. As such, your lack of wanting to claim is noticed and will be suspect.

Why?

Notes: Suddenly, Pandadefense. Nevertheless, my suspicion is apparently not unwarranted. Web continues the same path, as he is wont to do. I don't like players demanding information without offering anything first, especially if they're rather unconfirmed.

NO THOUGHT
MASSCLAIMS
WEBADICT PLANS ONLY
FINAL DESTINATION

Veriliy, I LOLed.

Panda's plan makes sense, in that all Web said he needed was for all but 2 to claim first. We can claim whatever, to get Web's restriction off. Though now Web is backpeddling and trying to rework his statement into "not a restriction". He said the nature of his role was that he couldn't, which is basically a roleclaim anyway.

The whole thing smells like a fabrication... and Webadict's normal detached reasoning is not currently here. I call Shenanigans.

Also, my role is Bizarro Barney the Dinosaur. I can make one player my friend per day. They die the day after that.

Notes: Blatant (in my mind) falseclaim. I even prefaced the post I gave my "role" in with "Pandar is right, we should falseclaim". If that wasn't hint enough, I picked something that I felt was ridiculous enough to be questionably believable, while hopefully not tripping up Web into demanding a second claim from me, as he'd done to Pandar.

Soli.. what did you do N1 and N2?

Absolutely nothin'. Night actions ain't nothin' but a heartbreaker... friend only to the undertaker.

...but mostly because I'm in agreance with Pandar, and am attempting to peer beyond the veil.

Notes: People start to ask questions about my falseclaim, and Web hasn't claimed yet, so I am forced to play along, but make a point to not say anything untruthful about my actions. At this point, I'm suspecting I might have to roll with this "role" for a while, so I try to spin my falseclaim to be in line with my actual role. Regrets about taking this tactic begin to surface.

In the second half, I made a point to give a hint, intending to be a fallback after I can give my real role. I was "in agreance with Pandar" about giving Webadict anything to satisfy his demand, and doing so in an attempt to "peer beyond the veil" and assess Web's scumminess after he finally claimed. I really didn't want to give hypothetical Scum-Webadict any sort of upper hand, because his reasoning is, dare I say, Sherlock Holmian. _{^{</obscure in-jokes>}}

And then this:

I could claim to you, but I think I'll let Mr.Person do so for me.

He's Major Tom. I'm Ground Control. We're masons.

Notes: Didn't catch the significance of this until I actually read through the thread almost a day later; this significantly changed things.

I'd definately like to hear from Solifuge about why he hasn't action on the previous two days.  I'd also like an explanation for this post.

I trust that no one else heard a sensible argument right there? And not a single other player decided to vote for Leaf? No no, that would be foolish.

Besides, I'm packing mislynch insurance.

Unvote Dakarian. Coupled with your behavior from before, that's enough for me. I don't see you as a deceptive player, and this is a pretty solid defense. Accordingly, that would implicate Leafsnail, and thus goes my vote.

If you lie, Dak, you wont be here tomorrow morning.

Did you actually use your "friendship" on me at that point?  And, if it's a day action, how would you be able to use it after a mislynch?

Notes: Due to the choice of the word "once per day" rather than specifically saying "night", my false claim was implied to be a day action. this was never my intention.

However, the above slip, as pointed out by the late Leafsnail , indicates that I always subconsciously considered my ability a Night Action. Much thanks for that, Leaf.

Bonus thought experiment: Why would Leafsnail attempt to out my falseclaim, if we were a scum team? And why would he vote against me earlier, demanding that I explained how I "friended" people. Being a team, he and RedWarrior0 had been in contact, and both knew that my claim wasn't my real role, and thus he kept referring to my "friending" in quotes as well, belying that he knew that I wasn't giving my role. As scum, it was probably mildly threatening to have a player knowingly false-claim; what role could a player have that they would seek to hide it during mass-claim? Thus, the pressure being put on me by the Scum.

In this light, I'd invite you to revisit my actual role claim post

[Solifuge]

And now for Act 2... ze final scumhunt.

How to Win Friends and Influence People - RedWarrior0 Edition
by Solifuge

Eduren, never mind the replace. I'm Steven King. I can write a book basEd on this game. I learn two roles and the people who have them after the day, because the book appears to be uncannily accurate. I got Solifuge and Leafsnail. Solifuge is the Ghost/Poltergeist/Spook/Spirit/Tormented Soul/Ghoul, which he has not claimed. Leafsnail is... The Shusher.

So RedWarrior, why aren't you voting Solifuge or Leafsnail?

Note that, even when RedWarrior0 had irrefutable evidence that both Leaf and I had lied about our roles, he only bothered to mention that I had falseclaimed. When asked why he didn't vote for either of us, he followed that up with an excuse. Better yet, it contradicts his roleclaim post.

Mr.Person, good question. I'm debating which one.

Leafy, it's rather simple. If you WERE ascetic, I believe it wouldn't have mattered. I learn of two role names and who has them. I don't learn a person's role name. It's a subtle difference, but basically I learn about the role, not the person.

He's saying that he learned that there were two players, Leafsnail and Solifuge, and he knew that they were either The Spook, or The Shusher, but didn't learn who had what role. That's apparently why he had to pause to decide who to lynch.

However, in his earlier post, he clearly indicates who had what role. Thus, this is a thin excuse ment to cover up that he was trying to save his scum-buddy.

Thereafter, Leafsnail bussed him, and RedWarrior0 changed his tune and bussed Leafsnail (no doubt after a quick strategy session in Scumchat).

...and then he dissapears at LYLO, since the Wonder Twins are already doing the dirty work for him.

[webadict]

Well, well, well...

Mr.Person, what do you think? I'm lithe to believe Solifuge, but he brings several major points to the argument.

I'll have to look back. RedWarrior0 does have some blows against him.

I'll consider it RedWarrior0 losing for now.

[Mr.Person]

I've reread the thread. RedWarrior may have lurked to hell and back and made some of his own mistakes, but between lynch all liars, the third vote on day 2, and this attack he made on Leafsnail d3 that he promptly dropped to defend himself from Dakarian, Solifuge.

[Solifuge]

I've reread the thread. RedWarrior may have lurked to hell and back and made some of his own mistakes, but between lynch all liars, the third vote on day 2, and this attack he made on Leafsnail d3 that he promptly dropped to defend himself from Dakarian, Solifuge.

I try not to let myself get hung up in conventions and nebulous "rules"... and Lynch All Liars is a crock of crap. Situationally, it makes sense that only Scum would need to conceal their identity, but there are times when it does not behoove the Town for a member to reveal information publically. Consider the following example:

You are a Cop. Someone calls for a Mass Claim, and you haven't yet investigated them. They appear to be buddies with another player to boot. There are at least 2 days left, and you neither trust this player, nor feel it's a good idea to out yourself when it could mean your death, and you still need one more turn to use your ability.

So you give a false role. It's a calculated risk, taking into account that it will generate kneejerk mistrust among some players when you reveal the truth, and your findings. However, it might mean the difference between victory and defeat, and is ultimately the Town thing to do.

This aside, yes I defended myself on D3. Were I to die the game would have been over, since you'd have 2 scum, 2 town, a voteless Pandar, and no OSV to clean up. Next day, they can force a tie, and its a No Lynch. Scum offs one of you Masons in the night, and then have their way with the town. Game Over.

How very scummy of me to not want that to happen.

[RedWarrior0]

Solifuge. There is no other way. I will post myattack after I have bettr access.

[Mr.Person]

I don't think you understand. It's not THAT you defended yourself, it's that your dropped your attack on Leafsnail to defend yourself.

[Solifuge]

I daresay, Mr. Person, the crisis is that You don't understand. And it seems as though no amount of explanation on my part can change your mind.

Solifuge. There is no other way. I will post myattack after I have bettr access.

Lol hai gais, sry i was bisy lerking lets lynch soilfgue just cuz now i got to lerk moar kthnxbuy.

[Solifuge]

To avoid an edit:

In the alternate universe where RedWarrior0 is Town, and I'm a Double-Killing scum along with Leafsnail, why would Leaf and I have bothered to even humor Red's claim? I'd have stuck with my falseclaim... I had nothing to gain from revealing my identity. Leaf and I could have easily worked the Town's suspicion of him "just happening to randomly get both Scum's roles and names", fomented a lynch, and then I could double-kill in the night, and we'd have either bussed one of us, or preferably kept Pandar, done a tie-vote, and won.

In Scenario 2, with Leaf and I being Scum again, after Leafsnails lynch, it would not have behooved me whatsoever to scare Pandarsenic away, since he was powerless in the day. If I had two night-kills, I'd have double-killed the Mason team, and presented Pandar and Red with a much less favorable WIFOM. Again, it makes no sense, given what has transpired.

No, in the universe in which we reside, when Red hit my role on the nose, my immediate response was to reveal the truth about my role so he wouldn't get lynched for "lying". I took a serious reputation hit to counter Leafsnail's attempt to call RedWarrior0 a liar, even though it now as been revealed as a bussing attempt. Were I scum, this would have been the worst move I could have made.

[Mr.Person]

Actually, let me work this out.

Yesterday, after Leafsnail was lynched, there were 6 players alive, 2 masons, 1 nonvoter, 1 medium, 1 poisoner, and 1 townie. Solifuge, if you were scum and decided to kill both masons, you'd been stuck facing a townie out to get you, a medium who would have BOTH masons and potentially more players screaming to kill you, and a nonvoter who doesn't matter. This is all after you go against what Webadict says to do, of course.

The reason the pair of you didn't go against RedWarrior is because then you'd be stuck poisoning RedWarrior. With that in mind, we'd of lynched Leafsnail. Pandarsenic could be ignored, me and Webadict were confirmed, Dakarian was confirmed if you killed either of us masons. So you'd of been lynched, and you would of lost.

Which is more likely? A town aligned player lied about their role, or scum lied about their role? This is what it comes down to. I cannot think of a situation where I'd be ok with a player lying about their role, especially to protect the fact they're a fucking poisoner. Go ahead, try and explain why you would lie at MC to hide the fact you're a poisoner.

[webadict]

Actually, I'm thinking it is RedWarrior0 all along.

Solifuge didn't lie about his role, like a double-killing scum would've. He lied about the name. Why? Because he's the dumbest moron ever? I'm thinking so.

I mean, Solifuge's point is moot in his last statement, since Leafsnail was incredibly likely scum from the combination of claims.

However, I'm thinking RedWarrior0 might be a Role Cop for the scum. He would've scanned Night 1, killed Night 2, and then he was sent to get rid of Leafsnail, seeing as how Leafsnail wanted Redwarrior0 to be pretty close to confirmed.

However, I'm pretty sure the OSV shooting does a lot for his case. He's right. It did show up as scaring them away. Plus, if I were a double-killing scum, I'd've gone for the 1 kill WIFOM. I mean, he could then save the double kill for the next Night, since no one really knew what to look for.

Plus, his claim sucked for what it was. But, he did claim OSV. And I'm not sure if scum are allowed to do their actions plus the mafiakill at Night, but the whole defense rests on it.

[Mr.Person]

His second kill is a day action. The real question is if Leafsnail's shushing was automatic or an action.

But you ARE right. The whole mess is WIFOM. It's hard to look past, but I'm seeing Solifuge as scum for way more than just the WIFOM, believe me. I'll give it some more thought, of course.

[webadict]

His second kill is a day action. The real question is if Leafsnail's shushing was automatic or an action.

But you ARE right. The whole mess is WIFOM. It's hard to look past, but I'm seeing Solifuge as scum for way more than just the WIFOM, believe me. I'll give it some more thought, of course.

Right, right. I suppose I'll look back.