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[schnobs]

Well, watching the development of my most recent fortress and the trouble of obtaining enough timber even on a woodland map, I really start to wonder how one is supposed to get a proper smithery operation underway without magma.

Sure, if there is no other choice I will wing it... somehow... but I don't like the prospect, not at all.

There has already been talk about giving players prior knowledge. As an alternative, I submit that the materiél requirements might be recast: one tree might well yield two units of charcoal; or it might be possible to melt several lumps of ore with one unit of coal.

This wouldn't need to be the same for all ores, though. It could be possible to make quite a lot of copper and bronze early on, but dealing in iron would require much more fuel (and hence also a much larger workforce and infrastructure to drive it).

[Chthon]

I put forth that charcoal/coke is put into a reserve at each forge that operates kinda like melting objects does.  Part of the reserve is used every time an object is created depending on the amount of metal required and type of metal it takes to make an object.  For example, platinum is hard to work, it might take a full bar of charcoal and half of another to work a single bar of platinum.  Silver though is easy.  Maybe just .2 or .3 a bar.

Another benefit to this is fewer long treks to retrieve one kind of semi universally needed material.  In fact, haulers could be used to fill up a forge/furnace's supply without bothering the smith with such menial tasks.

For gameplay purposes, I propose that no more than 5 bars be stored at any one time.  This is to prevent the workshop from being cluttered with just coal.  In this fashion, it'll be a little easier to set up a smithing operation early on, but still encourage you to use the magma river later when you find better metals.

[Axle Gear]

Actually, knowing how charcoal is made IRL, i'd say it should really be more like 2 wood = 1 charcoal.

It's a really lossy process.

Although who'da thunk that /burned wood/ would burn good?

(More accurately it doesn't burn as much as smolder.  Higher carbon content and some reaction with yadda yadda blah chemistry crap causes the fire to burn hotter.)

[Captain Mayday]

You're assuming that 1 unit of charcoal weighs the same as 1 unit of wood.

[Momaw]

I thought it might be more realistic that you fuel the forge for a <timespan> rather than a <job>.

In the real world, a forge was kept warm all the time that it might be used.  It took a fairly long time to bring a cold forge back up to metal-working temperatures. At the end of the work day, you toss in a bit of fuel and than rake the coals over, so that it's still smoldering away inside.

A game translation might be that a forge has a toggle,  "Active" versus "Inactive".  When you Activate a forge, it shows how much fuel will be needed to run this forge for one season.  Probably in the neighborhood of 10 bars of charcoal/coke. Once the fuel has been delivered, the forge will be hot for one season, and you can do as much forging as you want while the forge is hot. Near the end of the season, more fuel must be delivered to keep it going seamlessly. Or you can set it to Inactive, in which case it will be allowed to go cold.

So, just like reality, it only makes sense to get your smithy going if you've got a pile of work that needs doing, and somebody available to do it.

[Markavian]

I think thats a terrible idea:
Imagine, dwarf stokes up furnace: then gets hungry/thirsty, wanders off and nothing gets made for x-amount of time... and then you've lost material.

I think in practice, the furnace is only hot for a short period of time while melting metal, larger quantities need more fuel. The current system symbolises this well. I have no problem with fuel input into construction process, and its more reliable/predictable which is important for new players and makes things easier to explain.

E.g. "Why does the charcoal keep disspearing when I try to make a platinum bar?"

I prefer Chthon's suggestion of 'stocking up a reserve' in a forge. Say each piece of charcoal fuels a forge for 2 or 3 uses?

[JT]

Yeah, fueling a smelter or smithy in advance would be an awesome feature.