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[GlyphGryph]

Generally, I play with magic settings in fantasy games whereas all magic, ever, anywhere, is alive - its a bit like fey/fell moods. You can use the magic in such a way so as to allow you to create an artifact, but the spirits that answer your call are the ones that end up deciding what happens as a result, especially if you give them access to your mind. You don't really know if you just asked the elven volcanic nature god for help, or if it was just some demon pretending to be the elven volcano god. Either way your fireball might go off, but maybe you agreed to more than you bargained for and you can't get it to stop...

 Magical artifacts, of course, are always alive and always have their own desires, seldom in line with those that want to use them.

Now, we don't really know how DF is going to implement magic yet, but thats the sort of system I'd really like to see. Something where magic is powerful, but you can't trust it - its not reliable, its not consistant, and something you generally stay away from unless you really absolutely need it, because its not a matter of if, its a matter of WHEN you are gonna get burned.

That said, I'm not sure DF needs an RPG anything like it mechanically, its a pretty righ setting for any fantasy style RPG though.

[Omegastick]

May I say that a simple modification on the Inquisitor rules would work brilliantly, all you would need to do is recreate the armory for a medievil setting and introduce wrestling. It uses d100s and has a body part damage system. I think it could be perfect.

[Deathbane]

Im using some rules inspired off inquisitor, especially the damage system. However, the problem with inquisitor was that i was never designed to be a true rpg like warhammer or DnD. As such its rules mostly revolve around combat, and little else. Even when playing inquisitor, it got rather amusing how a tech adept with sagacity of 80 plus could easily beat most hardlocked doors along with software AND be also a mechanical genius, able to solve almost any puzzle that required such a check. The skill system doesnt allow the kind of intricay that say, traveller does.

I have the outline for the main system and im typing it now. Dont know how im going to balance basic templates for characters yet, but ill have the main do it yourself generator for people to play about with soon. And tear it to pieces for all the holes within the system! haha.

[monk12]

I haven't played Inquisitor, so sadly I cannot comment on that.

If I were to do this, though, I'd likely start with a base of the DnD d20 system. To that, I'd add the Wounds/Vitality system of damage. If you are not familiar, it basically has a pool of Vitality points gained the way regular hp's are, and a pool of Wounds points equal to your Con score. Vitality points are lost first. The conceit is that when you lose vitality points, you are not taking damage. Rather, they represent your ability to roll with the punches. Losing Vitality is roughly equivalent to taking minor cuts, bruises, or just being knocked off balance.

When you run out of Vitality points, damage goes to Wounds. Wounds represents actual physical damage. Taking any wounds at all gives you various penalties, and extra rules and tables exist for this damage to be represented as damage to a specific limb, with unique penalties for each. That's how I'd do the damage differences.

The other major problem would be Wrestling/Grapple rules. Wrestling is a big skill in DF, and I don't particularly like the way its handled in any system I've played. Even DF is complicated, it just gets noticed less because the computer does all the math and opposed checks and such for you.

Those are the two major problems with porting DF to a pen and paper RPG, as I see it. The rest is largely setting and flavor. Make Carp feared creatures of the night, Kittens tasty meals, and Elves douchebags... oh wait, they already are.

Last note, I'd hold off on implementing a magic system until you know how Toady himself is going to handle it.

[Kilo24]

If I were to do this, though, I'd likely start with a base of the DnD d20 system. To that, I'd add the Wounds/Vitality system of damage.

Eh, I haven't been impressed by the d20 system overly much; it doesn't do anything particularly well save for serve as a generic base for a system.  I'd sooner just do a system from scratch, honestly - it'll fit better and involve less work to get the feel tweaked to DF-style.

Vitality/Wounds are better than standard hit points, but still not deep enough to model one of the most defining aspects of DF: the wounds system.  I'd probably go for a location-based system that measures each wound as a separate occurrence, and have major wounds persist for long periods of time but small wounds heal quickly.  Either a table or a really clever damage system heavily affected by weapon type would determine the severity and the nature of the wounds dealt.

The major other things that characterize the game (aside from cats, carp, highly lethal throwing, and elephants) is the depth of simulation in a number of areas.  A DM will have problems matching this.

I personally don't think that Dwarf Fortress has distinct enough lore at this point to warrant a full-scale role-playing game.  But I wish you luck in whipping one up.

[Vester]

Im using some rules inspired off inquisitor, especially the damage system. However, the problem with inquisitor was that i was never designed to be a true rpg like warhammer or DnD. As such its rules mostly revolve around combat, and little else. Even when playing inquisitor, it got rather amusing how a tech adept with sagacity of 80 plus could easily beat most hardlocked doors along with software AND be also a mechanical genius, able to solve almost any puzzle that required such a check. The skill system doesnt allow the kind of intricay that say, traveller does.

I have the outline for the main system and im typing it now. Dont know how im going to balance basic templates for characters yet, but ill have the main do it yourself generator for people to play about with soon. And tear it to pieces for all the holes within the system! haha.

Dark Heresy, I think, has a ruleset that could be adapted for your purposes. At least in terms of combat.

[Omegastick]

One more thing, on the topic of wrestling. Wrestling would be hell to implement, but maybe something like a section on the character sheet for keeping track of wrestling would be good. And  from there it would be like normal combat.
eg. Player A grabs Player B's right shoulder. It is jotted down on the sheet. Player A Puts Player B's right shoulder in a joint lock, marked on sheet. Player A cripples Player B's shoulder, crippling damage is applied on sheet.
End result:
_______________________________________________
Grabs                                   | Body Parts              |
------------------------------------------------------
A r hand =J lock= B r shoulder  | r shoulder C
                                          |

It could capture the essence of wrestling perfectly.

[Dwarf]

I think a dirty, early middle age RPG (a bit Unreal World-esque?) would be a nice break from all this high middle ages high fantasy BS. Namely, gameplay should be skill based, whilst equipment is scarce and expensive, as in: You can't buy a hauberk at every ride-in shop, and if you find a vendor, he wants a shitload for it. Swords aren't everyday weapons, and, actually, there should maybe only be few weapons. Maybe your average axe, then a bearded axe with some bonus, and so on. But certainly no 'Battleaxe of the Twelfth Bay +12 with freezing and fire damage', actually, I think magic could be left out alltogether, in exclusion of maybe 'druids' who use plants to heal certain wounds (which is THOUGHT to be magic). And combat should always be well-thought and of last resort, because damage would actually mean something, not to be shrugged off with a potion, but crippling and probably infectious without proper care.

[Deathbane]

That sounds exactly the feel im trying to go for dwarf! I have settled on using a damage system like inquisitor - i quite like it, and its the one ive used the most.

Im not a fan of the d20 system, and i dont know why. Probably only because im unfamiliar with it, as DnD is probably my least played.

The system you guessted omega is a valiant effort but far too complex - ill be abstraction wrestling to opposed rolls that directly injure limbs rather than overall BP, and to directly inflict critical or mortal wounds.

Like somebody said, id prefer a new system that is inspired by others - no doubt theyll be challenges ahead, but itll be good to try it out and see what works and doesnt, and through revision im sure we ll get a pretty slick system.

Anyhows, ive been writing a summary of all the parts that make up an adventurer character.. so far. I havnt finished this and its heavily work in progress, but this is what i have so far:


++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

General Information

Name:  The name of the players’ character. While usually something created using either the dwarf fortress games name generator or the selection supplied with adventurer, the player is free to choose any name he likes for his character. Remember it is you, your fellow players and GM who will have to put up with badly named character! Maybe naming your knight Bob wasn’t such a good idea after all…

Age: The age of the players character. Depending on age, the character is likely to be more proficient in one area than another. Older characters are more likely to be physically weak, but have higher skills and more calculating personalities.

Gender: Self-explanatory. Is your character male or female?

Race: The race of your character. The main four races are Human, Dwarf, Elf and Goblin, but rules for half races and beastmen do exist if you wish to play such a character and the games master agrees.

Civilisation: The civilisation your character hails from. This will be important in deciding what gear is obtainable , the skills available to you and also affects your personality. The civilisations open to you will be dependant on what campaign your gamesmaster is running.

Social Standing: The social standing of your character. Is usually randomly selected in character generation, or by a character template, but it is up to the gamesmaster to decide what is acceptable. The higher your social standing, the more likely you are to have access to a better resource network from the beginning.

Physical and Mental Characteristics

Attributes: The main physical attributes of a character. There are three main attributes, Strength, Toughness and Agility. These are used in a lot of skill tests and extensively in battles.  They also determine how much damage a character can take, how many actions they can take, as well as how much damage they deal unarmed.

Personality: The characters personality. These are usually used in place of attributes for tests that involve mental or ethical elements to them. They can also be used by the GM to see how a character, if forced by a player to do something against their nature or forced to fight a terrible foe, will react. It is also important in the magic system. 

Skills: The skills that the players character has learned, or is learning – these determine the individuals characters proficiency in a specific area, how good he or she is at sword fighting for example. Skills are highly important, as unlike Attributes, contested rolls are highly dependant on the differences between skills levels. Not only that, but without any training, characters might not be able to perform a certain task at all!

Health and Condition

Bloodpoints: The overall health of a character. This is calculated by Toughness doubled, multiplied by 10. If this is over reduced to 0 the character is dead.

Consciousness rating: The level at which a character will have to fight unconsciousness from pain or bloodloss. This is equal to half the bloodpoints of the character. The character will have to take test against toughness to see if he passes out if damaged again and below this threshold.

Damage Threshold: The amount of damage a limb can soak without having to deteriorate. This is equal to strength + toughness. If an attack does greater damage than this, the limbs condition worsens.

Limb Condition: The limbs of the adventurer, usually head, arms, legs and body for humanoid creatures. Each has a condition from Healthy, Bruised, Injured, Broken, Mangled and Decapitated/Destroyed.  These are affected by damage that exceeds the damage threshold. Each condition has its own additional impact on the players character.

Other: Other effects are recorded here. These are usually listed critical wounds, mortal wounds, and poison effects.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

This is the first and most important section of the character sheet. The rest is equipment, encumberance and things like that. They ll also be a notes section for other things, such as joining religions and groups, ranks within those groups etc. These wont have their own sections as then we would have a crazy complicated character sheet.

Herbalism and alchemy will be in, and so will powerful artifacts, which are especially dwarfy, which will be tied to power entities that ask alot in return for their favours.

There wont be a +1 longsword ssytem, but it will instead use a simplified crafting quality and material system like df uses.

[Deathbane]

Alright guys, back with an  update on the next part of the character summary. I need your help with something after the text dump.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Personal Equipment

Weapons: A summary of all weapons that a character owns.

Armour and Clothing: A summary of all pieces of armour and clothing that a character owns.

Ammunition: A summary of all the thrown or fired ammunition a character can possess.
 
Money and Valuables: A summary of all items of direct monetary worth, such as coins, gems etc.

Miscellaneous:  A summary of all the other bits of equipment an adventurer will possess, such as camp equipment, lockpicks, gathered herbs, food, waterskins etc.

Transport and Animals: A summary of all the animals the character owns, including mounts and trained pets.

Equipped/In use: What the character currently has on their person, and not just in store somewhere. Mounts and other items in use are listed here, but wont add to personal encumbrance.

Encumbrance: How much a character can carry before becoming encumbered. This maximum is worked out the same as a characters bloodpoints. Excess weight will directly affect the characters agility attribute.
 
Allies, Contacts, Enemies and Groups:
 
Groups: The individual groups an adventurer is affiliated with. The first and most important will be the group of adventurers in your campaign! They will all share a common group, that the players can name themselves.

Allies: Allies of the adventurer. These can be characters met in game, or allies created in character generation from social standing. Allies here may be individual allies or allies of the adventuring group; which should be noted down. Allies can be called on in times of need, and will always assist the adventurer/adventuring group if called upon for help.

Contacts: Useful contacts the adventurer has encountered. These can be characters met in game, or contacts created in character generation from social standing. Contacts here may be individual contacts or contacts of the adventuring group; which should be noted down. Contacts can be called on in times of need, and will usually assist the adventurer/adventuring group… for a price. 

Enemies: Enemies the adventurer has made. These can be characters met in game, or enemies created in character generation from social standing. Enemies here may be individual allies or allies of the adventuring group; which should be noted down. Enemies will attempt to thwart the individual adventurer/adventuring group who wronged them whenever a suitable opportunity arises.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Now im just working on the religious part and that should cover most bases. A miscellaneous section will be there for the players to note down anything else thats missed, but if theres anything glaring so far thats off do tell.


Right, what i need help with is a list of extracts from the various creatures. Alot of them will be useful for something or another, also if you could think of uses for the various plants that would be cool.

Basically muse on the herbology, while i busy myself with finishing character gen and game mechanics. Any help would be appreciated.

[lastofthelight]

There arn't any real information-age tabletop rpgs yet.  By that I mean an rpg designed so that the DM and players don't actually have to keep track of their numbers, crunching them when playing, but can still play with each other in tabletop fashion. Probably because there arn't many people who can program and like making tabletop rpgs, but it'd be nice to have an rpg explicitly designed for you to just...play/DM. What I mean is...you'd enter everyone's character sheet into a very, very simple program, and it could be used to spit out combat results with no work or die rolls on your part. I mean, it wouldn't be hard, if I still remembered how to program in c++ I could probably do it.

 I think there's a huge market for such a thing, imagine if you could just play and dungeonmaster and the combat would handle itself. Its the best of having a videogame, and having an actual dungeonmaster.

[Dwarf]

Bloodpoints: The overall health of a character. This is calculated by Strength + Toughness doubled, multiplied by 10. If this is over reduced to 0 the character is dead.

Hmmm... I don't know what toughness is used for else than this and consciousness checks, but if toughness would not have VERY big impact on bloodloss checks, it is pretty useless, since strength brings as much BP as toughness and presumably gives slightly more damage. Maybe 0.5 * STR + 1.5 * TOU would be better?

[Rowanas]

Ignore weight and encumbrance. I've GMed and played in dozens of games and we've never even looked at them. Encumbrance rules only pander to the power gamers, everyone else can easily just decide what's reasonable by common sense. Perhaps if you merely assign a small number to each piece of kit. People are far more likely to pay attention if it's a small, concrete number rather than a vast and irritating mathematical equation.

It pleases me that if you're keeping to DF style play then levels and classes wont even have a chance to exist. I cannot say how joyful I am if this is the case .

I'm not sure how you intend personality to work regarding the use of stats. Are they just going to be a different bunch of stats under a different name, or what?

@Dwarf. toughness will also (presumably) influence pain checks, consciousness, stuff like that. Kinda related to wounds and combat, but not in such a direct manner.

[valcon]

Pardon me but, in my opinion, Dwarf Fortress already is a roleplaying game, in the purest sense of the term.  You, as the player, can truly play the game however you wish, and behave in any way which fits the character, or, role, you wish, in a FAR more detailed manner than most gamed dubbed "RPGs" by the gaming gods. 

[zwei]

I would really just make module for GURPS. There is no point in making custom ruleset.