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[forsaken1111]

It does seem like a bit of a gamey workaround though. I haven't quite gotten there in my new game but I'll probably invest in the bigass shipyard instead just because it's awesome.

[RedKing]

I don't think the Orbital Hab is too game-y for things like resource extraction. It stands to reason that miners would bring their families, traders would set up shop for basics like food, entertainment, etc. It's like a boom town in space.

In fact, I think it's even more appropriate for gas harvesting, because there's nowhere else for the population to live.

[Micro102]

How do you get civilians to transport installations past jump points? Do I need a jump gate or is a jump ship enough?

[Flying Dice]

Same way all other inter-system transit works. Gates work in all cases, and I believe they'll use jump tenders with sufficient capacity. Though of course gates are easier and less costly.

[Micro102]

Hmmmm, well they seem to be ignoring my installation transfer requests in favor of back-and-forth trade between mars and the earth,

[RedKing]

That's not uncommon. From the civilian AI standpoint, they can make more profit running the relatively short trade route than they can hauling an installation to Bumfuck 357 and back.

I do wish you could set contract pricing, so that high-priority things you want moved quickly, you'd just price really high and the free market would snap that contract up.


I was going to say you could mark Mars as a banned body, but I don't think you can do that if you have population there. That's why I always keep a cargo group in my fleet, rather than depend 100% of civilians.

[MarcAFK]

Was experimenting with fuel harvesting bases like this yesterday, firstly while the habitat is huge it's very cheap, costing only 200 spacebucks out of a 9000 spacebuck facility.  Secondly, it's cheap compared to the cost of fuel refinerys. This is the design I came up with:

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FuelHogsmall class Fuel Harvester Base    797,800 tons     2280 Crew     9180.2 BP      TCS 15956  TH 2880  EM 0
180 km/s     Armour 1-766     Shields 0-0     Sensors 1/1/0/0     Damage Control Rating 1     PPV 0
MSP 7    Max Repair 48 MSP
Intended Deployment Time: 3 months    Spare Berths 1   
Habitation Capacity 50,000   
Fuel Harvester: 200 modules producing 4000000 litres per annum

Faulkner & Lyons 240 EP Commercial Ion Drive (12)    Power 240    Fuel Use 4.05%    Signature 240    Exp 4%
Fuel Capacity 8,000,000 Litres    Range 44.4 billion km   (2857 days at full power)

This design is classed as a Commercial Vessel for maintenance purposes
This design is classed as an Orbital Habitat for construction purposesSome explanation of design choices.
200 modules is enough to double my starting fuel production, 180km/s can get to Jupiter in only about a month which is fine, tanks for 2 years production is ok I guess. the design can be made in about 2 years with starting factories, I would probably use about 20% production though and wait for the long term, I won't run out for fuel until my fleet is grown and starts training anyway.
Most importantly it costs this:

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3475.7 Duranium
5 Corbomite
4530 Boronide
593 Mercassium
576 GalliciteWhile 200 refineries costs: 24000 duranium. So if you have Boronide to spare and want to save duranium then harvesters are great, I would probably even add a few more layers of armour for only a couple more thousand.

[forsaken1111]

I don't think the Orbital Hab is too game-y for things like resource extraction. It stands to reason that miners would bring their families, traders would set up shop for basics like food, entertainment, etc. It's like a boom town in space.

In fact, I think it's even more appropriate for gas harvesting, because there's nowhere else for the population to live.

I mean using a single orbital hab module to avoid the requirement of shipyards feels gamey to me, but I am not saying anyone else should alter the way that they play or judging anyone else for playing that way. The game is a sandbox for us to have fun in.

[MarcAFK]

Well you can mass produce components in factories to significantly reduce shipyard construction anyway, so why not the entire ship?

[Shooer]

What I think of when building a 200-800k base with an orbital hab in it is a giant construction project in orbit.  Similar to building a new shipyard.  Where as building in a shipyard means using a small contained mass production facility to me, by building it with industry separate from shipyards you are hiring people to do one grand task.  Not dissimilar to building a big bridge or monument.

Even if you are building it and are going to ignore the orbital hab part you still have to dedicate the resources to it, the cost, the time.  Just not the YEARS to expand a shipyard the size of such a structure.

That and you still have the hab as a part that costs you while making it bigger and heavier.  Just a bit of wasted space and resources.

[forsaken1111]

I understand the argument and why it's allowed. I'm just stating my preference and that it feels gamey. I like the idea of a massive shipyard in orbit assembling my massive orbital constructions, so that is the way I'm doing it. It's like purposefully choosing a harder embark on DF, I have chosen to do something more difficult because it is more enjoyable for me.

From a realism standpoint, if you can just build it in orbit with ground industry and no shipyard why can't you do the same for ships? The real reason is that Steve didn't want to force people to make 800kTon shipyards and I understand that.

[Sheb]

I also think you can't put engines on something you create from industry, so that's another limitation.

RedKing: You said you like your fuel harvester bases to have "some survivability". Have you ever had a case where a base was under attack and was saved by it armor and CIWS? Since they tend to sit on their own somewhere, and are too slow to flee, I'd imagine any alien attack would destroy them anyway...

[Micro102]

Can't you technically build ships in orbit? Just build the ship's parts and then finish it off in the shipyard, just like the habitat ships.

[Shooer]

That's limited by the size of your shipyard.  You building parts with industry is using ground facilities and labor to make parts that would normally be made in the shipyard.

[Micro102]

Yes.... I want to a build a habitat with ground forces? I build a habitat. I want to build an active sensor? I build an active sensor. It seems the problem people have with this is that the habitat is just bigger. Which seems arbitrary as hell to me.