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Author Topic: BM8: The Eclipse (End: Town Victory)  (Read 57098 times)

Org

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Re: BM8: The Eclipse (Day 1: Spies? On my spaceship?)
« Reply #60 on: January 12, 2010, 06:24:56 pm »

While not a very good thing to do, as long as you give good reasons as to why you are voting, bandwagonning is not scummy.

I think.
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Vector

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Re: BM8: The Eclipse (Day 1: Spies? On my spaceship?)
« Reply #61 on: January 12, 2010, 06:29:36 pm »

Good new reasons.  That's the important thing.
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"The question of the usefulness of poetry arises only in periods of its decline, while in periods of its flowering, no one doubts its total uselessness." - Boris Pasternak

nonbinary/genderfluid/genderqueer renegade mathematician and mafia subforum limpet. please avoid quoting me.

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Org

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Re: BM8: The Eclipse (Day 1: Spies? On my spaceship?)
« Reply #62 on: January 12, 2010, 06:30:16 pm »

Good new reasons.  That's the important thing.
Yeah. Because if not its like SUPER Bandwagonning.
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Org

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Re: BM8: The Eclipse (Day 1: Spies? On my spaceship?)
« Reply #63 on: January 12, 2010, 06:30:44 pm »

Actually, no. Posting no reason would be.
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dakarian

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Re: BM8: The Eclipse (Day 1: Spies? On my spaceship?)
« Reply #64 on: January 12, 2010, 07:28:43 pm »

You were right on both counts.  Voting for no reason (or no real reason) OR voting just based on what others have said is bandwagoning.

Note that you CAN use other people's reasons technically, but you need to show that you had put some thought in it yourself. 

Note that bandwagoning isn't a lynchable offense (no ONE tell is) and that townies should NOT be TOO focused on just avoiding scumtells.  The true point is that you should have a reason and stand for everything you do.

To put it another way: if you have to do 20 scumtells in order to lynch a mafia, then DO IT!  All that matters is the kill.. nothing else, not even your life!

ALL THAT MATTERS!
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What was I doing with Mr.Person through most of Day 3, lovemaking!?
I KNEW IT!

inteuniso

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Re: BM8: The Eclipse (Day 1: Spies? On my spaceship?)
« Reply #65 on: January 12, 2010, 08:26:41 pm »

OK then, I vote Rolan7.

He has lurked, and he has only retaliated, besides rv'ing Glyphgryph.
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Lol scratch that I'm building a marijuana factory.

webadict

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Re: BM8: The Eclipse (Day 1: Spies? On my spaceship?)
« Reply #66 on: January 12, 2010, 08:44:34 pm »

You were right on both counts.  Voting for no reason (or no real reason) OR voting just based on what others have said is bandwagoning.

Note that you CAN use other people's reasons technically, but you need to show that you had put some thought in it yourself. 

Note that bandwagoning isn't a lynchable offense (no ONE tell is) and that townies should NOT be TOO focused on just avoiding scumtells.  The true point is that you should have a reason and stand for everything you do.

To put it another way: if you have to do 20 scumtells in order to lynch a mafia, then DO IT!  All that matters is the kill.. nothing else, not even your life!

ALL THAT MATTERS!
I disagree. I believe that avoiding scumtells is also helpful to Town, though not a sole purpose. It helps give credibility to Townies, since they only have words to persuade, and never conclusive evidence. But, yes, you should try your hardest to make sure scum are lynched.

Also, I'd advise questioning some of those people that haven't had anyone to talk to.
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Halmie

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Re: BM8: The Eclipse (Day 1: Spies? On my spaceship?)
« Reply #67 on: January 12, 2010, 08:48:20 pm »

My vote was on dorf, not akigigak(meh). Unvote anyway.

Bandwagonning is not a scum tell as it is the only way to lynch people, but your motives will(should) be questioned.

Calling someone scum is not saying they are definatly mafia. It's just a way of saying HEY YOU!

Don't get in the mindset that one of these two have to be scum. Often neither are and the scum can just sit back and join the bandwagon.

Maybe rolan7 is asleep??? I've only just got up. And you've made what? 3 posts? I agree he's made some pretty random moves. But I'm getting newb town tells more than scumtells.

Dorf, I'm not so sure about. This fight is leaning my read on him towards the town side.
With all this in mind my vote goes to.................
inteuniso
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Meh.

Halmie

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Re: BM8: The Eclipse (Day 1: Spies? On my spaceship?)
« Reply #68 on: January 12, 2010, 08:49:57 pm »

Don't get in the mindset that one of these two have to be scum. Often neither are and the scum can just sit back and join the bandwagon.

Sorry for the double post but I'm talking about Rolan7 and Dorf.
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Meh.

Rolan7

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Re: BM8: The Eclipse (Day 1: Spies? On my spaceship?)
« Reply #69 on: January 12, 2010, 09:00:06 pm »

If a townie is to be lynched on the first day, it might as well be me, but I'd much rather we lynch a mafia member instead.  So I'm going to defend myself.  I'll start with dorf, the guy who instantly responded to my random vote with a OMGUS vote and a vendetta.

Seems to me we have a lot of overeager newbies here. Which is nice and dandy, if you would have something concrete to back up your claims. Instead, you're overreacting to RVS posts and are exposing yourselves for lynching.
Now, if what you are doing is a newbtell, you should be fine, as soon as you become rational.
But so far, I must admit, your behavior is quite anti-town.


I am a newbie, but I have quoted evidence to support every single one of my claims.  I am not an "overeager newbie" for pressuring people on day one, or for random voting.  I unvoted my random vote as soon as I had a lead.

Isn't it obvious that by calling us newbies overeager, you're encouraging us to lurk?  I'm *sure* you know that lurking is anti-town.  So why are you trying this?

You say we should provide "something concrete to back up your claims"?  Then I demand, again, that you explain your OMGUS vote against me:

*snickers*

I would want to be a Godfather. Seems I could do a lot of damage as Mafia, if I wouldn't get myself lynched, of course.

Right now, everyone has posted except GlyphGryph, and dorf.  Dorf hasn't responded to a question yet, so I'll add some pressure.

Unvote
Vote dorf
How does it feel, Rolan7?

You quote this OMGUS below, yet you provide absolutely no justification of your vote.  Just like when you first made it.  And it is not a random vote, as you claim, because you do it in direct response to me random voting you.  Can you explain these, well, lies?

Let me explain.
Pro-town wants to lynch scum. Anti-town don't care who gets lynched, just that it's not them.
What you are doing is throwing accusations all over the place, without backing them up. I see many of you are changing votes rapidly, which doesn't help with your credibility, either.
What you should do is concentrate on scumtells and elaborate on them. What you are doing now will only benefit Mafia.
Of course, if you are anti-town, then keep up the good work! You're preparing a nice situation that could lead to a mislynch.

Halmie and Rolan7 are both very excited to be playing. But I think Halmie is just trying to scumhunt and get some conversation going.
Rolan7 is being weirder, though.

Feel free to elaborate on my "weird"ness.  Until then, you're just mad that I randomly voted you.


If you think what Halmie is doing is scummy:
Hey, dorf what role would you most like to be in this game?
Vote Halmie.  Are you trying to get dorf to claim a role, or am I missing something?

Why do you suddenly side with him?
It was a random vote, and right after you ask this question, you answer it by quoting my justification for changing my vote:
No, I am questioning him. It gets discussion going. I said what role would you want in this game. So no I'm not asking what role he has.
Fair enough.  This is the same reason I questioned you over something so minor.
Right now, everyone has posted except GlyphGryph, and dorf.  Dorf hasn't responded to a question yet, so I'll add some pressure.

Unvote
Vote dorf
Then:
This isn't "adding pressure", this is bandwagoning without a valid reason.

I give a valid reason.  At the time, you had not posted.  All I meant to do was encourage you to post, yet you responded by voting me and mounting this assault of untruths at me.

How does it feel, Rolan7?
You sound terrified of a lynching, scum.  Townies take it for the team, and certainly shouldn't fear a single random vote.  My vote stands.
To answer your question, it feels great to have identified a mafia.  Possibly a Godfather trying for WIFOM!
Here he overreacts over my first post in this game. He is SURE that I am scum from my RVS vote.
He is LITERALLY saying that I am Mafia, and not only that! He's even quoted my initial 5 words to present that as proof of my scumdom.

I'm being agressive because of Dakarian's post, directly before I posted, which encouraged us to be rediculously aggressive.  Yet you choose to attack me, some newbie, instead of critiquing the IC.  Why would you do that if you were a cooperative townie?  Are you too busy flinging accusations at me, to share you wisdom with the town?  No.
But even he saw the silliness in his empty accusations, so he said to himself "ooh, I better find some more things to say", and he came up with this:
Quote from: dorf
Voting Halmie, for the "town is so fucked" sounding scummy.
Edited because I forgot to put Halmie in red.
You really shouldn't do that :s
Are you advising him not to edit posts, or are you threatening to nightkill him if he votes you?  I think you're sending both messages here.
Let me get this straight: this time, my crime is providing too much evidence against you?  So you're claiming my claims are without evidence, yet I go out of my way to find quotes to back them up.
...
Therion knew (and I bet that everybody else did too) what I was saying. How come you didn't?
I should also note that I actually explained what I meant BEFORE he posted.
I don't see your explanation, but it's not important.  My question was a weak attempt to keep the pressure on you.  If that pressure is the reason your arguments are so easy to break apart, then I'm glad I asked it.
Rolan7, why so overpanicking on a random question? He could have asked "What color pants yould you like?" and still have got the same amount of a read.
I answered your question with the following:
No, I am questioning him. It gets discussion going. I said what role would you want in this game. So no I'm not asking what role he has.
Fair enough.  This is the same reason I questioned you over something so minor.
Right now, everyone has posted except GlyphGryph, and dorf.  Dorf hasn't responded to a question yet, so I'll add some pressure.

Unvote
Vote dorf
Really, his wording seemed like it could trick someone into claiming.  If it happened to be a newbie doctor or cop, that could have been disastrous for us.  I'm satisfied with his answer, particularly with obviouscum like dorf.
Answer to "why are you panicking" is: "I hope we don't lose a doctor or cop with this, but I trust his RVS vote, so it's okay"
This is typical anti-town behavior. NO townie wants a mislynch, unless it can lure out the scum. You just showed the public you don't care who gets lynched and have exposed yourself as scum.
I didn't trust his RVS vote.  I did some research, shared it, and chose to vote for one of the two people that hadn't posted yet.  It happened to you, and you have freaked out in response.  Including, lest anyone forget, instantly voting for me with *no* justification *whatsoever*.

So tell me again, Rolan7, why am I scum? Because I didn't post right at the start of the game? Because my RVS vote was on you?
At the time I was merely pressuring you to get you to vote, since you were nearly the *last* person to vote.  Much less getting involved at the start.
Calling your vote a RVS vote is another flat out lie, as you quoted my random vote when you made it.
How am I more scummy than inteuniso?
Well then, Errol, been spying lately?
He only said one word more than I did. Surely that makes him scum?
I'm just a newbie, so I'll ask: does anyone thing I really need to respond to this?
Take your time replying to this, Rolan7. I'm sure you won't back off now, right?
Ball's in your court, space pirate.  Unlike when I made my vote against you, I am now completely convinced that you are scum.  Truth is the best weapon of the town, and I have shown you to be a liar.  Isn't it one of the basic strategies, that a townie should never lie?  If you are town, then we'll waste a lynching on your lying self, instead of a scum.  Which would be better than lynching any of the other townies who have proceeded without obvious dishonesty.
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She/they
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Quote from: Fallen London, one Unthinkable Hope
This one didn't want to be who they was. On the Surface – it was a dull, unconsidered sadness. But everything changed. Which implied everything could change.

webadict

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Re: BM8: The Eclipse (Day 1: Spies? On my spaceship?)
« Reply #70 on: January 12, 2010, 09:03:10 pm »

My vote was on dorf, not akigigak(meh). Unvote anyway.

Bandwagonning is not a scum tell as it is the only way to lynch people, but your motives will(should) be questioned.

Calling someone scum is not saying they are definatly mafia. It's just a way of saying HEY YOU!

Don't get in the mindset that one of these two have to be scum. Often neither are and the scum can just sit back and join the bandwagon.

Maybe rolan7 is asleep??? I've only just got up. And you've made what? 3 posts? I agree he's made some pretty random moves. But I'm getting newb town tells more than scumtells.

Dorf, I'm not so sure about. This fight is leaning my read on him towards the town side.
With all this in mind my vote goes to.................
inteuniso
"Okay, pal. Let's get this whole thing straightened out:

"Bandwagonning is not the same thing as voting the same as other people. It is unjustified dogpiling on someone. It is scummy.

"Calling someone scum and not meaning is flip-floppy. Calling them scum is pointing attention to them and casting a bad light on them. It is scummy if you don't mean it.

"Don't justify yourself EARLY. Saying that they may or may not be scum is covering your bases, just in case you're wrong. It is scummy.

"Why the heck are justifying for Rolan7? You're not him, and he can answer for himself later on. It is scummy.

"Deflecting on another person for the number of posts they've made whie they were attacking someone else. That is scummy.

"It's funny that you're getting newb towntells but are still voting for him. That is very, very scummy. Basically, you're saying that he's town but oh well he looks scummy vote for him yea!

"You're not helping your team no matter what side you're on. I'd consider being more careful."
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Halmie

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Re: BM8: The Eclipse (Day 1: Spies? On my spaceship?)
« Reply #71 on: January 12, 2010, 09:12:52 pm »

I never said I was getting newb town tells from intueniso.

I was pointing out why I thought intueniso was scummy. He claimed someone was lurking when they weren't it would of been the same if he accused dorf or me of lurking, he definatly wasn't.

The rest? OK, bad choice on my part.
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Meh.

Rolan7

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Re: BM8: The Eclipse (Day 1: Spies? On my spaceship?)
« Reply #72 on: January 12, 2010, 09:16:24 pm »

OK then, I vote Rolan7.

He has lurked, and he has only retaliated, besides rv'ing Glyphgryph.

This is ridiculous.  This is my 8th post.  I posted twice on the first page.  I never voted Glyphgryph whatsoever, I voted Halmie and dorf.  I "retaliated" against dorf when he OMGUS voted me in response to my semi-random vote meant to get to stop lurking.

Do you have me confused with someone?

Maybe rolan7 is asleep??? I've only just got up. And you've made what? 3 posts? I agree he's made some pretty random moves. But I'm getting newb town tells more than scumtells.

Dorf, I'm not so sure about. This fight is leaning my read on him towards the town side.
With all this in mind my vote goes to.................
inteuniso

3 posts?  Seriously?  I know it's hard to review the posts on this board, but I'm almost offended.  With 9 people, and about 70 posts total, and me making 8 posts, I've made slightly over the average amount.  And that's with me being away at work, raquetball, and dinner at my parents since this morning.  I suppose most people check in around lunch; I'll do my best to do so tomorrow (:

Besides which, my previous post took over an hour to edit.  I admit I'm not very experienced with forums, so maybe I missed some time savers.  Managing quotes in particular was a pain.
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She/they
No justice: no peace.
Quote from: Fallen London, one Unthinkable Hope
This one didn't want to be who they was. On the Surface – it was a dull, unconsidered sadness. But everything changed. Which implied everything could change.

Org

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Re: BM8: The Eclipse (Day 1: Spies? On my spaceship?)
« Reply #73 on: January 12, 2010, 09:20:40 pm »

Yeah people. You need to do some more playing and less lurking.
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SirBayer

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Re: BM8: The Eclipse (Day 1: Spies? On my spaceship?)
« Reply #74 on: January 12, 2010, 09:45:46 pm »

Org is immediately struck by lightning and killed.
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Dude, you don't want to be messing around with imperial assloads.  The conversion rate to horseloads is atrocious.
Rules are for suckers.
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