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[Renault]

Whoa. You're actually really good, Red. I'm impressed.

[Red Fortune]

D: But I'm only a beginner with less than a year of practice, come back in 4 years or something.

[Red Fortune]

[Supermikhail]

It's weird how a thread on [^the topic^] has turned what into. I thought about suggesting it when I had only started with my comic proposals... Now I'm certain your art deserves its own thread here. Especially if you're going to keep up your output. _{And also because someone has said that they are going to watch this thread closely, because of [^the topic^].}

Now, about motivation. Today I proposed and established a law for myself: Learning a skill requires no less than one lesson a week, be it school, university, or one's own endeavour. Also, the lesson should be no less than 45 minutes. And it should consist of exercises, not some idle chat on the topic (as they like to go about English here in Russia).
The inspirations for this law were my own experience of learning to play guitar and my experience of studying in school and in university.
Also, the law says that it's important to stay on each new level until you are able to do the exercises of this level perfectly.
The problem here is that a student need to have the exercises, and sometimes it's hard to find enough of them. So it happened with my speed reading, and 3d modelling... Ah...
What do you think of my law, and if it's a good motivation when you know that you're going to make it just by setting aside 1-2 hours a week for your studies?
For me personally it used to be a big downer (and demotivator) when the tutorial, textbook or instructor said that you should spend no less than several hours a day training. Screw them.

[Red Fortune]

Oh, so you're saying for me to use an hour or two very constructively? Good idea!

Though I still think I have to spend at least 1-2 hours a day drawing to improve, or more.

So what news on the comic?

[Supermikhail]

Tsk-tsk... First, by 1-2 hours a week I mean 1-2 hours of sheer mind-numbing exercises. Like, all 30 second sketches!
Second. I don't know... What news on the comic... I've got problems even writing for Script Fenzy... Well, I might ask, you've said you'd like to draw something inspired by the first part of my script...

[Rooster]

Oh, so you're saying for me to use an hour or two very constructively? Good idea!

Though I still think I have to spend at least 1-2 hours a day drawing to improve, or more.

So what news on the comic?

Good sir, you need to look at something called tutorials, if you wish to improve.

[Vector]

Now, about motivation. Today I proposed and established a law for myself: Learning a skill requires no less than one lesson a week, be it school, university, or one's own endeavour. Also, the lesson should be no less than 45 minutes. And it should consist of exercises, not some idle chat on the topic (as they like to go about English here in Russia).
[...]
What do you think of my law, and if it's a good motivation when you know that you're going to make it just by setting aside 1-2 hours a week for your studies?
For me personally it used to be a big downer (and demotivator) when the tutorial, textbook or instructor said that you should spend no less than several hours a day training. Screw them.

For mathematics, at least, you really need between 9 and 11 hours every day at concentrated work, with 14-16 your eventual goal.  Violin needs 6-8 hours every day, as do most musical instruments (though sometimes you can get away with 2, if you know how to use it right).

Authors are generally supposed to do 3-4 hours a day of writing, with the rest of the day dedicated to research, brainstorming, and letting things percolate in the mind.


The thing is, though, that this should only be done of one's own volition--as one of my professors told me, "like drinking a morning cup of coffee."  Aren't people amazing?

[eerr]

Now, about motivation. Today I proposed and established a law for myself: Learning a skill requires no less than one lesson a week, be it school, university, or one's own endeavour. Also, the lesson should be no less than 45 minutes. And it should consist of exercises, not some idle chat on the topic (as they like to go about English here in Russia).
[...]
What do you think of my law, and if it's a good motivation when you know that you're going to make it just by setting aside 1-2 hours a week for your studies?
For me personally it used to be a big downer (and demotivator) when the tutorial, textbook or instructor said that you should spend no less than several hours a day training. Screw them.

For mathematics, at least, you really need between 9 and 11 hours every day at concentrated work, with 14-16 your eventual goal.  Violin needs 6-8 hours every day, as do most musical instruments (though sometimes you can get away with 2, if you know how to use it right).

Authors are generally supposed to do 3-4 hours a day of writing, with the rest of the day dedicated to research, brainstorming, and letting things percolate in the mind.


The thing is, though, that this should only be done of one's own volition--as one of my professors told me, "like drinking a morning cup of coffee."  Aren't people amazing?

you don't need 9-11 hours a day.

You just need about 15 hardcore hours a week where you spend all of your time discussing and analyzing every last detail of your work to be most efficient and accurate. I mean EVERY last detail, like how 11-19 are slower to speak or understand when spoken. Other numerous seemingly unimportant details as well. Of course, without this you will learn less even when you do the 9-11 hours that compensate.
(The spoken system of english numbering actually slows us down)
If you don't feel somewhat drained afterward you aren't doing it right.

Of course, if you want to discuss something in-depth and analyze it your require a very large amount of standardized practice
and teachers in school probably won't let you talk either.

[Red Fortune]

Good sir, you need to look at something called tutorials, if you wish to improve.

Tutorials =/= gaining skill. Believe me, I went through a phase initially where I thought spectacular looking art could be learned just by reading tutorials and copying the steps... I was damn wrong.

For mathematics, at least, you really need between 9 and 11 hours every day at concentrated work, with 14-16 your eventual goal.  Violin needs 6-8 hours every day, as do most musical instruments (though sometimes you can get away with 2, if you know how to use it right).

HOLY FFFFFF-

How am I supposed to manage 9-11 hours a day when I'm only home from school in the evening 6 1/2 hours before I go to sleep? D:
THIS IS MADNESS!!

[Vector]

... Yes, I do that, too.  There's a reason why it takes me 2 minutes to solve a problem and 15/30 to write it down 

And yes, believe me, I'm completely exhausted at the end of the day.  My study model generally involves "open the book.  Read the statement of the theorem.  Close the book.  Prove the theorem."  If that's not exhausting, I don't know what is.

HOLY FFFFFF-

How am I supposed to manage 9-11 hours a day when I'm only home from school in the evening 6 1/2 hours before I go to sleep? D:
THIS IS MADNESS!!

... I suppose I should have phrased that differently.  For people who are trying to become great mathematicians, 9-11 hours a day is kind of the wimp-ass standard.  The answer is "skip all your classes and do nothing but mathematics."

There's a reason why the math department tends to get a bit of a reputation for being full of people who are completely insane.

[Red Fortune]

Oooh, well, I'm not looking to become a great mathematician, just wanting to learn it as much as science requires, which I guess is a lot.... 


INSANITY

[Supermikhail]

Yesterday while I was composing a reply to Vector, I got interrupted. I hope it still applies.

Ahem. I guess, my law applies to a certain level of learning. Like from a dabbling to adequate (to put it into familiar terms), because after that we go into professional territory. But, to feel more or less comfortable in the field, have a grasp of terms or the handle of technique, I think, my law still applies. You know, like, to get into it and be able to continue smoothly, or stay an adequate hobbyist.

Hm, on the other hand, do mathematicians gain a lot from their 9 to 11 hours, and violinists from their 6-8? My law is more concerned with staying fit. I don't have a slightest idea how mathematicians spend their day, but I can look from a musician's point of view, and you know, you can try to learn a whole concerto in one sitting, and be very good at playing it (or get really frustrated) but I don't think it'll add much to your technique if you are at this level. There is a limit to how much a brain can learn in one sitting, and probably in a single act of wakefulness, as there is a limit to how much muscles can grow in one go (which can be boosted by proper nutrition, but still).
My point is, I'd much rather, some people knew their limit and instead of obsessing over their job, devoted some time to, hm, fitness.

Actually, it may even be that you'll retain more information if you study twice a week instead of every day.

Now, I realize that the formal education system has ~2 lessons a week, but also it has some amount of homework. Which probably doubles the time. Also I realize that quite possibly my law makes me look like a lazy jerk. There is a reason scientists, artists and other-ists spend so much time, when at higher ranks. It is almost another law, that at higher ranks grinding skill takes much more time than at lower ranks, and almost exponentially so.
And actually, "of your own volition" is a very good point, because I think at higher ranks -ists do it because they like it (have grown to like it), not because they have to. Otherwise, a single week could make one into an alcoholic.

[Red Fortune]

Very interesting observations.

[Vector]

Yesterday while I was composing a reply to Vector, I got interrupted. I hope it still applies.

Ahem. I guess, my law applies to a certain level of learning. Like from a dabbling to adequate (to put it into familiar terms), because after that we go into professional territory. But, to feel more or less comfortable in the field, have a grasp of terms or the handle of technique, I think, my law still applies. You know, like, to get into it and be able to continue smoothly, or stay an adequate hobbyist.

Hm, on the other hand, do mathematicians gain a lot from their 9 to 11 hours, and violinists from their 6-8? My law is more concerned with staying fit. I don't have a slightest idea how mathematicians spend their day, but I can look from a musician's point of view, and you know, you can try to learn a whole concerto in one sitting, and be very good at playing it (or get really frustrated) but I don't think it'll add much to your technique if you are at this level. There is a limit to how much a brain can learn in one sitting, and probably in a single act of wakefulness, as there is a limit to how much muscles can grow in one go (which can be boosted by proper nutrition, but still).
My point is, I'd much rather, some people knew their limit and instead of obsessing over their job, devoted some time to, hm, fitness.

Actually, it may even be that you'll retain more information if you study twice a week instead of every day.

Now, I realize that the formal education system has ~2 lessons a week, but also it has some amount of homework. Which probably doubles the time. Also I realize that quite possibly my law makes me look like a lazy jerk. There is a reason scientists, artists and other-ists spend so much time, when at higher ranks. It is almost another law, that at higher ranks grinding skill takes much more time than at lower ranks, and almost exponentially so.
And actually, "of your own volition" is a very good point, because I think at higher ranks -ists do it because they like it (have grown to like it), not because they have to. Otherwise, a single week could make one into an alcoholic.

Oh, of course.  I imagine that your rule functions very well for the lower levels, since in my experience that initial hump is almost impossible to get over (for math and violin, at the very least).  And yes, proto-mathematicians do gain a lot from their 9 to 11 hours, since after a certain level each page of a text is supposed to take you about an hour to process and learn the first time.  The other thing is that part of this is always going to be problem-solving, so it's not just sitting passively with a textbook.  It's hours of poking an idea from one side or another in hopes that it you'll be able to figure it out.  You're not doing it for the knowledge, you're doing it for the mental training.

Similarly, for the 6-8 hours of practice... probably 2-3 hours of that is scales/other daily exercises, with another 1-2 additional exercises that come up in the course of one's practice.  Honestly, 6-8 hours is only enough to learn a couple lines (if that).