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Author Topic: Aurora - The Dwarf Fortress of 4X Games  (Read 2762715 times)

Shooer

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Re: Aurora - The Dwarf Fortress of 4X Games
« Reply #20115 on: August 16, 2022, 06:03:02 pm »

Any new update of Aurora that requires the database is a wipe.
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Lord Shonus

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Re: Aurora - The Dwarf Fortress of 4X Games
« Reply #20116 on: August 16, 2022, 06:31:19 pm »

Yeah, everything with a DB in this list would break compatibility. So Steve held out until he had a bunch of them.

Quote
   
Fixes

    Fixed mineral costs of terraforming installation and repair yard (DB).
    Fixed starting temperature on Luna so that water is not liquid (DB).
    Fixed power plant description text on Research tab of Economics window (DB)
    Fixed display of size for miscellaneous components (DB)
    Small Craft Refuelling System given correct name and better description (DB).
    Only one refuelling system may now be added to a class design (DB).
    Fixed a bug that is causing NPR ships to move at 1 km/s after running out of fuel (they should move to refuel instead).
    Fixed incorrect popup after using Leave Overhaul - display issue only.
    Leave Overhaul now works for fleets as well as individual ships.
    You can now scrap fractions of installations.

Changes

    Added a new class naming theme that names every ship after the class without a numeric suffix (DB).

None of the DB issues were game breaking, but several of them were quite annoying.
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forsaken1111

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Re: Aurora - The Dwarf Fortress of 4X Games
« Reply #20117 on: August 17, 2022, 12:12:43 pm »

As someone who hasn't played Aurora since one of the earlier VB versions, has not touched C# version, and does not have the patience to go through the massive changelogs...

I'm diving into C# today. Anything big I should know or look out for, or can I mostly proceed as I used to and feel out the changes?
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Rince Wind

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Re: Aurora - The Dwarf Fortress of 4X Games
« Reply #20118 on: August 17, 2022, 04:12:34 pm »

Ground troops are a lot more granular these days.
Another big one is that ships don't use minerals as supply when in orbit anymore, but maintenance supplies which only need duranium, gallicite and uridium, the same MSP that the ships carry around with them to repair stuff that breaks. And things will break if you go into combat because there is a small chance of a weapon malfunction each time you fire. If MSP are at hand they will be used automatically to repair the damage without slowing the fire rate down.

I would say just go in, and if something comes up someone has compiled a neat index of the changes. You can just try to find the topic in question: http://aurora2.pentarch.org/index.php?topic=10666.0
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Lord Shonus

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Re: Aurora - The Dwarf Fortress of 4X Games
« Reply #20119 on: August 17, 2022, 10:10:20 pm »

Big important change from VB is that you have to manually save, instead of everything being written every time you advance time. It prompts you to save when quitting, but still good to keep in mind.
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Vivalas

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Re: Aurora - The Dwarf Fortress of 4X Games
« Reply #20120 on: August 18, 2022, 03:10:00 pm »

As someone who hasn't played Aurora since one of the earlier VB versions, has not touched C# version, and does not have the patience to go through the massive changelogs...

I'm diving into C# today. Anything big I should know or look out for, or can I mostly proceed as I used to and feel out the changes?

Oh boy, there's a lot, but a lot of it is also small changes that just make the game better, QOL and stuff. In terms of things you actually need to know, er..

Someone already touched on maintenance, but maintenance is also very different in terms of how capacity works. VB6 had this strange mechanic where your maintenance facilities increased the "max ship size" that could be maintained, but you could have as many ships as you wanted below this. That and fighters weren't serviced by maintenance facilities, as a sort of balance against just fighter spam to take advantage of that.

Now maintenance is by total ship tonnage at a location, so it's not just how big your ships are but how many of them you have. As a consequence, fighters are also maintained now since fighter spam will eat into that capacity.

Admin commands change things up a lot too. You used to be able to describe a hierarchy for your navy but this was more for RP or fighter organization than anything. Now we have actual admin commands that you use to structure and group your navies. They replace fleets and are different in the sense that you don't have like, 8 staff officers per fleet, but rather just one commander and the staff officers are abstracted (although that would be cool to see again). Admirals and such give their bonuses through admin commands, which are augmented depending on what kind of admin command it is, and you can nest multiple admin commands to get multiple bonuses from flag officers (although with very diminishing returns).

Er.. there's some big QOL stuff with being able to double click locations now to get the most common order for that (e.g, double click a planet to get a move order). PDCs are a thing of the past and are integrated with ground-force design, and you build units call STOs instead (surface-to-orbital guns). There's also some cool stuff with fighters and loadin/unloading mechanics where ships below 1000 size can land on planets and don't need shuttle bays or spaceports, and there's a whole class of weapons for fighters now that you can use to turn fighters into pure ground support units, but you can also use space fighters, they're just less efficient and less specialized for the task.

Lots of cool stuff, but it mostly just feels like Aurora but better. And faster. There's a thread with a full directory of changes, it's pretty long but is good for some reading material if you get bored.
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forsaken1111

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Re: Aurora - The Dwarf Fortress of 4X Games
« Reply #20121 on: August 19, 2022, 05:33:19 am »

Thanks all! I poked around a bit in a test game and yeah I can see some significant differences. I'll keep futzing around before I start a real game.
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Crashmaster

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Re: Aurora - The Dwarf Fortress of 4X Games
« Reply #20122 on: August 21, 2022, 05:51:27 pm »

Refueling ships and transfering fuel or ordanance is very different.

I'm not even sure if MSP can be transferred between ships any more other than to landed parasite craft.

EuchreJack

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Re: Aurora - The Dwarf Fortress of 4X Games
« Reply #20123 on: August 22, 2022, 01:16:56 am »

Refueling ships and transfering fuel or ordanance is very different.

I'm not even sure if MSP can be transferred between ships any more other than to landed parasite craft.

Maintenance is supposed to be possible, although I also am unsure if ships can directly transfer MSP.
http://aurorawiki.pentarch.org/index.php?title=Ship_Maintenance

Rince Wind

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Re: Aurora - The Dwarf Fortress of 4X Games
« Reply #20124 on: August 22, 2022, 03:44:03 am »

I am pretty sure Stephen had supply ships to top off MSP in one of his last AARs.
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Culise

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Re: Aurora - The Dwarf Fortress of 4X Games
« Reply #20125 on: August 24, 2022, 12:42:58 am »

It is.  You shouldn't need special equipment to transfer MSP, which as indicated differs from fuel (Refueling System) and ordinance (Ordinance Transfer System).  I assume MSP is stored and transshipped like bulk cargo or passengers, which benefit from cargo shuttle bays but doesn't require anything except a place to physically contain it.  However, you do still need to designate your ship as a "Supply Ship" using the checkboxes on the right side of the Class Design screen.  When you use the Naval Organization screen to issue orders to a fleet that requires MSP, target the fleet containing one or more supply ships for an action in the first column, and the second column should now include the order "Resupply from Stationary Supply Ship".  Conversely, by using the fleet with an supply ship, you can select the ship you with to resupply and use any of the options that include resupply.  These orders are available in addition to the automatic use of MSP mentioned in the wiki article linked and will allow you to manually top off ships. 
« Last Edit: August 24, 2022, 12:47:15 am by Culise »
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Flying Dice

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Re: Aurora - The Dwarf Fortress of 4X Games
« Reply #20126 on: August 27, 2022, 07:48:39 pm »

Well there's plenty games that do the big picture thing. There's very few games where the design of your ship matters critically, and even less that have a logistical layer on top, and if I had the patience to wait for aurora turns I'd love to engage with that concept.

Wheter it makes sense to bake it in a full 4x idk.
This, pretty much. Every other 4X out there treats ship design as an afterthought that ranges from full automation to simplistic rock-paper-scissors hardpoint systems at the very most, mated to "smash stacks into each other, bigger number wins" combat.

Aurora is the only place I can get this experience, both in terms of granularity and RP potential.

Yeah, Aurora has always been the sort of game where conceptually it's interesting and I like a good deal of the mechanics, but I wish it were more open and I could just... add the things that I want to it, rather than being so constrained.
Yeah, can agree with that. I generally give up once I get to the "Designing military" bit of it. Just find the whole process takes the complexity over the edge into tedium.

Hell, a ship and component designs automator would make it a lot better for me.
Play with SM mode on and instant your component designs, it almost entirely eliminates the tedious part of the design process not having to stop what you're doing and progress time for a few weeks only to realize that your calculations were off and you need to redesign six things.
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Rince Wind

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Re: Aurora - The Dwarf Fortress of 4X Games
« Reply #20127 on: August 28, 2022, 04:28:37 am »

You can also use prototypes. If the design is sound you can send it to the labs from the ship design screen, if not, obsolete the component.
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Culise

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Re: Aurora - The Dwarf Fortress of 4X Games
« Reply #20128 on: August 30, 2022, 11:29:11 pm »

Also, if you push a prototyped component to your research screen and then click "Delete Tech" there, you can remove it entirely so it doesn't clutter up your list of obsolete components.
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MrWiggles

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Re: Aurora - The Dwarf Fortress of 4X Games
« Reply #20129 on: September 05, 2022, 03:21:36 pm »

Could I use Aurora as a world building tool to just gen up solar systems?
I should be able to just look at them with space master stuff right?
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