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[Phantom]

AK
- Same as above, but can't be used with disguises and can be bought at the black market with gun laws M or above, or was that C or above? anyway I don't think you can get M16's at the black market.

fixed

Problem is, no more Black Market.

[garfield751]

cant you buy them from gang members

[Jonathan S. Fox]

It's true. You can buy AK47s from gang members.

[Neonivek]

It's true. You can buy AK47s from gang members.

Can you buy protection from gang members?

[Jonathan S. Fox]

Unless you mean guns, you can't. What sort of protection do you mean? Hiring thugs? Mafia-style extortion money? I can think of a couple others...

[mainiac]

If gender equality and abortion rights are both at C+, selling brownies should be replaced with selling condoms, which carries the death penalty, but allows juice gains up to 500.

[Neonivek]

Unless you mean guns, you can't. What sort of protection do you mean? Hiring thugs? Mafia-style extortion money? I can think of a couple others...

To be truthful I was being intentionally vague.

I always sort of disliked the passive out of the way nature of the criminal element and found it odd that they were often more supportive of Liberal ideals when for the most part it is those ideas that can put them out of buisness. Also they don't seem to be able to get in trouble themselves, want to sell them more weapons then a military base? Go ahead!

"What was that? Your mass murdering everyone in this organised crime ring? Your lucky we follow the law or else we would GANG up and kill you"

Plus a bunch of other stuff...

Though given that all organised crime rings are destitute for some reason despite being more then capable of buying expencive weaponry off of you... I guess that says something about non-terrorist crime success rates.

[Servant Corps]

But it doesn't put them out of business. Think of how banning drugs ends up increasing the price of drugs, and the profit of drug dealers. Same thing for guns. The demand for guns aren't going to go away in an L+ society, and gangsters are the ones most likely to profit from this demand.

Also, the whole "if you ban guns, only criminals will have guns" line.

[Neonivek]

But it doesn't put them out of business. Think of how banning drugs ends up increasing the price of drugs, and the profit of drug dealers. Same thing for guns. The demand for guns aren't going to go away in an L+ society, and gangsters are the ones most likely to profit from this demand.

Also, the whole "if you ban guns, only criminals will have guns" line.

No I mean LIBERAL laws put them out of buisness... Yet they are highly supportive of you.

[Servant Corps]

Which ones? The drug laws? I guess that it does lower profits for brownies, but that's about it.

The gun laws? As I said, the more liberal laws mean guns are banned, meaning that guns are worth more on the black market, meaning more money.

Lack of a death penalty, regulating police behavior, and having lax prison conditions? I'm sure the Mafia are quaking in their boots.

Maybe those L+ Policemen might cause problems though.

[Neonivek]

Hmm I guess for Drugs.

Also it doesn't "Lower Profits" as it may be it has the dramatic effect of often entirely eliminating HUGE bastions of organised crime.

Those "Brownies" basically become the equivilant of Bakesale cookies. No one is going to REALLY buy them.

[Little]

Most of the criminals I see tend to be Moderate. We've had suggestions for Crime playing a more active role, but none of them have been implemented.

[Jonathan S. Fox]

Hmm I guess for Drugs.

Also it doesn't "Lower Profits" as it may be it has the dramatic effect of often entirely eliminating HUGE bastions of organised crime.

Those "Brownies" basically become the equivilant of Bakesale cookies. No one is going to REALLY buy them.

Organized crime still doesn't care about it, but it's true that L+ drug laws totally suck for your brownies operation. Profits completely dive.

[3]

Here's a (seeming) unintentional effect of moving up from C+ gun control laws: security guards stop using MP5s (which are barely more effective than a pistol - all three shots can be easily resisted with 11 health and clothing) and start using .44s (which can one-shot you). This is potentially a bit of a balance issue, or you could just call it a quirk.

(I thought that was somewhat on-topic)

[Jonathan S. Fox]

You may have just gotten unlucky. The MP5 does do more damage on average than the .44 Magnum if at least two of its shots hit. The only time I can see an issue is if you're wearing body armor. 11 health is going to take any weapon's damage down a few pegs though, that's for sure.