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[Flying Dice]

People actually let their JGCs operate automatically? I'd be living in permanent fear that the stupid buggers would build links from infested systems to my core worlds.

They tend to do that, a lot. Just let em die there instead of getting then back and the enemy wont  (usually)

The thing is, I usually don't have the yard space (too busy building terraformers) or resources (too busy building goddamn everything) to replace JGCs as if they were 1kton survey ships. With careful management, I can usually get a linked network of 50+ systems with only the original one or two.

Plus, I don't want the swarm getting their tentacles into 150kton+ sized wrecks, as I'm not sure if the total tonnage of a wreck affects how much it helps them expand, but I'm working off the assumption that it does.

[LoSboccacc]

for automated and independent gate builders, I use small gates construction modules, as time is not an issue. still costly, but manageable.

but one can send a 1k scout ship to make sure the ship is safe

[LostCosmonaut]

I usually only build a gate to a system in one of two situations:

I need to get to a colony, and all the systems along the way have at least a gravitational survey.

Or,
I need to get my non-jump-capable military into a system.
Situation #2 can result in fun, so I always make sure I have a spare constructor parked at earth.

In other news, in a game with real stars off, I just found a system with a class O5-Ia primary. Mass of 56 and luminosity of 1350000. Not even going to attempt surveying that system.

[Flying Dice]

True: If I ever got around to researching SJGCMs, I'd send out those on automated missions, but as it stands I'm too busy obsoleting my warships before they've finished construction. Also, just finished upgrading a light cruiser that had a maint. clock of 22 years, and it is already close to three years behind the cutting edge of research.


There is also the matter of me liking to prioritize key systems, which autobuild doesn't do.

I need to get my non-jump-capable military into a system.
Situation #2 can result in fun, so I always make sure I have a spare constructor parked at earth.

You only need to build a gate on the nearside point before sending your task group in. Either they win, in which case you can bring your JGC in and start building, or they die horribly, and the farside point is still ungated and your JGC can move on to other things.

[Sheb]

Except I like RPing me not knowing what happen behing ungated JP.

[forsaken1111]

Am I the only one who makes hugemassive ridiculous combat carriers which can refuel themselves from sorium giants, carry cargo, and build their own jumpgates?


...Hell I had one variant which could house 5 million people, carried that many people in cryostasis, and carried 10k infrastructure. It had some terraforming modules as well.

It would build a JG, transit a system, wipe out the natives and colonize. Once the colony built up enough, it would pick up 5 million and move on. It was the slow march of eons.

That was in my cheaty mccheatface game though where I started with supertech. Everything else was legit though. (Roleplayed as the last survivors of an ancient race, etc etc)

[Hanzoku]

Nooo... mostly because I start from conventional starts and tend to lose interest or go to the next version before getting the ~200 years into game it would take me to legitimately build something like that. And then, of course, making sure maintenance is turned off.

[Mickey Blue]

I start with conventional as well and do not generally get that far either, though part of it is just the unwillingness to build and move on, instead constantly refitting my ships to make them more efficient and better.  I'd make a good borg really..

Wow.. I thought my last game was bad, this one the earth also has very few resources and the only other planet in the solar system that has any any minerals at all is Mercury.

[forsaken1111]

I start with conventional as well and do not generally get that far either, though part of it is just the unwillingness to build and move on, instead constantly refitting my ships to make them more efficient and better.  I'd make a good borg really..

Wow.. I thought my last game was bad, this one the earth also has very few resources and the only other planet in the solar system that has any any minerals at all is Mercury.

I don't see the problem. You have minerals on a planet of molten rock and mountains. It's a properly dwarven planet and you'd do well to drop a ton of automated mines on it and stop complaining!

[Mickey Blue]

Heh, they are in production as we speak, since my post I've also found some minerals on a half dozen asteroids and on a few moons in the far reaches of the solar system.

[forsaken1111]

Good man.

I've got to start a new game of this sometime...


but skyrim... and anno 2070... agh

[LoSboccacc]

10171 word and counting.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/13152hgyUxjrjqLmAJpxXiiB3Oy7D-RiO4LsjpxQticw/edit?hl=en_US

jump point survey, automated mines, scout ships, passive sensors, more automation, waiting for stuff, designing for size and such
(but writing halted just before getting to the interesting part, missiles and combat!)

If someone is using this and find some passage obscure or has some doubt or something let me know and I'll do what I can to fix up the tutorial.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

grammar nazis are welcome too

[Flying Dice]

I usually don't even begin considering that sort of effort until I'm at around the mid-AM stage of power and propulsion.


Kinda strange in this latest game: almost my entire military force consists of FACs. I've got a quartet of frigates that are close to a decade out of date, a pair of heavy cruisers that have been stuck in a system for close to 15 years while my JGC is refitted (and which are practically falling apart), and 22 FACs (8 MII, 14 MI). Of course, I'm screwed if anything serious shows up, as those were mainly built to keep the colonists from screaming while I waited twenty years to get decent missile and sensor researchers. I mean damn, I'm 24 years in, I'm still at AS strength-36, but I have internal confinement drives.

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Templar II class Frigate    10,200 tons     1080 Crew     2128.6 BP      TCS 204  TH 1056  EM 0
5176 km/s     Armour 3-41     Shields 0-0     Sensors 80/1/0/0     Damage Control Rating 15     PPV 49.2
Maint Life 2.49 Years     MSP 652    AFR 166%    IFR 2.3%    1YR 146    5YR 2192    Max Repair 280 MSP

Magneto-plasma Drive E7.2 (12)    Power 88    Fuel Use 72%    Signature 88    Armour 0    Exp 10%
Fuel Capacity 400,000 Litres    Range 98.0 billion km   (219 days at full power)

Twin 15cm C5 Ultraviolet Laser Turret (2x2)    Range 192,000km     TS: 10000 km/s     Power 12-10     RM 4    ROF 10        6 6 6 6 4 4 3 3 2 2
Quad 10cm C3 Ultraviolet Laser Turret (2x4)    Range 120,000km     TS: 10000 km/s     Power 12-12     RM 4    ROF 5        3 3 3 3 2 2 1 1 1 1
Fire Control S16 96-12000 (1)    Max Range: 192,000 km   TS: 12000 km/s     95 90 84 79 74 69 64 58 53 48
Fire Control S12 72-12000 (1)    Max Range: 144,000 km   TS: 12000 km/s     93 86 79 72 65 58 51 44 37 31
Stellarator Fusion Reactor Technology PB-1 (1)     Total Power Output 48    Armour 0    Exp 5%

Active Search Sensor MR100-R20 (1)     GPS 5600     Range 100.2m km    Resolution 20
Active Search Sensor MR2-R1 (1)     GPS 28     Range 2.2m km    Resolution 1
Thermal Sensor TH10-80 (1)     Sensitivity 80     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  80m km

This design is classed as a Military Vessel for maintenance purposes


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Templar III class Frigate    5,750 tons     570 Crew     1649.7 BP      TCS 115  TH 1150  EM 360
10000 km/s     Armour 3-28     Shields 12-300     Sensors 48/1/0/0     Damage Control Rating 2     PPV 16
Maint Life 2.34 Years     MSP 359    AFR 132%    IFR 1.8%    1YR 90    5YR 1343    Max Repair 173 MSP

Internal Confinement Fusion Drive E6.5 (10)    Power 115    Fuel Use 65%    Signature 115    Armour 0    Exp 12%
Fuel Capacity 230,000 Litres    Range 110.8 billion km   (128 days at full power)
Delta R300/12.5 Shields (5)   Total Fuel Cost  63 Litres per day

20cm C1.5 Far Ultraviolet Laser (4)    Range 256,000km     TS: 10000 km/s     Power 10-1.5     RM 5    ROF 35        10 10 10 10 10 8 7 6 5 5
Fire Control S12 128-9000 (1)    Max Range: 256,000 km   TS: 9000 km/s     96 92 88 84 80 77 73 69 65 61
Tokamak Fusion Reactor Technology PB-1 (2)     Total Power Output 8    Armour 0    Exp 5%

Active Search Sensor MR15-R1 (1)     GPS 144     Range 15.8m km    Resolution 1
Active Search Sensor MR100-R40 (1)     GPS 5760     Range 100.2m km    Resolution 40
Thermal Sensor TH6-48 (1)     Sensitivity 48     Detect Sig Strength 1000:  48m km

This design is classed as a Military Vessel for maintenance purposes



Lesson learned. Screw PD, build 'em fast and expendable.

[LoSboccacc]

staged vs non staged comparison, on early tech (aiming to 100km range, 4 point of damage).

single stage solution

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Missile Size: 4 MSP  (0.2 HS)     Warhead: 4    Armour: 0     Manoeuvre Rating: 10
Speed: 18400 km/s    Endurance: 91 minutes   Range: 100.0m km
Cost Per Missile: 2.225
Chance to Hit: 1k km/s 184%   3k km/s 60%   5k km/s 36.8%   10k km/s 18.4%
Materials Required:    1x Tritanium   0.975x Gallicite   Fuel x4437.5

Development Cost for Project: 222RP

multi stage solution:

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Payload:
Missile Size: 2 MSP  (0.1 HS)     Warhead: 4    Armour: 0     Manoeuvre Rating: 10
Speed: 27100 km/s    Endurance: 7 minutes   Range: 10.7m km
Cost Per Missile: 1.905
Chance to Hit: 1k km/s 271%   3k km/s 90%   5k km/s 54.2%   10k km/s 27.1%
Materials Required:    1x Tritanium   0.655x Gallicite   Fuel x237.5

Development Cost for Project: 190RP

Missile Size: 4 MSP  (0.2 HS)     Warhead: 0    Armour: 0     Manoeuvre Rating: 10
Speed: 4700 km/s    Endurance: 335 minutes   Range: 94.5m km
Cost Per Missile: 2.2645
Second Stage: Size 2 Anti-ship Missile x1
Second Stage Separation Range: 10,000,000 km
Overall Endurance: 6 hours   Overall Range: 100.0m km
Chance to Hit: 1k km/s 47%   3k km/s 10%   5k km/s 9.4%   10k km/s 4.7%
Materials Required:    1x Tritanium   0.7645x Gallicite   Fuel x4213.75


the multi stage has almost a 50% faster strike speed, but it takes 6 hours for each missile to reach its target (compared to the 91 minutes of the single stage solution) also, the two stage missile has a very slow first stage, meaning that if the enemy is not closing up there is a greater chance of him escaping the attack.

the 10km separation stage puts the missile separation quite beyond the range of conventional anti missile launchers. Note that if a pd fires at the combined missile and the payload detaches before the AMM hit the first stage, then you have halved enemy amm effectiveness.

however, the separation range could be reduced to make the payload faster at the expense of first stage speed or to make the payload lighter to increase the first stage speed. in this case:

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Missile Size: 1.86 MSP  (0.093 HS)     Warhead: 4    Armour: 0     Manoeuvre Rating: 10
Speed: 27400 km/s    Endurance: 1 minutes   Range: 1.2m km
Cost Per Missile: 1.85
Chance to Hit: 1k km/s 274%   3k km/s 90%   5k km/s 54.8%   10k km/s 27.4%
Materials Required:    1x Tritanium   0.6x Gallicite   Fuel x25

Development Cost for Project: 185RP


Missile Size: 4 MSP  (0.2 HS)     Warhead: 0    Armour: 0     Manoeuvre Rating: 10
Speed: 5900 km/s    Endurance: 279 minutes   Range: 98.8m km
Cost Per Missile: 2.2415
Second Stage: Size 1.86 Anti-ship Missile x1
Second Stage Separation Range: 1,000,000 km
Overall Endurance: 5 hours   Overall Range: 100.0m km
Chance to Hit: 1k km/s 59%   3k km/s 10%   5k km/s 11.8%   10k km/s 5.9%
Materials Required:    1x Tritanium   0.7415x Gallicite   Fuel x4371.25


in this case it requires 'just' 4.5 hours to strike the target, but runs a greater risk of getting intercepted by pd.

[Flying Dice]

I swear, I'm addicted to building FACs now for some reason. With the first run of Midgards, I've upped the numbers to 34, and I've got another 12 Midgards due in 6mo from the Earth shipyards, as well as a smaller detachment of 4 due in 6.5mo from the New Pacifica yards. And these are all EW-based; I haven't even started drawing up the plans for box launcher types.

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Midgard class Fast Attack Craft    1,000 tons     97 Crew     275.5 BP      TCS 20  TH 230  EM 0
11500 km/s     Armour 2-8     Shields 0-0     Sensors 1/1/0/0     Damage Control Rating 0     PPV 2
Maint Life 1.73 Years     MSP 43    AFR 32%    IFR 0.4%    1YR 17    5YR 261    Max Repair 115 MSP

GB Internal Confinement Fusion Drive E65 (1)    Power 230    Fuel Use 650%    Signature 230    Armour 0    Exp 36%
Fuel Capacity 130,000 Litres    Range 36.0 billion km   (36 days at full power)

10cm C1.5 Far Ultraviolet Laser (1)    Range 128,000km     TS: 11500 km/s     Power 3-1.5     RM 5    ROF 10        3 3 3 3 3 2 2 1 1 1
Fire Control S08 64-12000 (1)    Max Range: 128,000 km   TS: 12000 km/s     92 84 77 69 61 53 45 37 30 22
Tokamak Fusion Reactor Technology PB-1 (1)     Total Power Output 1.6    Armour 0    Exp 5%

This design is classed as a Military Vessel for maintenance purposes

I just opened a nice three-star system with a close-orbiting C component and four habitable worlds, one 0.00, two 2.00, and one 3.75. Here's hoping they aren't inhabited. Not likely that they're empty, as I play with 60% chance of NPR.